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Chamomile
16th August 2011, 09:39 AM
He had a shop in The Marlands shopping centre and one in Totton until a couple of years ago , but he sold band merchandise rather than vinyl .

The recession hit him pretty bad so now he just has the websites , which don't come with a £40,000.00 a year rent !

I'm the same with doctors Chamomile ( of which I've seen a lot lately ! ) I do prefer them to be older .. They always seem more experienced then .
xx

Hi Helen xoxoxox

Shame about the recession and unique stores hit hard by it :( There used to be more interesting stores and when their lease runs out, they seem to be forced out. It's excellent your man is wise enough to continue online to keep ppl happy with rock music merchandise. :) xxx

What you said made me re-think, thank you, Helen. xx I'm no good judge of character when it comes to medical professionals. (I'm in fact quite naive in that front x) Are you seeing any Specialists at the moment? (please no need to reply on here due to lack of privacy) Please DO email me if you can, Helen.

I agree, there are doctors who seem to understand patients well and others who just irritate patients LOL LOL

xxxxx

Chamomile
16th August 2011, 09:43 AM
I think that volunteer work is a great thing. I worked a phone line years ago at a Suicide Crisis Centerand often manned the overnight shift as that was a high stress time for callers. I was a full time mature working student, and had just had met my husband. He took me to morning coffee more than once when my nerves were jangled from those calls. It was good to help others.

So if you can, beyond your own troubles, lift anothers' burden or go beyond self, than do it. We talk about what we wish was different. Make it different for yourself. Truth is, we can't change another. Let them be reponsible for their own space and choices. I will live for me. Perhaps that is selfish? It seems fruitless to ask another to give you what they will not. I am happy with my space and what I have around me. It does take a little work to think through to serenity.

Hi

I'm not sure but I seem to remember Pat is working full-time?

Greetings Pat. Enjoy the supportive Room :)

Helen_uk
16th August 2011, 10:50 AM
Hi Chamomile,

I have a lovely specialist in Coventry and also an excellent GP, whom I've been a patient of since I was 15 so he knows me inside out, literally ! I have a temp doctor in S'oton at a good practice and who've seen me quite a few times whilst I've been at my fiancé's ... they've also arranged hospital appointments for me here when necessary , which is above and beyond what a temp GP would normally do.

I'm more comfortable talking to medics who are older than me ( younger ones feel like I'm discussing things with my son ! ) but of course as we get older, doctors, along with policemen seem to get younger lol.

As far as mental health care is concerned it's even more vital you feel comfortable with the person you're confiding in , so it's not just about qualifications . ... although I would recommend they be registered with their professional body ( just in case of complaint ) . I've had more than one psychologist treat me for depression as the first ones I didn't feel comfortable with. I think you make much better progress if it feels they have empathy for you.
xx

Baroness
16th August 2011, 03:26 PM
I don't think I'm going to be posting on this thread for awhile. I am very depressed and don't really want to talk to anyone. After he basically blamed me for our financial situation (losing my job) I have felt terrible and useless in that I can't find a job and I can't do anything about my back. He did say it was no ones fault and yet he was saying that he's frustrated.

He always told me it was no problem. He has the funds to cover everything and while it doesn't leave us with a lot, we manage. I feel empty inside and very old. I look at my face in photos and I have the circles under my eyes and I realized I'm never going to look young again. Not that its a big surprise but I'm thinking now that him not making love to me has nothing to do with ed.

I think its because he is no longer attracted to me. I know other men are but that isn't the point. I have never felt such depression in my life. I don't care about anything and I don't want to talk to anyone, especially him. Once again he has changed things and once again he's made it worse.

Helen_uk
16th August 2011, 03:34 PM
I'm so sorry to hear that Baroness , please don't feel you can't post here if you're feeling depressed . Sometimes it's good to just get that frustration out .

I hope that if you do decide you don't want to post you are getting support from somewhere .

Hugs for you.
x

chosen
16th August 2011, 04:02 PM
Could you go and stay with your mum again for a while? She helped you so much last time and she seems to have an amazing faith. It would give you both a break from all this, and some time of reflection and time to spend with God as well.

1aokgal
16th August 2011, 04:51 PM
Dear Baroness...

Is that a "girl thing" we put it all on how we look, or our feminity in a relationship? What about who cares what he thinks? I do think this... and maybe it is not good for your to hear? You both drank together and that was fun and he was exciting then and macho. You had a good job and living together was balanced because you knew he didn't talk a lot but was fun after a few drinks. His personality and charisma to you was good.

Ok, you are both older. Now you are unemployed and with health problems. A full time job is questionable, even if they showed up at your door with promise of a paycheck! One thing there you can improve.
Him? You can't change him. Anybody who drinks as a couple will find that if one withdraws from that part of the relationship, they strip away an element that both enjoyed previously. In come cases, the drinker will attempt to get the other back to the party.

You are seeing the world unfiltered by licquor and he is not the fascinating one! What is the truth? We see what attracted us to someone, and later it is those things that cause the problems! How strange is that! Maybe your man is moody because there are NOT two incomes. You both have to make adjustments as others do today. If you put life all around HIM, you will be disappointed.

Often couples can smoke, because licquor pairs well with smoking, I am told. That can run the budget per person in the US at almost $6 a pack per day or $180.00 month for one. That is an expensive hobby. (I think the majority are now non-smokers, as so many work places don't tolerate it). People are forced to cut back or quit. My husband was a former smoker, not heavy, but a point of conflict between us. He got a shove to quit when the ships in the merchant fleet went non-smoking. There are months at sea and without that crutch. The unions did not want the health claims.
It is also not cheap to go out to a club for an evening for a couple. Licquor and snacks doesn't fit often in the budget for many.

You can change some factors of your life where it concerns the things you do now to enjoy your time and bring in income. All of life is making changes and adapting. Perhaps it was an advantage for him to pair himself with a woman who brought half her income in to support the house. Maybe that was part of the deal at that time? Things change and people have to do the same.

Yes, life sucks. We get up, dust ourselves off and see what we can do to make it better. You are a DOER and not a passive lady. That is part of your charm. Do what you can and blow the rest to GOD. Have a good day.

Chamomile
16th August 2011, 06:14 PM
I have a lovely specialist in Coventry and also an excellent GP, whom I've been a patient of since I was 15 so he knows me inside out, literally ! I have a temp doctor in S'oton at a good practice and who've seen me quite a few times whilst I've been at my fiancé's ... they've also arranged hospital appointments for me here when necessary , which is above and beyond what a temp GP would normally do.

I'm more comfortable talking to medics who are older than me ( younger ones feel like I'm discussing things with my son ! ) but of course as we get older, doctors, along with policemen seem to get younger lol.

As far as mental health care is concerned it's even more vital you feel comfortable with the person you're confiding in , so it's not just about qualifications . ... although I would recommend they be registered with their professional body ( just in case of complaint ) . I've had more than one psychologist treat me for depression as the first ones I didn't feel comfortable with. I think you make much better progress if it feels they have empathy for you.
xx

Hi Helen xxx

Thank you so much for your wise suggestions as always :) I'm so pleased that you have got excellent GPs who understand your medical needs. It must be very reassuring for you to have access to services in your new location. For people like your good self or myself, hospitals/GP surgeries are rather quite important lol It's useful to know that there will be excellent support and services where you are moving to in advance.

I saw a lot older nurse today in my new GP Surgery. She was very nice and much older and she was slightly slower than younger counterparts but there was something really lovely about the way she was. Yes, it does make a world of difference when a service provider can offer such elusive quality such as empathy. Yes, you are so right about the qualification of psychologist. I'm now on the look out for a lot older, wiser psychologist.

Thank you for your advice, Helen xxxxxx

Baroness
16th August 2011, 11:35 PM
Helen, I was only going to take a break but I decided to post since I have to reply to the comments just posted. Thank you for your concern but I think I will be all right. We talked about the finances again today and he said he was just venting but at least he's talking.

Chosen, I can't keep running off to my Mom's every times things get a little tough here. My place is to be with him, no matter how difficult things are right now. The time at my mom's was nice because I got to spend time with her and got closer to God. I have not slacked off in reading the bible and praying and I can talk to my mom on the phone. Running away isn't going to help. I'm sure you meant to just get a change of scenery but I just did that.

You are right, 1aokgal, with your suggestions on cutting down certain things. He only drinks for a day or so every other weekend so it isn't like he's constantly drinking beer, not like before. And yes, he smokes when he drinks so it can get expensive. However; he is the same man I met years ago and I had no illusions about him but didn't expect this problem.

I guess I was expecting everything to be perfect when we moved in together and of course it can't be perfect. The whole world is going through a hard time right now, some more than others, and I'm sure there are people worse off than me. I'm trying to figure out what I'm supposed to be learning through all this?

How to live without a lot of money? I've done that my whole life and had to fight for every dime. I'm sure many of you have done the same. I have to just do the best I can. Its upsetting when he talks like this because worrying about things isn't going to change them. I feel so weary with all this.

I just want to have a little fun. I'm meeting my best friend tomorrow and she's taking me to breakfast so maybe that will cheer me up.

chosen
17th August 2011, 08:37 AM
I wasnt suggesting running away, but visiting your mum for a short holiday break. We all need a holiday sometimes.Maybe you could both go for a break there. Sometimes getting away from home for a couple of weeks, enables us to see things from a different perspective.

Yes money isnt everything. God and people and family and friends are far more important than money. As long as we have enough for paying bills, food, a car etc then we have enough. As you say, worrying wont change anything.

I am sure you will enjoy seeing your friend. I love going out for coffee with my friends, We women love a good chat dont we.

1aokgal
17th August 2011, 03:47 PM
Hi All..

