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Old 26th January 2014, 11:01 PM   #61
chosen
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

Raymond has made some good points. Moving in with him (or even living with him for occasional weeks, isn't the way to go. For us as believers, sex outside marriage is always wrong.
If you have ended the relationship, then any further contact will only make it harder in the long term for both of you surely? It may give him false hopes, and it will prevent you from moving on and getting settled into a new life with your son away from him. I am not sure that you can sit on the fence with a relationship like this, its either over or you are both 100% committed.

Is he a Christian?
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Old 26th January 2014, 11:55 PM   #62
verysadlady
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

I would never move in with him, or anyone unless we were married. I am a Christian, but it's not because of this that I would never do it again (I'm not a perfect Christian....sorry) It's because I would need that 100% commitment and security to bring my son into a new home. This experience taught me that bizarre things can happen and being cautious pays.

There are things he needs to unlearn, yes. This is a personal journey for him. He realises this, and this is why he wants to be alone for it. I think he has such a huge buildup of emotional pain that right now he cannot identify the source terribly well. There is a part of him that believes it might be me.

He is Christian, but not practising. He is very respectful of me though, and he is happy to let me read Bible passages to him and explore it with me. I would say he is uncertain. He believes in some things, but others he doesn't know.

I am so glad you made it out of your breakdown...having seen one in action, it is a terrible place to be.
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Old 27th January 2014, 12:03 AM   #63
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

Hi Chosen,

I know having no contact with him would be the best way for me to move on. I am deeply emotionally tied to him.

I am not sure why that feels like the wrong thing to do. Maybe because I know he needs me to keep faith at least in part, or maybe because I don't really want to let go.

He telephoned just now. He's in such a bad place it was very hard for me. He is incapable of really feeling anything or reacting to anything. It's very hard to explain. It's a bit like talking to an emotional zombie. He is not cold or cruel, he is just like a stranger. He doesn't trust his own thoughts or his own mind. He asked if we could please still talk and I said yes.

I know maybe (definitely) this opens me up to more continued hurt, but at the same time it just feels wrong to turn your back on someone you love so much when they are in need. I know he might not need me THERE but he needs to know I'm not gone. Underneath all this I am still the only person he can talk to.

I know he needs to work on that, but while he continues to try and hide his state from everyone it makes it hard.
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Old 27th January 2014, 10:31 AM   #64
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

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I know he needs to work on that, but while he continues to try and hide his state from everyone it makes it hard.
Hi

I can tell that you fell for his "charms" and you are under his spell....

Do you normally go for a bad guy rather than a stable relationship? I wouldn't mean to be harsh.

You know there are several red flags already raised by eminent posters on here.

Your man says his wife did this to him and his wife said this or that to him....Be wary when a man brings up his ex and criticise her in front of a new girlfriend as you would be more likely to be the next one to be in her shoes at some point.

Would you be likely to have sex with him if you were to meet up again? Some men use women for sex suggesting "there might be some future together" etc. Be very wary.

Personally, you ought to focus on your life e.g. work & children in particular. If you do not have a decent life going then it is more likely to end up with a man who offers so little (and a lot of problems) into your life. You sound extremely bright. It may be far better to work on yourself. Best to leave him to a professional therapist for your own good. Just my take on this.

x
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Old 27th January 2014, 10:39 AM   #65
chosen
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

Well you have two choices, end it or carry on in it with all the resulting pain, insecurity and dysfunction. I cant see how there can be any half way house here, your feelings for him wont allow yourself to be just a supportive friend.

I am not sure that I could begin a new settled secure life for myself and my child if I was still hanging on to the possibility that we may need to move and uproot yet again in another year or so if this guy seems to get back on an even keel. Would I even risk that with a child. Not sure.

I hope that he does find God in all this, because he needs to, and God does say that we aren't to marry non believers, so I would hold back for that reason alone in the future. I know many people who have married non Christians and have lived to regret it.