Pals are wonderful and always good for a laugh and a lift. It was funny, but I woke this morning from nightmare and was so glad to find it wasn't real! Someone stole my purse, wallet, with all credit cards and cell phone. In the dream I ran around in this business and managed to locate the now empty bag. I was distressed as I searched for a phone to report the cards stolen so they couldn't be used. My little Schi Ztsu dog, Cleo, who died years ago, was in the dream and I had insecurity to lose her as well.

Now, there is symbolism in dreams. A purse dream means SEX. That is a disappointment! How come I don't get a spicy visual sex dream like Baroness? :D I think this night time drama resulted from my expensive car repair last week. Then I had to spend $750 to replace a needed pool cleaning machine yesterday. A dream was in response to those concerns and the fact I will need to produce more in my business to compensate for extra expenses. The only part of the dream that wasn't bad, was I got to hold in a big hug that funny sweet little dog with her fur flying as she jumped into my lap. She had one albino eye and was a quite funny looking little dog. I was broken hearted when she died and kept a ribbon bow she wore in her topknot after her grooming trips. The dream reunited us for a hug of her furry body and a face lick. That part was wonderful.

We all have concerns for the insecure reality of our lives. The rich worry about how they will keep more of what they have, and regular people worry about how we get from one crisis large or small to the next. I see possibility in everything I can do to improve a situation. My business is my creativity as I locate a buyer for what I can produce. Sure beats the years I stood on my feet and worked for another! It is just that I have to keep control of my time and put it to good use. Since I enjoy to make things all I have to do is match an outlet to the product. Right now consignment shops seek fall goods and I have started to reduce the closets and get rid of the extra. One can donate all that extra stuff to a charity outlet and take the tax writeoff, which is easy, or press and hang clothing and get them to a shop.

I also cut clothes apart and use the fabric for a handbag lining or small lap quilts. My daughter dropped off her used blue satin bridesmaid dresses. I can sell them or there are some great material for Victorian bonnets and lining material. When I was super poor, years ago and moved in with a relative, I got my little sewing machine and made 57 patchwork Teddy bears with button eyes and cute embroidery noses. I sold them all in a few days and had orders for more. Creative women can
see possibility everywhere. How we define life is whether we can make something better from what we have.

My daughter who has a great job, moonights home decorating jobs with her buddy for other friends. Then on the side of all that she bakes the most gorgeous decorated cakes for others. Her creations are impressive with sugar flower bedecked cupcakes and sweet candies and makes a constant flow of sideline income with her customer orders. She removed all her cable TV stations, as she said she didn't need to spend the money, and doesn't have time for TV. Her favorite times are really long bike rides with several friends and she stays in geat shape with that. So creative women can make a difference with great ideas to change an attitide of poverty. Life is possibility and unlimited in resources.

Baroness
18th August 2011, 12:01 AM
I just went to my mom's in the later part of July and she is some distance away and I miss my home when I'm not here and I miss him too although I don't know why. I had a good time with my friend today, we went to breakfast and talked about her life and mine and she said I should come over more often and I think I will.

You are very creative, 1aokgal, and I enjoy reading about your past life and what you did to earn money. My friend told me she was watching a news show and they said that the longer you are without work and the older you get its harder to get a job. I said what about experience? I have 20 years of clerical experience and she said they didn't mention that but they want young women rather than older ones.

I said, Excuse me, I'm not an older woman! She is secure in her job for the state and she is 3 years younger than me. I go to a new doctor tomorrow and we'll see what he says. I can sit for long periods of time but the standing and stooping is a problem.

I finished my third hat and it looks great. I didn't touch it for days and then forced myself to sit and do it and once I did I was caught up in it so I'm not so depressed anymore but I really don't want to be around him right now. He just reminds me of what I don't have and our situation really isn't okay with me, no matter how much of a brave front I put up.

I'm being honest in how I feel. I wish I could just hand it over to God and not think about it but that isn't possible for me. I have to face facts. I realize now he's been worried about the finances but dumping it on me didn't make me feel good and in fact depressed me. I keep forgetting that he cares little for what I feel.

However, I have a new hat to start and can't be bothered with dwelling on his inadequacies. If I could support myself right now I would be living alone. I would ask him to leave because he said I would have to be the one to end it and he would leave. Maybe its a good thing I don't have the finances to support myself because this relationship would be over and I'm not sure that is the thing to do.

But because I'm frustrated and upset I want a change and me living alone is definitely a change but I think I would miss him. However; we don't seem to have anything together anymore. We have nothing in common and are as different as night and day and before you say that isn't grounds for breaking up, I already know that.

Often times I thought I would like to be free, whether or not there was a man in my life. And other times I look at him and remember how proud I was that he was mine. We are getting along okay now but I didn't need for him to make me feel bad for nothing working at a 9-5 job. A lot of people just say things without considering how the other person is going to feel.

I know that God will help me with whatever direction my life takes. I would like me and him to work out but this is a very odd relationship and there has been no affection in several days and I don't care to show any affection just to feel like I shouldn't have wasted my time. I show him my hat creations and he just nods.

I try to make polite conversation sometimes and he just nods. I feel like I'm bothering him, taking him away from his movie or whatever. But I am relieved to say that I am not in a deep depression anymore. I can't believe how much I've had to go through lately. Everything hit at once. For a couple of years this no sex thing has been going on but there was still an effort.

Now there is no effort and I had to face the facts. So I am immersing myself into creative things and things that make me happy. I am not the type to be down for long. Even though I have many obstacles in my way on the path of my life, I will either jump over them or go around them but I will continue on the path of my life.

I can make my life beautiful. I can create things of beauty and write fantastic novels and get out in the sunshine and do fun things, breathe deeply and hold on to the good things in life. I'm trying to lighten up a bit and be thankful for what I can do and even for what I have. I do have very nice things in this home, things that matter to me and I have hope that I will have a successful hat making business.

1aokgal, I wanted to ask you, when you first started sewing clothes and bonnets and such, how long did it take before it was profitable to you? I know you've been doing this for a long time and I was just curious as to how long it took. I have to admire you for the path you have chosen. Here you are with a man who hasn't been with you physically in a long time but you carried on and turned your attention and talents into something successful.

I admire a woman who can do that. There are some who get so depressed that they turn to alcohol or drugs and sit around and feel sorry for themselves or run to get out of the situation. It must have taken a lot of courage to stay. You are what I call a survivor. You will always come out on top and I'm sorry you've had to deal with the things in your life, from your husband and other things, because I think you deserve all the happiness in the world.

We don't know why we have to endure things like this from a man we loved for a long time, and we might not even know the real reason why this is happening. No matter how I rant and rave and get upset and down, I can't allow this to destroy me, to make me feel bad about myself in any way. I know my self worth and no one can take away my integrity and honor and knowledge.

There is a great distance between me and him and part of it is because I took control of my own life and refused to let him run my life. I took up a project I enjoy very much and I do not whine about how things are financially. I just deal with it like I always have. I hope for the best but make things work with what I have.

I'm a Leo and we take charge and accomplish things and for too long I have wrapped my whole existence and thought into this man. No more. I trust God to help me and he has and I trust my own instincts and my instincts are telling me he doesn't deserve me. I have been kind and thoughtful and loving even knowing that I can't have the relationship I want.

I have been gracious in that I haven't made him feel less a man because of it. I have supported him and put him first in my actions and thoughts and he has in turn treated me like a roommate. I have often thought he is ruining my life and I have to stop him from doing that. I am stronger than he is so I don't need his presence in my life, I just want it, that's all.

But like the song says, 'you can't always get what you want'.

1aokgal
18th August 2011, 03:31 AM
Hi Baroness...

I am glad you go back to your projects. A creative endeavor removes you from conflict and gives one peace. My creations have always been well received with items in damand as few others make these things. I use an assembly line system to cut them in numbers, then designed them to look different saving time. My items sell easily, and I take orders.

I hate to work by a deadline so set a wide window of time as getting behind causes me stress. I design/create theatre costumes and wedding dresses which are pricey and sell. It is easier for me to make a ready made size and any custom made for figure types I charge much more to do. I also find dealing with customers takes patience. I get payment or deposit prior to the article made. The deposit is non-refundable. One wanted a special color in an item. She thinks I would make it and send her photos! I sent her a payment invoice and she didn't pay it. She might still be waiting. I don't buy fabrics, make the item, and send photos for customer approval prior to payment!

First thing you need is the terms of sale/rules for your business. You advise the customer how you work, what you expect and how many days before you expect payment. You state clearly the terms of payment you accept and then make the best photos and description of the item. A good professional image will win confidence and make sales.

I created only custom millinery for Victorian, Civil War and Edwardian items at first. They are authentic in design, fabric and construction and clientele love them and order more. The dresses are sold as fast as I make them. This is no easy dress construction with antique patterns and a bodice which is lined, interlined and boned with steel boning, just as the old one were made.

To make a profit Confucious would say, "to MAKE more, you SPEND less than you make." Initially there are start up costs. You invest in good tools as sharp scissors and patterns. My bonnets are constructed with millinery wire, buckrum and mulling/fleece or padding. These can be made by you initially with hand sewing and use wide ribbon for ties. A sewing machine is a needed investment. I keep a bookeeping system for expenses and income. I can tell you more of the details by email. They say," if one makes a good mousetrap the world will beat a path to your door." A good product, well displayed and priced right, will sell. So getting the equation right, one learns.

Like any venture, time management is important. I have no children home but I placed an advertisement to sell one of my dogs. She requires more time and attention then I have to put into her. I can't break up my work time to pull her in from barking constantly. I need uninterrupted work time. I will place her in a home where she can be shown and get to training sessions as she is an active show dog.

I read articles and talk to others and keep an eye on products in the field. I make some varied items so that gives fresh interest and I don't get stagnant. Then there is the philosophy of "passive income." This is kind of a joke, but I break it down this way, "Let me, or let others work." That is why I introduced drop shipping of other products because I wanted income easy that didn't rest on my efforts. Let us say that is where one gets "easy money." It can also mean one invests back into the business for a better profit margin.

The main thing to remember is that you have the power to change some things, not all. I can change my attitude. I choose to not be at the whim of another and not be a reacter. I choose to have things that work for me and I can control how well that works for me. It takes mind control to have an attitude of prosperity. That is a biblical concept and one that works. I'll Let somebody else elaborate on that, but it is a principle that helps in business and in life. There is energy derived from the attitude of prosperity which attracts in the universe abundance and plenty.

If one sees everything as a struggle and in a negative manner, this creates poverty and unhappiness. A person will never create prosperity until they stop courting poverty. The mind cannot grasp that theory until they believe the universe carries abundance. The mind has to believe, to achieve. I see creativity as God keeping my hands and mind active, and that has been a blessing and a reward.

Baroness
18th August 2011, 10:36 PM
Good advice as usual and thanks for sharing. I went to the doctor today thinking that it was a one time deal but it turns out I qualify for health insurance on a permanent basis because of Obama so now I have my own insurance and my doctor has already set up a mamogram appointment which is important since my mother had breast cancer.

I have to obtain some paperwork by the 1st of September and it requires traveling to get it. He took me to the doctor but was ranting and raving about the finances again and I got upset with him. He's talking about putting our stuff in storage and giving up the apt. if the government takes more money out of his checks.

If that happens I will not go to a motel with him to live until things are better, I will go to my mom's and that will be the end of this relationship. I'm sick of his defeatist talk and his the glass is not only half full, but has totally evaporated!

As I've said, we have nothing really between us anymore so when I can afford to live on my own, whether it be disability, my business or a job, I will go it alone because he is only bringing me down and not offering anything to me as far as any effort to be with me.

I will email you because I don't think everyone is interested in what is happening with my new hat. When we got home from the doctor I got the electric bill and I have a credit for the deposit I put down and so now I won't have to pay that bill for 3 months! That is a bill I pay so that gives me more money. It's been a good day except for his lousy attitude.

Once I get the insurance card I will get an extray of my back but meanwhile my attorney is going forward with my case. I am hopeful about my future but this man is weighing me down, robbing me of my positive attitude and sidetracking me from enjoying making my hats. He just sits there in front of the tv but now he isn't talking because he's worrying about things that might not even happen.

I'm tired of him upsetting me and making no effort except to bring doom and gloom into my life. I think in the long run I will be better off. Things can change and if they do and he wakes up then fine, but I have to have a plan. As far as i'm concerned he's cheating on me with m. His negativity is oppressing me and life doesn't have to be like this.

I dont know what he did with the money from his attorney but suddenly he's ranting and raving about having no money and we've been managing for quite awhile. Perhaps he isn't being honest in what is happening with his finances or perhaps he's worried the government will take some more money. I said 'Jesus!' and he said he had nothing to do with it and I said that's where your wrong.

Have a little faith, dude!

chosen
18th August 2011, 11:16 PM
It sounds as if you are both pulling in opposite directions, and that will never work. Can you guys find a good marriage counselor, and maybe with a third party you can communicate better. Do you really want yet another marriage break up? It just seems so sad to talk about ending this when you seem to think such a lot of each other.

1aokgal
19th August 2011, 12:15 AM
Baroness..

Does your h use recreational drugs as pot? His behavior is so erratic, moody and it seems more than financial concerns. Agreed the M is like having another woman, because it removes intimacy from the marriage. It seems more than that to me..just doesn't make sense. I am suspicious about the use of his money the poor mouthing. Why don't you call his attorney and make inquiry. You are married, right? I don't think he is truthful, and may have a habit to account for those funds. Yes, it seems you have hit an impasse and he is little concerned for you either emotionally or physically.

Unless his use of alcohol has increased which gives him a nasty side. Funny, but some have a few drinks and relax, then the next drink launches the beast with insults or combat. I grew up in with a stepfather who drank. There are personality/brain declines with alcoholism.

I'm really sorry that your day to day is without joy but feel what you are doing can help you with the side income or better, depending on you. I will send you an email of a woman who is much in demand with the hats. You can check out her stuff. She is amazing.

If you can no longer afford the place you live you will have to find another place. Putting things in storage is a lose. lose idea as the storage bills grow to be more than the junk stored. Sorry, but I get the feeling he wants out more than you do. His "plan" seems to be for him, and not both of you.
I think you are right in how you assess that situation and it is not good. I think you should not mention the money you have credited and if I were you, would get an escape fund squirreled away if he has some plan you don't know about. His behavior has made you feel very insecure and upset.

Obama had a right idea that people need health care, not tied to the job. Women need PAP tests, Mammiograms especially with family history, that is a relief for you. That was a concern that you had no health care and are years from SS plan. I would not put a lot of hope with disability claim as they are notorious for dragging that out for years or denying marginal claims. Seems he felt you should have answers to problems he should have been working on for the two of you. I think you are correct in your feeling that is a lost cause and sex is the least of your problems there. The biggest problem is the lack of communication. That is what needs to change.

Baroness
19th August 2011, 12:20 AM
I think i've mentioned before that he will not go to a marriage counselor and clearly he does not think a lot of me nor I him. He won't even try to work on our problem and still pretends there isn't one, and I am in here at night wondering if he is m. He doesn't even wait until I go to bed.

I spend most of my time by myself anyway as he continues to watch the same movies and doesn't talk to me unless he's complaining about finances. He didn't used to complain so I think he did something with some of the money he gets and now he doesn't have enough to get through the month.

He said he was going to buy me a microwave for my birthday and not only is he not going to do that, but he didn't have the decency to tell me. I am tired of his secrets. He acts like his finances and bank account is a forbidden secret. Around the 15th he always has money from his attorney and this time he does not and I'm the one who has to suffer for it.

Ending another relationship does not bother me as much as what he's doing to our relationship. I have lived with his secrets forever and I go through his pockets sometimes or I would never know how much money he had. And then sometimes he comes and gives me twenty dollars when I think he is broke.

Clearly there is a secret life going on here, if only because he likes to keep his finances to himself but that isn't the way it should work with a h and w. I didn't mind because I had my own money but now I have to depend on him and so I can't believe him when he says he's going to do this for me or that. He's always kept him word and has always paid things on time but something is wrong here.

He isn't just worried about what the government will take out next year, he's worried because he has no money and he should have. I even mentioned that to him today and he got all quiet. I am open and honest with him about finances and everything else but lately i've started not telling him everything.

I've also quit trying to make conversations with him because he just acts like he wished I'd go away so he can watch tv. This, in turn, makes me feel like an idiot for even trying when he is so clearly not interested. I know him and I know he's worried about things but why all of a sudden? He's been paying for things for a few months now (before that I was contributing) and why all of a sudden is it a big deal?

He told me that he had paid off his child support in one lump sum back in 95. Then he said his ex was suing him because she wanted him to pay for when the girls were in college. Going through his things I discovered that yes he did pay it off but it kept adding up and when we got together and he was telling me he paid all the child support, but he receipts I saw it showed that he was supposed to be paying child support because it was adding up from the time he paid it off.

I have two children, he doesn't think I know anything about child support? So maybe he owed this money and now it has to come out of his settlement and that's why he only gets so much per month. She's probably asking for more than he's willing to pay and he says she refuses to pay the attorney so everything is on hold.

What I'm telling you is that I have had a life with him full of things I don't know, and sometimes he'll tell me and sometimes he won't and I just don't trust him anymore. I'd like to think he was honest and I know he is very private and doesn't reveal things because of his past, but why hide things from me? Does he think I would take advantage of him in some way?

I could care less about his money and he knows that. When we first met he tried to impress me with the house up on the mountain that he owned and was talking about the property he owned and about the money he had. I told him straight out that it didn't make any difference to me if he'd had money or not or owned property.

I don't know what its like to have a lot of money so it matters little to me. I told him I didn't care if he dug ditches for a living I wasn't with him because of money and he knows that. But if I decided to stay with him now it would be about the money. I feel he owes me after everything I've had to put up with and now this sex situation.

I don't know what to tell you. I ask God for direction but I'm not getting any. All I know is I'm tired of wondering when he's jerking off but just as important is that he doesn't care if I don't want to watch something on tv, he knows I hate certain movies cause I've watched them so much and yet he will sit there and watch it anyway with me sitting there.

What kind of love is that? If I knew he hated something I was watching I would try to find something he liked. This just proves what a selfish person he really is. And if he doesn't like it that I'm always in here then he should find something we both like and not be a TV-Nazi. I just hate to be around him now and I've got other things I need to do besides being worried that he's not treating me fairly.

Everything has always been his way, but he discovered quickly that there are things I will not negotiate on. I have no choice but to remain here right now, and I don't know what's going to happen in the future, but I do know I'm not going to be miserable for the rest of my life. I've tried to be patient and to adjust to the lack of sex.

I've prayed and trained myself not to dwell on it and even convinced myself it was okay. But what is happening here is that he's doing whatever he wants and doesn't care how I feel about it. He doesn't care that I haven't had sex and I have no physical problem with it. He doesn't care what I think about his distance either.

By his actions I'm getting that he thinks I will just deal with whatever because I love him. Big mistake. No, this is not okay. It's not okay that he doesn't try to get help for this, it isn't okay for him to ignore me like I was a light bulb or something. A light bulb has its purpose and when its done doing its job you just turn it off and that's the way he thinks about me.

If he doesn't know how lucky he is to have a woman love him and show kindness and put up with all his problems, then he doesn't deserve me and if he doesn't want to make love to me and treat me decently, then someone else will.

Baroness
19th August 2011, 12:38 AM
He has told me over and over again that he wouldn't be here if he didn't love me and that we are going to be together forever and he's said this recently. Why would he want it to end? He's got everything his own way plus a housekeeper and good cook to boot!