You don't need to be perfect to be a Christian(I am far from perfect believe me), but if we KNOW that God forbids sex outside marriage we would be foolish to do it, and any relationship that is outside of Gods will, is also outside His blessing and protection. Gods ways are always for our own good in the end.

Last edited by chosen; 27th January 2014 at 10:45 AM.
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Old 27th January 2014, 11:02 AM   #66
Raymond
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

VSL you have been kicked out of your home with your children. Although I don't think you should have been living in his home without marriage there is still something very wrong here that I don't think you can put completely down to a breakdown. It was a very callous thing to do. Are you blaming this all on his breakdown because there is a place in you that wants back what you had and perhaps are justifying his actions because of this? It could be like him saying it wasn't me it was the illness. I think you need to open your eyes to this.

It seems that you have seperated yourself in a healthy way but could be drawn back into it all. If you are, make sure that you are not motivated by guilt. Things done out of guilt don't work. No doubt he has great needs but you need to ask yourself whether it should be your role to meet this need. Being need orientated can be a black hole that swallows you up. We have to choose the good things we do. We will usually enjoy it and have some kind of purpose in it but it shouldn't be out of guilt. Because of your emotional involvement I am not so sure you are the right person to meet that need. As Chosen says how can you start a new life if you get involved again? Just my thoughts.
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Old 27th January 2014, 12:13 PM   #67
chosen
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

Raymond is so right. After all if he was ill and didn't want any of his family around, then why couldn't he find somewhere else to live maybe with a friend or family member while you and the children stayed in the home? If he was that bad he maybe even needed to spend a few week in hospital.

You told him it was over, but now you are going back on that and getting dragged in again. I know its hard to cut ties, especially when you have been living together, but what is the alternative except to carry on as you have been all this time (which you said you didn't want).
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Old 27th January 2014, 12:52 PM   #68
verysadlady
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

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Originally Posted by Roses View Post
Hi

I can tell that you fell for his "charms" and you are under his spell....

Do you normally go for a bad guy rather than a stable relationship? I wouldn't mean to be harsh.

You know there are several red flags already raised by eminent posters on here.

Your man says his wife did this to him and his wife said this or that to him....Be wary when a man brings up his ex and criticise her in front of a new girlfriend as you would be more likely to be the next one to be in her shoes at some point.


x
Hi Roses. No, I have never gone for a bad boy in my life. Always a sucker for the nice guy.

As for his ex wife...I have known her since I was 9 years old. Our parents worked for the same company and we were expats and grew up in the same circle of friends that stand today. She is know very much for being difficult and aggressive.

All my opinions of her are formed from what I have seen with my own eyes. He has never, not once, ever criticised her. It's not his style.

More his inability to criticise her being the problem.

No! No chance of sex with him. He is deeply depressed and unwell..this is the last thing he is interested in. Or me obviously
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Old 27th January 2014, 12:59 PM   #69
verysadlady
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

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Well you have two choices, end it or carry on in it with all the resulting pain, insecurity and dysfunction. I cant see how there can be any half way house here, your feelings for him wont allow yourself to be just a supportive friend.

I am not sure that I could begin a new settled secure life for myself and my child if I was still hanging on to the possibility that we may need to move and uproot yet again in another year or so if this guy seems to get back on an even keel. Would I even risk that with a child. Not sure.

I hope that he does find God in all this, because he needs to, and God does say that we aren't to marry non believers, so I would hold back for that reason alone in the future. I know many people who have married non Christians and have lived to regret it.

You don't need to be perfect to be a Christian(I am far from perfect believe me), but if we KNOW that God forbids sex outside marriage we would be foolish to do it, and any relationship that is outside of Gods will, is also outside His blessing and protection. Gods ways are always for our own good in the end.
I agree as always with everything you say. Sometimes knowing the best thing and doing it are not the same thing. I need some sort of time to fully detach, but at least I have taken a step.

One thing to point out is that I would never, ever move back. If he wants (and I still want) to get back together when he is well, he will have to move to ME and marry me.

I decided this with my own therapist, because after what we have been through, he would need to go some way to prove his commitment, and moreover I would not disrupt my child again.