No, he's never been into drugs and he smoked pot in college and that was it. A good friend of ours offered us pot and he wanted nothing to do with it and he isn't drinking now. Hasn't had beer since my birthday. Maybe he's hanging onto money for emergencies, I don't know. The thing is, I'm tired of dealing with all this.

I've been dealing with a lot of it for years and I've never demanded answers or for him to be accountable, I told you all the kind of easy going relationship we've always had. But a wife has certain rights and I'm tired of being understanding and just dealing with whatever his issues are. He should know by now that he could trust me.

It's like we aren't even a couple anymore. Now, I don't hate him, I just feel sorry for him because he's going to lose the best thing he ever had, and he's said this to me before but I can only take so much. The problems in the world are not my fault. The bottom line is he better get his act together or he's going to lose me.

He is destroying my life and my good attitude and now I think negatively like he does and that isn't me at all. When we were going to the bars together way back when I was sure we wouldn't be able to have a life outside of drinking and the bars and I was right. He isn't happy or even normal when he's sober.

I believe he cares for me and I also believe if I told him I wasn't happy with him anymore he would walk right out the door. He's told me this, that if I wasn't happy he would leave. He might not drink nearly as much as he did, but without alcohol he is not the same person. I've always told myself that I have to wait until he drinks for him to have a personality.

I have tried, you all know how hard I've tried and you don't even know the whole story, but I refuse to live the rest of my life with a man who doesn't care about how I feel. He can be a very kind man to others, but with me its a different story. I don't think he even knows what true love is. You don't want the woman you love to hurt and suffer and you put her feelings above your own, the way I have done for years.

Now, I'm tired of talking about this. I had a good day regardless of him. He's said to me many times that this is just the way he is. Well, this is the way I am, I refuse to be taken advantage of just because someone says they love me. Words are cheap. Actions speak louder than words. I have to get back to my hat now, I've spent enough time talking about him. I now need to do something constructive. We don't have to move, he was only saying if he gets less money we will have to move.

He can stay out there and m until his member falls off for all I care.

1aokgal
19th August 2011, 12:55 AM
When being around another is all downer, best to do your own thing and not get into discussions that bring you down more. Take each day and do what pleases you and stay busy.

In your place I would get some facts he may not be honest about. You can write for a free credit report from one of the four credit agencies as Experian in his name. Get the address on internet. You write in his name, his social security number and date of birth and ask for your free yearly 2011 credit report. You will find out if there is a lien, unpaid taxes or child support issues and what he owes and what he pays. I take it you get the mail? The report would come in about a week.

Yes, Of course, I have done that to keep track of my husbands report because I manage the finances.
One should get a report yearly. In your case, you are owed full disclosure and visibility and he isn't giving that to you, so get it. I am sure a few would disagree with that, but you are owed truth.

Baroness
19th August 2011, 04:47 PM
A few years ago my friend mickey ran a report on him through her job and found out that he did own the houses and had his own painting business but it didn't say anything about child support. Of course I have run a credit check for myself on those sites and it cost me nothing for a period of time and I guess I could do that, I just hate to do it and shouldn't have to but it might be a good idea, and I have thought of it before.

He keeps a box in the closet and that's how I found out about the child support after he'd paid it off in full and even his disability papers. He keeps a lot of papers in the van so I could only find out his attorneys address with what was in the closet and he's told me all this before. I don't think a credit check would tell me about his court case though.

It might reveal other things and I do know he's never been in jail before he spent the night in jail when he got a dui years ago. I hate to do this behind his back but I need to know what I'm dealing with here. We get our mail separately. He's always had a po box and I get my mail here. He also does his laundry separate and takes it to a laundry mat where I will do it at my friends or at the washroom here on the premises.

I offered to do his laundry and he said he wanted to do it himself because thats what he's always done and I asked this when we first moved in here. He likes to be independent and so do I but I think he takes it overboard sometimes. If he wants to do his laundry elsewhere then I'm fine with it and if he wants to get his mail elsewhere then fine, but I'm not fine with things I don't know about.

He has made me do these things, like looking in his stuff and so on. I didn't want to do that because I respect his privacy and I know he wouldn't go thru my things but he doesn't need to does he? I've been open and honest about everything, maybe too much so but I thought thats the way it was supposed to be with couples.

He hangs onto stuff from his past where I put it behind me and don't judge him for the things other men have put me through. I am more cautious now and suspicious because that's what happens when someone is not forthcoming. The thing is, I can't discuss what I find out from his things because then he'd know I broke our privacy trust.

This is just one of the things I find hard to live with. I didn't at first because it wasn't necessary for me to know everything when he would tell me about his past, but since i've met him i've always had the feeling that there's things I don't know. Again, this wouldn't be happening if he would have just been forthcoming.

He's opened up to me quite a bit over the years but he has this need to keep certain things private and he tells me to be the same way with other people. I'm just open and honest and don't mind talking to people about my life, he is the opposite. He promised me long ago that he would never lie to me because I told him from the beginning I would not live like that.

In his mind keeping things from me that don't concern me is not lying,but is his own business. He told me that after I found out he'd been getting money from his attorney when he knew we'd waited for years for something to happen with his settlement. I was very hurt because before it was what was his was mine too and now its it doesn't concern you, it has nothing to do with you.

I wonder how he'd feel if I said that to him. The thing is, he really doesn't care what has happened to me in my past. When I try to tell him about an incident he just ends the conversation as quickly as he can. If you love someone, isn't it normal to want to know everything about them?

Anyway, I feel better today and he's better also as far as his mood goes. But is it any wonder I don't trust him at times because of the way he is? I hate this mistrust too. I hate not knowing when and if he is m so sometimes when I suspect he is it could be that he isn't. I was very depressed last night but I don't feel depressed today.

I just don't think I should have to live with these secrets, or things I don't know about. It makes me suspicious and that isn't the way I am. He can justify it all in his mind somehow and yet he loves God so wouldn't cheat on me or break the law or do something that was wrong. He has integrity on how he lives but he just has issues that he hangs onto and is not just turning over to God.

We've all had bad experiences and that is no excuse. I HATE finding out things about him that he didn't tell me about. I don't like things being kept from me. And on top of all that now I have to deal with not making love and wondering when he's m. I've wondered sometimes if he is really where he says he is.

I've checked it out, believe me. I know the guy he's painting with and he calls here for gabby and so I know that's where he is. I know people up at the canyon and so I know he's there. I know the owner at the bar so I know when he's been there and who he is talking to. However; if he was with a woman there Holly (the owner and friend) might not tell me because she's his friend too.

I'm not sure but gabby isn't the type to flirt with women and I've known from others there that if a woman is coming on to him he will get up and leave. I believe he loves me and maybe I should have just accepted all this about him but some things I find hard to accept.

1aokgal
19th August 2011, 06:09 PM
Baroness...

I think you have to break the problems in the marriage into categories. You have a man who doesn't communicate and keeps secrets that concern both of you. You don't know how much money he has coming in as he has a sepate PO box!

You can get a statement from social security on his entitlement income. You write in his name with date of birth, social security number in request a statement of earnings which records his total income year by year, including his present income. Do you file taxes as "married, filing jointly" and sign a return, as his gross earning figure is there. Are you legally married? All these vague areas and the separate activities, including his paranoia down to separate laundry, makes me wonder! No doubt about it , you selected a strange duck! This clearly was not a marriage made in heaven. It should be no surprise that it unravels when you are sober and he has lost his bar buddy (you.) As you observed that sober, he is a dud, than there was not a good beginning for your relationship later.

If you were married 10 years, then you would be entitled to claim part of his SS as part of marital property, depending on your state laws. You get yours or half of his, not both. Generally, men pay in better income so have more credit there. Your marriage has ceased to work, as you seem to live in a train wreck of unhappiness around his secrets and moods. That is similar to alcohol deterioration or personality defects that his other wives found as well. You need serious intervention but it seems much of this is based on financial concerns and th eloss of employment. You both need to have part in the decision making about money issues.
I think you have to confront him..no TV..and talk through some of the problems.

I would get some answers on his income. You have lived in a marriage that doesn't resemble how couples should live. No wonder you are insecure, unhappy, and worry about the future. Work on your disability claim and plan for your future. You can do well with a side income with your crafts but you need a sewing machine and skills. This will tide you over until there are better job possibilities. Listen, there is not a lot of work out there for you. He stands a better chance to work some sideline jobs. He wastes time working free when he has time and he could do something that pays. He doesn't get it that he has to change that plan. Both of you have to work through the money concerns.

chosen
19th August 2011, 11:22 PM
Maybe if he knows how close you seem to be in making a decision to leave he would agree to get some outside help. You have both had 2 marriages break up(is that right) and to end yet another one seems so drastic. My husband and I have been through one divorce, after long first marriages, and I would never go through that again unless there was adultery. Even then I am not sure if I would divorce him, probably just seperate for a set time.

Its just too traumatic, and you may think that you will meet someone else, but the older you get the harder it is to meet Christian men, because there are about 4 or 5 Christian women in their 50's to every available man. Also most want younger women as well, so thsi makes the statistics worse. All of us have faults and weakness and there is no such thing as a perfect husband or wife.
To all intents and purposes. he sounds like a basically decent man who loves you, but you seem to be seeing things now that may well not be there, and getting suspicious of him for no reason.
I recommend getting the book called 'The Power of a Praying Wife' by Stormie Omartian and pray those scriptural prayers for him every day. Dont entertain ANY thoughts of leaving or divorce, because that takes away from your committment to the marriage. You have no Biblical reason to leave or divorce anyway, and we cant just run away evey time the marriage goes through a rocky patch. Dont listen to anyone who speaks negatively about your marriage or your husband, or who ever suggests that you should leave or divorce him. For a believer words are SO important, and the Bible says that we can build up or tear down with our words.

Get that book, and I bet that after a year of using those prayers, things will be so much better. God is the only one who can change the situation, but you need to stop thinking about breaking the promises that you made to this man. As long as you are looking for a way out, then you arent committed to it. My feeling is that you have both gone off track and you are already looking and planning about being on your own and that is so sad. You married this man for life and he hasnt done anything to break the marriage vows that he made to you or that you made to him.

I am so troubled by what is happenening here, and the way that you have got more and more negative of your husband and marriage over the last month or so. I have seen it happen and you need to be encouraged to make it work and trust God to change things,and that you need to love him as your husband and for the good that is in him(of which there seem to be a lot) and not think all the time of what he may or may not be doing and of what you may or may not do if you left. You need to be around positive storng believers who believe and have seen marriages restored, and who have seen non believing husbands saved and changed, and who believe that nothing has to stay the same. You need hope and not despair.

1aokgal
20th August 2011, 01:14 AM
I don't think decent men grow on trees and it takes a lot of work to work through issues with any man. If there is still feeling, than it is worth every personal sacrifice to work through issues to get this marriage to work. There are no perfect marriages and rather than to live alone is to share life with a partner. Financial concerns come and go. That isn't a reason to call it quits. There are few decent men out there for women post 50. Most carry a huge amount of baggage and are super losers.

That is true, most men who start again think they deserve a much younger woman. There are also poor job prospects for women of that age, unless one has a specific job skills, good health and job history in some field. The truth is employers don't want older workers on their health plans as it costs all employees more for premiums because of the claims. (I used to write group health plans for employers.) The sexual issue is one problem but the lack of communication is the underlying issue it seems. Two people, committed to each other, can overcome many issues as financial, sickness and job insecurity better than one alone trying to make it in the toughest econemy since the depression.

One can't keep searching for another man because often the problems aren't all in the relationship, but the baggage one carries. A woman in this situation is more likely to end up living on poverty level wages and have problems to keep a roof overhead. Relatives have their own problems.

The problem is this man has no intention to get counselling or have a 3rd party intervention until he realizes he may lose his wife. Baroness has a right to know how much money comes into the house, and where it goes. She didn't ask questions before and now has a mess. I agree it would be foolish to end this marriage before both try everything to work out the issues. It seems many problems are financial. Most of us have been in that position and that means you must spend less, make more....pretty basic.

Baroness
20th August 2011, 03:46 AM
I know how much money he gets from social security. He told me and I read the letter from social security stating how much he gets and his painting this house is only a one time thing. He's painted other nicer homes and got paid very well and his ex and him divorced because she was drinking and cussing at him in front of the children.

There is some feeling left but not half of what it used to be. Its better today but there is still no effort on his part. I know how much money he gets and I know where he is when he's gone. He's been here for the past 4 mornings and I don't like that because I usually watch what I want on tv during the morning.

I could probably find another man but I'm not thinking about that. I don't need a man in my life and i'm not worried about my future because God has assured me that I don't have anything to worry about. I trust him and I will find a way to support myself because he is not going to change, he just expects me to accept this and I'm not going to.

Chosen, he wasn't married twice, I was, and if he knew I was thinking of leaving he would not get help, he would just walk out the door because he doesn't want to be here if I don't want him. We've discussed this before. And I didn't find my divorces so traumatic.

The cheating on me, yes, but not the divorce itself, I was glad to be rid of them. One a drug addict and the other a lazy man who was cruel to my son and made me feel like I was nothing; yes,I was glad to get rid of him. You made a point of telling me how difficult it would be to find a man and that they want younger women, but God would send me a man if it was his will so I'm not worried about that.

As for seeing things that aren't there, that isn't true at all. I saw him m as i've said many times and while I'm not sure when he does it, I know that he does and I do have a reason to divorce him as far as I'm concerned. Satisfying himself sexually is the same as cheating on me, he's getting it somewhere else and God has specific rules on how a husband is to treat his wife and he is not doing those things.

You mentioned promises I've made to this man? What about the promises he made me, to love and cherish me? He can't even talk about money he gets from his attorney, this is not even like a marriage. It's like I'm his girlfriend and he doesn't have to share anything with me. He has done something to break the marriage vows.

He has stopped being a husband to me. There is no marriage bed, he is denying me the right that God says I have. If he has ed, then he should care enough about me to go do something about it instead of just assuming I will get used to no sex. Does he even know me? He knows better than that.

And how can I stop thinking about what he doesn't do when I go to bed alone every night and wonder if he's in there jerking off? My words are crude but its the truth. And what's he thinking about when he's doing it? If he's thinking about anyone other than me then that is adultery because in the Bible it says if you are thinking about it, its the same as doing it.

You might stay with your husband even if he cheated on you, but I wouldn't. How could you do that? Every time he went to bed with you you would be wondering if he was thinking about some other woman? Where is your pride? YOu are saying he can do whatever he wants but because you hate divorce and what you went through, you would rather him demean you.

God doesn't want that for us. We are children of God and deserve to be treating in the proper way and I am not being treated right. He is not obeying God and I'm not surprised with his catholic mentality. Even catholics wouldn't agree with this. How can you tell me to just put up with anything he wants to dish out?

Now, he isn't a bad man in any way but just self centered. He expects me to do all the things a wife does but he isn't doing what a husband is supposed to do. I can't live the rest of my life hoping for a change in him because he doesn't have to listen to God and I can't live in a fairy tale. The time for me to do something is now.

If a few years go by and this hasn't changed then I will regret not doing anything. What 1aokgal said is true, its the finances that are the problem and I can't go anywhere at this time, but it isn't like I'm sitting around planning my escape and all the men I will meet.

I'm still doing my best in this relationship even though he continues to treat me this way. If this had happened five years ago before I got closer to God, I would have left so fast his head would spin and that's what he deserves now and back then I wouldn't have thought of the consequences either, I would have left and only come back for my things.

Two things are holding me back from doing this and every instinct I have is telling me to get out. The first thing and its the more important of the two is that I have loved him for a long time and we get along together pretty well and I would miss him if I left him. He is very difficult to live with but he tries to make sure I am okay and have money.

He can be so kind and even romantic at times and he can also be a jerk and upset me very much. He used to at least try to make love to me although it wasn't that often. Now he doesn't try. He is breaking my heart because I know eventually my love for him will leave because if there is distance between us now, think what it will be like in a few years.

The second reason is because I can't support myself. I can go to my friends or my moms but I'm used to my own home with my things and because I don't want to lose those things, I have stayed here even when its been unbearable and these days aren't the unbearable times I'm talking about.

I need to just leave him, if only for a few days, and he would worry and get upset and be mad and we would fight when I came back and I would get my point across but at what cost? I'm not playing games with him like i would have done before.

God told me today to 'just trust him'. I was taking a walk and telling him that he wasn't doing anything or showing me anything or telling me anything and I felt so lost and confused and he said, "Just trust me." and that was it. I have to trust him. He could be working on my h and I don't know or he could have someone better for me.

I don't know but I'm not making a move until I am sure that this is what God wants and don't tell me what God wants because you don't know. You will probably say God doesn't want any marriage to end and this and that, but maybe it wasn't God's will for us to get married. Maybe I made a mistake marrying someone who spent a lot of time in bars.

I thought God brought us together but I'm beginning to wonder. You don't have to worry about people telling me what to do about this. My children want me to be happy and if I am not happen then they will encourage me to leave. My mother will as well and she is a very strong christian But its what I want that counts, what I can live with.

I can stand by him during a trying time, but I can't accept that we will never make love again as God has intended. He insults me by preferring to m and I'm not even sure of the reason anymore. I thought it was ed but it could be anything and his years of drinking could be at fault too. Alcohol can affect your thinking process and perhaps its all caught up to him.

I don't know, all I know if that time is wasting and we could have a beautiful marriage but because of his issues we are growing apart instead. I don't care that he has a po box and I don't care that he does his laundry elsewhere and I don't care if he watches tv all the time. I do care that he thinks I will put up with anything because I love him.

Love isn't something you say, its something you do.

1aokgal
20th August 2011, 05:36 AM
Dear Baroness,

I know you are broken hearted about your marriage today. There is no hell worse than to love a man who has built a wall between and you can't reach him. I understand your pain and hear the anger you feel to be treated as a roomate, less the conversation. It is unforgiveable a man would treat his wife with such neglect.

I told my husband years ago if he wanted another woman he should find one...more power to him. If he wants a woman for sex when overseas, he should just keep his mouth shut and have at it. If he wants a divorce, then pack a bag and get out, as this is my house so he goes, not I. So I was willing to let him have what he wanted. I wasn't going to beg him for charity sex when he shut down on me years ago. The sting of rejection is a poison in the veins. I wanted to know why he chose to live in such an abnormal way, then tell me in the next breath how much he loves me. I learned what I believe is the truth of it pretty much as you have.

One thing I felt was my h. was pretty darned stupid as he was unlikely to find a woman who brought more intelligence or decency into the marriage than I have. There are few women who will go out and hold down two jobs or one who has talent and is committed to bring prosperity to a marriage. He told me always he hit the lottery to find a talented woman like me. I have loved him when he had nothing and few prospects. He always had my respect and love. In a sense, all that loyalty gained me nothing. This isolation of spirit will age a wife, who gives up her life as woman, before her time. While I share my life with the man I love, and he is a model for devoted affection, it is a celebate marriage.

It would be a shame if Baroness spends the next 18 years in a marriage like mine, where sex no longer exists, and affection is a hug and sweet words passing in the hallway. True, I made a gamble on this man who always said he loves me, that he would alter this pattern. He did not. When he is away overseas, he daily sends me loving messages. While he is home he is a dedicated and kind husband. We just don't share a bedroom. We get along great and have an easy relationship. He likes to cook and does nice things for me. There was a time I could have just said..now it's enough. I would have made it just fine financially. I am sure at that time I would have found another man. He devastated the life we shared together.