His actions were caused by illness, no question, but he still has consequences.

I mentioned I have know his ex wife since I was 9. I have also known him in a way through her since a young age. We had many of the same friends throughout life. We went to a lot of the same 18th birthday parties. His roommate at boarding school was my boyfriend for 4 years. I was not "friends" closely with him until much later, but I have always known who he was.

He was generally always known as Mr Nice Guy. Never done an impulsive thing in his life. Never done anything mean or nasty before. He has good character.

His commitment was lacking. He had emotional issues he was repressing. He had enormous stress on him. Obviously all problems, but he is a good person and this has enabled me to be very supportive and forgiving for this throughout the whole thing.

Many women would have been cutting up his suits and degrading him on Facebook. I went and HELPED him move into his new place. I saw he was sick...he needed help. I have a lot of trust in him, even now.

Last edited by verysadlady; 27th January 2014 at 01:13 PM.
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Old 27th January 2014, 01:09 PM   #70
verysadlady
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

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VSL you have been kicked out of your home with your children. Although I don't think you should have been living in his home without marriage there is still something very wrong here that I don't think you can put completely down to a breakdown. It was a very callous thing to do. Are you blaming this all on his breakdown because there is a place in you that wants back what you had and perhaps are justifying his actions because of this? It could be like him saying it wasn't me it was the illness. I think you need to open your eyes to this.
s.
Hmm...Raymond. You are right.

However, as I said in the earlier post, the behaviour is nothing like he was. Let me give you an example.

His wife was having an affair with his friend. He knew this. For years they were in separate bedrooms with not even a conversation, a hug or a kiss. He tried everything he could to fix the situation, in spite of his own humiliation because he felt a responsibility to the child. His child was just one year old and had no concept. I was friends with him over this period and saw for myself how he handled it. We all said he was a saint. When all hope was eventually lost (she refused counselling and all other attempts) He took a month to find the right day to talk to her, and he asked her if she wanted to divorce or work on it. She said divorce. He then agreed to move out.

He took several months to then file for the divorce to be respectful. When he did, he gave her both their houses (they owned two) so she could live in one and get income from the other as a rental even though she comes from a very wealthy hotel owning family. He gave her all their savings, and walked away with only his car and started again with nothing. She moved his friend (her boyfriend) into their home and he walked away from the town they lived to start a new life completely alone.

We started dating after that, and he took almost a year of slowly introducing his son to me and my son to be respectful to the children. He constantly worried about the kids, and ensuring he was respectful to his ex wife.

This is how he treated a woman who was unfaithful, unkind, and with whom there had been no love or intimacy for many years.

Compare this to how he treated me, when we were very much in love, when there were no fights, no problems...during a nervous breakdown...and you can see it is more likely the nervous breakdown caused him to act this way.

Our children considered themselves brothers, he ripped them apart without even a goodbye or explanation. Compare this with how gently and considerately he introduced them. He put me AND our kids through trauma. This is not who he is.

Yes, I do believe he was acting in a temporary insanity. This is not me being delusional, it's just basing the behavior on his normal behavior and comparing it. It was very out of character and thoughtless. He is never like this. He is never impulsive.

If he had fallen out of love and had wanted to end it, he would have done it respectfully and slowly with consideration to myself and the children. Like he did with his ex wife.

Last edited by verysadlady; 27th January 2014 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 27th January 2014, 01:12 PM   #71
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

I do think Chosen that it's a slow process of detachment for me. I have detached a little bit. All expectations are gone, and believe me that is a big relief. Over time, and as I get settled I will slowly move on from it.

I'm not ruling out a future, but at the same time where I was certain of one before, I am now very doubtful of one.

I'm not impulsive, and when I love someone it is very difficult to let go of that. In time, but also not when he is ill.

He was there for me every day when I was anxious...and now if he needs me, I will be there.

When he is better...I will have my say. I'm not a stupid woman. Nor a woman who accepts being mistreated.
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Old 27th January 2014, 02:38 PM   #72
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

Hi VSL,

Don't be too hard on yourself...