Baroness should do everything possible to get answers from this man.
Just as he services himself, he shuts her out with no regard for her feelings or needs. Believe me when I say I know what she is going through, because there were times I had to ask God to remove my anger. There were moments when I wished ants would eat out his brain! This m is a pattern that some men share who are especially vulnerable. I read it is a relationship problem when a man withdraws into himself. It is a also lousy addiction from all I read through the years, difficult to treat even with extensive counselling. That husband of hers is happy with himself. My husband went to counselling for while, which altered nothing. There was a better chance for me to fly, than that he would change.

Baroness, I hope you scream, yell and swear at this man and shake him to the core that you won't put up with what is going on there. The money problems you have will all work out, but that pattern going on there will be unlikely to change without a major shakeup. It seems he is pretty set and he realizes you know about it. I bet my bottom dollar that happened in his last marriage or other relationships. This habit doesn't start in middle age, it starts when they grow an organ.

For me, I am fine. I survived. I made the right decision for me. If I were to live this all again from the beginning again, perhaps I am not sure I could live again with that much heartache. I was broken in a thousand pieces for loving him.

I knew he has meant everything to me. I gave my husband a bible at the beginning of our time together, right before we married. I underlined for him MY promise to HIM from that beautiful story of the widow, Ruth 1:16-17.

16 And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:

17 Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the Lord do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me.

I could never stop loving him or ever want to be somewhere else. I have forgiven him everything.

chosen
20th August 2011, 08:36 AM
Baroness I would also recommend that you join a fellowship group at your church, and also a womens group if you can. You need to be around other believers who can support you, pray for you and encourage you and build up your faith and belief that things can get better and that this marriage can thrive.

Chamomile
20th August 2011, 09:21 AM
baroness

You did change a bit which is good. You used to get very defensive when our observations are given to you out of care (not to harm you) and you expressed dislike in what some of us said but now you are saying these things as your own. You decided to own up some of the things which are difficult to keep denying in your heart. So you have actually listened and now you are accepting things without denial and quite naturally.

I would have said, "why don't you live on your own" a long time ago but I did not say this before because you do sometimes get defensive when someone suggests something. It sometimes irritates you. So I hadn't, until now..Now I see you changed your tune a bit. You are seeing your situation far more realistically. You used to tell me "I trust my husband so I don't need to know etc etc etc...!" But now, you want to know the truth. I think you are far more honest and accepting in the past couple of posts. You have better self-esteem.

B's issues are to do with social issues, his lifestyle not in sync with a marriage. Loss of employment (B). H on social security. His behaviour is that of a Bachelor's. Social deprivation and only recently, B realized that she can access health care. We are talking about someone who's in desperate need here. She worries about becoming homeless.

What on earth is he doing "up in canyon" all day in weekdays. I had thought he must have been doing something to earn his living. Now you have some disability to cope with, osteoathritis in the spine is no fun. I know someone with one and it is hell. As much as I can see how creative work would help for B, not sure if it's wise to focus on that too much right now, whilst the "house is burning down". Also, be careful not to over-strain yourself, people with some genetic predisposition to osteoarthritis could develop other joint/tendon/nerves etc diseases with manual repetitive strains, it creates strain cumulative effects over years. You might end up with another disability unless you take things easy.

This is no ordinary marriage middle class people have. There is an element of stark neglect and abuse (e.g. his "bad mouthing", his foul temper).

I suggest to find out what options are open to you e.g Housing, social security etc. Get out and move on from this. You are not old. 55 years old is like 44 used to be. You are full of energy still. Who can force her to live in misery which she has tried to get out of? He's not in to her (that's what B's complain re. his "M" is about) Set up a small place where you can do things without stress and worries.

One thing. You seem to have over-reliance on men for your happiness and a course of validation of your attractiveness as a female. That is a formula for a disaster once a honeymoon period is over and you are not a spring chicken. That's why I place God FIRST where my heart belongs. All the worldly nonsense suddenly becomes far more insignificant.

Sex is another for you. It's good if you have it going but if that's the only thing good about your marriage and once it's gone, everything falls apart, does that mean to say, "something is not right", don't you think?

I think you are making a huge progress in this. Well done, 1aokgal too! xxxxx

Forever
20th August 2011, 02:54 PM
Dear Baroness,
Your husband is a retired sixty-five year old man. That canyon is the only thing that makes him feel as if he were not in a convalescent home. Being cooped up in a tiny one bedroom apartment does not sit well with men. Mosr men have a garage or yards to putter in...he has neither.

I imagine he feels like a dog at the pound and this, plus TV, is his only link to male sanity. Women are different that way...we are wired to be care takers, men are wired to be workers. He may always be this way, because there is nothing left for him unless he decides he has had enough and tries at 65 years old to get a paying job. This has nothing to do with you as a woman or person...he will be this way with or without you.

You suprised me when you said that you wrote romance novels. I can now see why your expectations are so high in the sexual department. Well, he is an old man now (goog looking to you, but old none the less), losing his ability to keep an erection, and depressed enough with his enviroment and failures in life to not even care. He has made all the adjustments that he could, by not hanging every night at the bar, and the TV is his substitute for that...this he did for you because he is a married man now.

If he mb's it is because he still needs the release, but cannot sustain an erection suitable for intercourse. Try not to take it so personal???

I am now off to Mexico for tons of dental work. Will be back in six days.

Take care and God Bless you.

chosen
20th August 2011, 03:03 PM
I believe that reading romance novels(and I guess writing them as well)can be the female equivalent of men looking at porn. Both lead to discontentment with our spouse or partner and both are fantasy. No man can live up to the hero in a romance novel(who isnt real anyway) and no women can live up to the 25 year old girl who pretends to be widly erotic and desperate for sex, in a porn film.
My husbands ex loved historical romance films, and made him watch them with her, presumably in the hope that he may become like the effimimate hero's in them. and become what she thought she wanted. He hated them, and fortunately I hate them as well and dont make him watch anything.
Forever makes some pretty good points actually.

1aokgal
20th August 2011, 04:17 PM
Chamomile...

You always make astute observations and are concise to categorize the ongoing problems. You have a scientific mindset as you are so rational.
Your clear thinking and fairness is fresh air here, where religious extremism loses touch with truth, that all marriages aren't meant to survive.

I don't see this marriage as ever being a "regular folks" kind of marriage. Like you, I think if this guy has got enough juice left to go work free up the canyon, than he should work a shift at McDonalds', 7-11, or other employer that routinely hires senior workers. His "good old boy" outlook likes the the outdoors, while he works free to escape the house. He put no plan in place for his retirement years and changing marital beds cleaned him out before Baroness arrived on the scene. He can't be depended on to keep the lights paid now because, without her half income from the job B had, he can't keep the roof overhead.

He needed a woman like B, who asked few questions and accepted him when they hung out at the bars. He was a charming companion when lit! The fact is, he has isolated her and brow beats her now, because she is not emoloyed. He could get help for the ED but he doesn't care enough to do that and lives just for himself. B was willing to cook and wait on him and hold a job which brought half the income into the house before job loss. How handy was that! She was also quick to defend him if anyone questioned why she did these things.

Now he is verbally abusive when he pokes his head out from the TV. His personality is much in common with drinkers, with a narcissistic mean streak. A day in this hostile environment is not going to provide a usable errection or even some friendly affection. It is no wonder B wishes she were elsewhere. Personally, I wonder if he has personality changes consistent with possible early dementia. His moods are marose, changeable and irritable. She also reports he doesn't have a lot of recall about simple things.

A flow of side income from B (with her crafts) would help, but there needs to be some major income alterations in that household for these two to survive. If he folds from a one bedroom apartment to live on a puny social security check, I doubt they will survive anywhere. I think sex is not the important issue now, it is the need for both to find a dependable other income. As long as they do live together, it would be nice if he acknowledged her presence.

Baroness is a nice lady who may have chosen the wrong man at the wrong time in her life. They need a lot of intervention to survive the econemy and each other. I hope she knows we all want her happiness and pray for her.

Helen_uk
20th August 2011, 04:27 PM
Secrets in any relationship concern me . Whilst I don't think it's automatically necessary to have one joint bank account , I do think finances and the like should be transparent . Secrecy smacks of deception to me .

If you don't have the full picture how can you make an educated decision about the validity of the marriage ?

1aokgal
20th August 2011, 04:27 PM
Chosen..

Women read romance novels like kids read "Cinderella" and "Red Riding Hood." Reading entertains, and fantasy is just that. Are you into book burning now? Be careful, thats' an extremeist view that everyone read from an approved list of books.

Baroness
20th August 2011, 05:37 PM
I will address your comments one at a time but I do thank you for all the things you have said to help me. Chamomile, I realized I was being overly sensitive at certain times but it kind of depends what is said to me. I have my own mind and can think for myself so I don't like being told what to do and this is what made me sensitive.

It is probably because of my mother and others always telling me what to do, what is right to do according to God, that made me feel like they thought I didn't have a brain of my own. I am open to suggestions but I have a problem with certain posters only seeing things from my husband's side and telling me I just have to deal with it.

He loves to go up to the canyon and everyone likes him. On the weekends he mans the kiosk where he take money for the parking and during the week he either paints for them and when school is in he is teaching kids of all ages about wildlife and the canyon history and is quite good at it. I told you all that he used to be a history teacher and so he enjoys this and they love him and they are his friends.

Perhaps I do have a problem with grouping a man's attention to my belief in my own attraction but that doesn't mean I have an over reliance on men, its just that men have always thought I was pretty and fun to be around and enjoyed sex with me so having one act like he is no longer attracted to me was quite a blow and one i've never experienced before.

This morning I went out into the front room and put myself in a mind set as to how I would feel if he was gone and I lived alone. I would have panic at first, because I have reacted this way before when he'd left me after a fight for the night. Then I thought of how lonely I would be and how much I would miss him.

I came to the conclusion that I am not ready to leave. I still love him and even with his problems, he is still a good man and if I led you to believe he has a foul temper and bad mouths me, then I am sorry. He doesn't have a foul temper but gets frustrated when he thinks he might lose more money out of his social security.

He said he knows it isn't my fault because I lost my job but you have to understand that this is a man who has always supplied for his family and not just to get by either. He's always had money because of his painting and has bought 3 homes and now he's in a position where he has to worry about having enough money in case something happens or the government takes more out of his checks.

Eventually he will get the settlement once his ex wife pays the attorney and she can't hold out forever and then he will have well over a million dollars but that hasn't happened yet and its taken years to go through this and he is frustrated because he knows he has this money but can't get to all of it because of legal matters.

This man is usually always nice to me and thoughtful and where he doesn't have sex with me anymore I think it might be a combination of worrying about our household and the ed and also repercussions from drinking for so long. He is taking his vitamins and seems to be doing better lately. I also put myself in the mindset of having an affair, going off on a saturday and returning later and coming in and seeing him and I can't do this.

I have come so close to God that I can't do something to mess up my relationship with him because now my time with God is more important than anything and when I was praying this morning I asked for a miracle, in fact, claimed a miracle in our lives. Deciding to stay in the marriage is not a case of 'its better to put up with him or live alone'.

I'm sure I could adapt to being alone but it was the missing him part that hit me like a bolt of lightening. I asked God to take away the anger and to help me to stop complaining so much to myself mainly, about him. There may come a time that I will need to go it alone but the time is not now and not just because of finances. God asked me to trust him and I must do this and he has not released me from this marriage.

I thank you for being honest with me and I think I will be okay as long as I have God on my side and he can do all things. He can work this out and he can help me make it on my own and he can also bring me someone else that is good for me. I believe in the power of God. I am not sticking my head in the sand but I am also not saying that God can't fix this marriage. Only time will tell.

Chosen, reading romance novels is not the equivalent to watching porn. Porn is basic sex with strangers and they are actors and there is nothing romantic about it. When I write novels lately I don't even put sex in it. They are mystery/suspense with romance but I haven't written or read any in quite a while. I am not expecting my h to be like a character out of one of my novels. Those men are perfect, my h is not.

I am very good at writing these and enjoy it but I am not doing that at this time but when I do it is centered on the mystery and not the sex or even how great the hero is. I can also invent any kind of situation and man I want and I like that. I haven't traveled much out of california so it gives me a chance to go places.

Forever, I want to thank you so much for what you said in your post and you had some good points. You are right in that the canyon is the only thing he has, his only outlet to make a difference and he does that, he has many awards for the hours he puts in and he knows the mayor because of this and more importantly, he loves it up there in the outdoors.

I did too when I was going up there. He is the type of man who has to do something and the canyon and tv is what he does and I realize he has given up the bar for me and so he has to have something to do. He cannot work full time and he works only a few hours at a time when he does paint and this is the first job he has done for free.

He's done 3 homes in the past year and was paid very well for it even though he didn't charge them what he would have professionally but the point was that he liked to do it, he enjoys it and I want him to be happy. You are right, he would be this way with or without me and I try not to take it personally but its hard when you are used to your h being one way and that suddenly changes.

Going up to the canyon is not an escape from our home, its just that he has to have something to do other than watch tv and this is what he has chosen. 1aokgal, he is not the McDonalds type of person because he wouldn't be too good at customer service. He gets impatient when someone is slow and if they insulted him or be rude he would let them know right off where they could go.

He has paid the bills and we've been fine but he just started worrying about his money from the news, which he watches all the time and I didn't pay for half of the household bills. I gave him money for half the rent but he would turn around and buy groceries with it and so it was actually going back into the house.

I want to clarify that he is not mean to me and does not have a mean streak. He is not purposely hurting me by not sleeping with me. I think he has the conditions I mentioned earlier in this post and I think he is dealing with it the way any man would. I think he m because he is not sexually dead yet but is afraid of what would happen if he couldn't stay erect like the last time we were together.

Yes, he could go and try to get help and yes he could tell me the reason why he's not sleeping with me anymore is because he can't perform but he will not do that and I don't want to put him through the embarrassment. This doesn't help my situation any but I don't think its deliberate. From knowing him as well as I do, I am assuming I know the reasons behind this whole thing.

There are certain facts, things that have happened that lead me to these conclusions and all of them are factors into what is happening and that is why he keeps telling me he loves me and kissing me and hugging me because he doesn't want me to think he doesn't care and leave him. He's said as much to me.

With all that said, it still doesn't help my frustration in not being with him. I cannot force him to talk to me but I know how to handle him in that he will want to talk to me. I can't force him to try and make love to me but I can make it so that he is comfortable enough to try and that means no demands and i'm not the demanding type usually. Only if I feel I'm being disrespected.

I have started requiring information from him more now though and he has no problem with answering my questions, I just don't like it that he doesn't just tell me without me having to ask. Most of the time I am tossed between showing him that I'm unhappy with this situation so that he will know that it is not okay, and just being happy with my life and showing him love and causing him to realize that I love him anyway, regardless of us not sleeping together.

I am always fighting the battle of these two feelings but as I am not a negative person it is hard to be mad just to let him know that I am unhappy, so I have been doing both. Not overly talkative and suspicious of him m. God said to trust him and so I must. I know women who live alone and have no man in their life at all.

No man loves them or they can't trust the one who says he loves them. For me to have a man who truly loves me is a gift most of the time. Sometime I feel like I truly hate him and other times I feel a lot of love for him. Mostly I feel unbelief that he hasn't tried to make love to me because it used to be so good.

And then it all boils down to how hard this must be for him. He is dealing with a lot too, worry about not being able to pay the rent, his ed or the effects of too much drinking possibly warping his mind at times and the fear that I'm going to bring up the fact that he doesn't sleep with me and the possibility of me finding someone else or just leaving him period.

Add onto that a active man who has always worked and was thrown into retirement early because of his back and suddenly he has no job to go to and has to do something with his time other than watch tv so he is big enough to go up to the canyon and offer his services.

I have volunteered up there too and I can tell you that there is nothing like doing something for someone without getting anything in return. You get such a sense of accomplishment and pride in just doing it, regardless of getting paid for it. It seems to mean more when you aren't getting paid for it. I don't know if you can understand that but that's the way it is.

When we would come home from the canyon together my whole attitude would be different. I would almost be euphoric in what I had just done and proud to wear the ranger uniform. When the two women left whom I was such good friends with, I left also because the woman up there now feels threatened by my administrative skills since she has none.

She is unprofessional and speaks without thinking and I had to put her in her place a couple of times and it just wasn't worth it. My h also had problems with her. I volunteered up there because to do so I had to pass the monrovia city requirements which was a background check and now I am qualified to work for the city which pays well.

More than that, I went up there so that he and I would have something in common and we did do so well when we were doing it together and so I may go up there but I don't want any complications with this woman. It is beautiful up there and you get an almost spiritual feeling and that is why it is so important to him and it was to me.

I would like to end this rather long post with this; he is more than a h and lover to me. He is my constant friend and companion. Life with him can be difficult and it can also be very good. Our relationship has changed and I knew it would happen eventually because of our age difference but it hadn't mattered for many years. I think I subconsciously want it the way it was in the beginning but that isn't realistic and changes do occur. Perhaps I'm being selfish in that I was it the way it was for the rest of my life but people get older and suffer the consequences of the lives they have led.

I am too young to live without sex and I'm not used to it from any man and because it is happening with this man whom I still love makes it even harder for me. I see him sometimes and I just want him, I've had a strong sex drive since I discovered I wasn't frigid and go confidence sexually and as a woman. I know it must frustrate him that he can't perform as he used to but that doesn't excuse him for not trying and at least saying things to make it better. I believe he is handling it the best way according to the way he thinks.

He has a lot of pride as a man as I do as a woman and so this must be very hard and yet I don't think he realizes how how it is for me. This is not just happening to him but to us and I think he needs to realize that. His frustrations with our finances are understandable since he's always taken care of everything but a man has certain responsibilities towards his wife and perhaps he feels he is failing in providing for me financially and physically.

He doesn't go to god like I do. He isn't just trusting god although he says he does but he needs constant contact with God and he forgets this and has admitting that he needs to just trust God. He hasn't been poor like I have been so this is new to him and this is what is causing such frustration. True love is trying to understand how the other person feels which I have a knack for but he does not. Maybe his fear of failing me in the sack is more overwhelming than trying and failing. His need for privacy regarding his finances is something he has to work on but he has come a long way.

He doesn't handle things right sometimes but I feel he thinks he's doing the best he can and he has said those exact words to me and he has also said he doesn't want me worrying about finances but he had a bad moment the other day when he was expressing his fears to me but at least he was expressing them and told me right out that he has to talk to me instead of keeping it inside. I know I have expressed to you my anger and frustration and I have also expressed my understanding of how hard this must be.

When I read the bible and pray I handle things much better and I haven't done that for a couple of days as I was caught up in other things but I got back to it this morning and I also read this little booklet called The Word For You Today and God speaks to me through this book. I always get something out of it and today this is what I got out of it; You must look to God for your answer and not people. You must keep believing in what God says. And you must not be influenced by people who do not share your vision. You must also position yourself to receive.

Baroness
21st August 2011, 02:31 AM
Helen, its not exactly a secret. I know how much he gets from social security and I eventually found out how much he gets from his attorney but I don't want to find out things later. He's always been up front with how much he gets from social security but when I found out he was getting money from his attorney and didn't tell me, I hit the roof.

We'd been waiting for years and for him to tell me it didn't have anything to do with me unhinged me and we had a big fight. This was years ago but because I was drinking vodka then he kind of focused on the fight we had because of vodka and never addressed what he said to me and I was so shocked that I acted like that while drinking that I forgot about it.