You can't just simply flick a switch that stops you loving and caring for him. Some people can't even flick this switch when they are with bad boys or serial adulterers. They know these people aren't good for them but can't keep away. We see this in real life and read about it all the time. It's human nature. It must be so tough when you had someone who seemed the "ideal" man.

You can't make yourself feel or not feel a certain way. You do need to think carefully about what impact a possible future may have on your child though.

If you want to continue to help him through this ordeal, do so but just be very clear on boundaries. Protect yourself and your child to the best of your ability but accept that you could be prolonging and opening yourself up for even more hurt.

It's a tough one.
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Old 27th January 2014, 02:55 PM   #73
verysadlady
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

Thanks Ronnoco.

To be honest, even if I had stopped loving him, there's still no way I could cut ties with him right now. I wouldn't treat a dog like that...it's just not the right thing to do. I know he has other people around him but he isn't talking to anyone but me. A severely depressed person needs support.

Thanks for understanding...it is just going to take me a long time to process it. It's become clear anyway that it's going to be months before he is even close to normal, so he can't offer me what it is I want right now (some emotional support in reciprocation) so half the battle is to stop hoping for it.

I know all I can realistically do right now is make some sort of amazing new life for me and my son, to create a great new home and to try and adjust to how different life is. At the same time I have to support his recovery. This is my only correct choice.

Getting over missing him is the hard part, and so much disruption, but I will lean on God and my family and I will be okay eventually. I think you are all right and if I can keep faith that there is a purpose and trust in God, it will all stop feeling so senseless.

I know people have been through much worse. I am really lucky to have family to stay with, people to look after me and all those wonderful things.
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Old 27th January 2014, 04:24 PM   #74
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

I really believe in fate and destiny. For some reason, this is all part of your destiny. Perhaps this needed to happen for him to address these underlying problems?

I'm sure God has a plan for you - the tricky part is we all want to no what our destiny is - i'm the same.

Take each day one day at a time. Things will get easier and eventually, everything will be ok. People say time is your only healer, that's not really true. It's what you do with the time that matters.
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Old 27th January 2014, 05:22 PM   #75
chosen
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Re: Please help. My life has been turned upside down

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Thanks Ronnoco.

To be honest, even if I had stopped loving him, there's still no way I could cut ties with him right now. I wouldn't treat a dog like that...it's just not the right thing to do. I know he has other people around him but he isn't talking to anyone but me. A severely depressed person needs support.

Thanks for understanding...it is just going to take me a long time to process it. It's become clear anyway that it's going to be months before he is even close to normal, so he can't offer me what it is I want right now (some emotional support in reciprocation) so half the battle is to stop hoping for it.

I know all I can realistically do right now is make some sort of amazing new life for me and my son, to create a great new home and to try and adjust to how different life is. At the same time I have to support his recovery. This is my only correct choice.

Getting over missing him is the hard part, and so much disruption, but I will lean on God and my family and I will be okay eventually. I think you are all right and if I can keep faith that there is a purpose and trust in God, it will all stop feeling so senseless.

I know people have been through much worse. I am really lucky to have family to stay with, people to look after me and all those wonderful things.
Its always good when we can see and appreciate the blessings that we have despite hard times. When my marriage suddenly ended 14 years ago it would have made such a difference to have had my parents(mum really) around. I am sure she would have helped and supported us, and at least I would have had someone to lean on a bit. I felt very alone.

My daughter is sadly going though a divorce right now after less that 2 years of marriage, and she said that despite everything she has been able to SO appreciate us, her family, and her amazing Christian friends where she lives, who have been such a support to her this last year. She has been so mature about it all, I am so proud of her. She also has a very strong faith in God which had helped her so much.

its never easy to cut ties with someone you love as you say ronocco, and I carried on caring about my ex for years, despite what he had done. That doesn't mean I would or could have had him back, but after 25 years of marriage you have a very strong and very deep connection.
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