You see, when I would drink vodka and find out something that I didn't know and he didn't tell me, I immediately lash into him and there is a scene. I'm not drinking vodka now and haven't for two years so he can't blame anything on that and things have been kind of peaceful. His excuse was that he wanted to surprise me with a trip or something but I was still upset.

How could he see me day in and day out and not tell me about this? I quit asking for awhile because the answer was always the same and it got to where he didn't want to talk about it because he would tell me he was getting his money and then he wouldn't so he didn't want to get my hopes up. Fine. But when he actually got money from his attorney he should have told me and I would think he'd want to tell me.

I don't agree with what he did and that isn't the only time he did that which was why I was so upset. When we first moved in here we were waiting for insurance money and his storage that was destroyed and we decided when he got it we would buy a big screen tv.

Time would go by and no word from the insurance and so one day I asked him if he heard from them and he said yes and he bought a Harley Davidson motorcycle and wanted to surprise me by picking me up at work. The problem was that he can't see well enough out of one eyes to pass a motor cycle license and he had to have surgery.

I was upset that he hadn't told me but went out and looked at this motor cycle out of town, no less, and didn't say anything until I asked. How can you do all that and not share it with the woman you pick up from work? On what planet is it okay to do something like this and not tell your wife?

And how could he do it? How could he keep this secret, no matter what the reasons were. I started to not trust him after that and he knows how I hate to find out things later. I never understood this and even doubted there was a storage or a motorcycle but I heard him talk to my brother about it and he would never do that unless it was true.

He makes it hard to believe him or to think there's something else I don't know. Of course that was awhile back and nothing has happened like that since then but it took me a long time to believe him. He won't lie to me if I ask him a question right out, and he thinks keeping things from me isn't lying but I think it is.

He's been very honest about things since but he still is a very private person, and being an open and forthcoming person, I don't understand that. There are a lot of things I have to live with and have had to put up with, not just the lack of sex, and that is why I get so frustrated sometimes.

I even thought at one time that he was cheating on me and that's why he didn't sleep with me but I know he loves me and I eventually had proof that it was ed but you see what I mean? Once he kept a couple of things from me my faith in him wavered. I used to ride a Harley so I didn't mind him buying it, but I didn't like the way I found out.

Just like when he was going to the bars. He would leave the house for somewhere and then I wouldn't see him for hours and I would call the bar and there he was. He'd tell me he was coming home and wouldn't come home right away. I told him repeatedly that I didn't care if he went to the bar, I just didn't want to have to worry about where he was.

It got to where when he left the house I couldn't trust that he would come home and it would make me so mad. I don't care if he wants to go and hang out with his drunken friends, just have the decency to tell me about it. So what I did is while he was up at the canyon I hopped a bus and went down to our bar and stayed there all day and into the night.

I wanted him to see how it felt. My daughter called and he said he didn't know where I was but that he was keeping the phone right by him. I came home later that night and went straight to my room and went to bed. He wasn't mad at me but he said he'd been worried about me all day and night and I said, 'Good! Welcome to my world!' and he never did that again.

Helen_uk
21st August 2011, 02:52 PM
Baroness I'm the same as you , my first husband turned out to be a fantasist , I was kept in the dark about quite a few things . My last LTR was a liar and after that I've always insisted on the whole truth . It's a bit of a bugbear of mine .

I just think if there is complete openness in a relationship then everyone knows what's what .

My last ex used to say to me that he valued his privacy , I think there is a very thin line between privacy and secrecy and not mentioning something important is lying by omission .

It's so difficult when you love someone and want to trust them implicitly but your gut feeling is telling you not to.

Baroness
21st August 2011, 08:53 PM
Yes, in your heart you want to believe that they are keeping nothing from you but you can't ignore signs that cause you to mistrust them and also not knowing if you are imagining a problem or not. It's like with the m. I know very well he isn't doing it every time I walk into the room, but since I don't know for sure I'm always thinking he is.

The things I told you are in the past and I haven't had any recent issues but telling you about it reminded me of how unfair he has been in the past, but the past is the past and I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. As a person and a woman, I don't feel a great need to know everything about his finances or what he thinks, but I just don't want to find out later that I was kept in the dark because that really upsets me.

We have always had an easygoing relationship because neither one of us makes demands and this is good for both of us, but sometimes he acts like we're just dating or something so he doesn't have to tell me everything. But he is the way he is and I knew this when I got involved with him and he does love me and hopefully he will learn from his past mistakes.

I am a easy going person and not demanding at all but there are certain things I will insist upon and honesty is one of them and I don't care if he is deluding himself into thinking it isn't lying but just something he hasn't told me. He already knows this upsets me so he has no excuse if this happens again. I hate to be on edge regarding him and I already have to deal with the lack of sex.

Things are good between us now but not overly affectionate. We're friends and yet he loves me and I know this but I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that I don't demand a lot from him. This works both ways. I didn't want a demanding or needy man. I'm still an individual and I didn't want a man turning me into his version of what he thinks I should be and my h does not do that.

However; I don't think he understands what real love is. Sometimes its sacrifice and going out of your way to make sure your partner feels okay and that your actions haven't hurt them in any way. He is concerned about how I am taking this no sex thing so he tries harder to show affection and to tell me he loves me.

I will keep evaluating the situation, something I shouldn't even have to do, and see how it goes. I'm not in a position to support myself right now but when that time does come I will have to think about where we are because I'm certainly not going to grow older and die without ever having sex again. There is also the problem with his need to keep things to himself.

That needs to change and it has changed quite a bit since we first got together and I could even live with it except for not knowing and finding out later because that makes me feel like a fool. One time when I questioned him about it he said I should have known, the signs were there. That made me even more mad and I said I shouldn't have to dissect signs and play guessing games.

That was a long time ago and I know he trusts me more than any other person. I may be easy going and loving and very forgiving but there comes a time when and if it is done again, that I have to say enough. I'm not talking about the sex thing now, I'm referring to honesty. Today I am happy though.

I finished my latest hat and it is wonderful and completely different than what I thought it would be. I think I am obsessed with making these hats, the more I make them the better they are and I just want to keep designing these hats. It takes my mind off of everything else and i'm having a great time in the process.

I am a little concerned about making money doing this but 1aokgal has assured me that it can be done and I must trust her since she knows more about than I do, all I know is that this is a fantastic way to earn a living and I don't mind hours of hard work because of the results.

I have been looking for part time jobs so maybe I can get one since I do have experience. Thank you for taking the time to talk with me.

1aokgal
22nd August 2011, 01:59 AM
Hi Baroness...

The best thing might be for you to keep a diary, as you did before. That will let you go back to reread your thoughts and feelings and give you clarity on your marriage. The problems seem to be communication, financial, and sex. The communication seems a doorway to the other two areas.

I agree that the most critical issue pressed by your husband, seems to be finding a job, or at least work to income flow. The hatmaking you enjoy was my idea, as creativity does give one an outlet. I told you that victorian bonnets made with authentic patterns or reasonably authentic fabrics DO have a market. I know because I've sold them for years. I know other milliners who have waiting lists.

If you now buy vintage hats to recover them with feathers, glitter or veiling, that is not the same thing. I am sure if these hats are attractive, someone might buy them. You must have some idea of your market. What is the market? Is it a church hat or who would buy this item?

If you want to sell bonnets or hats to ladies who wear victorian clothing or is in theatre, that is a higher standard. One has to sew from an authentic pattern with a solid design. These standards are high, because the ladies have expendable income to spend on their hobby. They likely belong to a victorian club and realize others judge their hat. They will buy a fine bonnet or hat to accessorize an outfit they may have paid a thousand dollars or more to have made for them. Believe me, a pricey hat is needed but they won't buy a cheap vintage straw with a bow. So give yourself time to learn a craft. You can sell hats with lesser standards to begin, but you may just cover your costs and get a modest profit, which is the cost of learning.

Chamomile
22nd August 2011, 10:27 AM
Chamomile...

You always make astute observations and are concise to categorize the ongoing problems. You have a scientific mindset as you are so rational.
Your clear thinking and fairness is fresh air here, where religious extremism loses touch with truth, that all marriages aren't meant to survive.

I don't see this marriage as ever being a "regular folks" kind of marriage. Like you, I think if this guy has got enough juice left to go work free up the canyon, than he should work a shift at McDonalds', 7-11, or other employer that routinely hires senior workers. His "good old boy" outlook likes the the outdoors, while he works free to escape the house. He put no plan in place for his retirement years and changing marital beds cleaned him out before Baroness arrived on the scene. He can't be depended on to keep the lights paid now because, without her half income from the job B had, he can't keep the roof overhead.

He needed a woman like B, who asked few questions and accepted him when they hung out at the bars. He was a charming companion when lit! The fact is, he has isolated her and brow beats her now, because she is not emoloyed. He could get help for the ED but he doesn't care enough to do that and lives just for himself. B was willing to cook and wait on him and hold a job which brought half the income into the house before job loss. How handy was that! She was also quick to defend him if anyone questioned why she did these things.

A flow of side income from B (with her crafts) would help, but there needs to be some major income alterations in that household for these two to survive. If he folds from a one bedroom apartment to live on a puny social security check, I doubt they will survive anywhere. I think sex is not the important issue now, it is the need for both to find a dependable other income. As long as they do live together, it would be nice if he acknowledged her presence.

Baroness is a nice lady who may have chosen the wrong man at the wrong time in her life. They need a lot of intervention to survive the econemy and each other. I hope she knows we all want her happiness and pray for her.

Dear 1aokgal xxx

You make me blush so much with your compassionate, kindest and thoughtful comments about me as always. :) *Sending my warm Hugs*

You have always been so exceptional in ways you are supporting your "friends" whom you genuinely care about and I do so admire your valuable words of professional guidance in a number of different situations which I have personally witnessed.

baroness has been making a huge progress slowly yet steadily since she had started posting on this site and she's right that she shouldn't be the one who should move out (if the situation becomes further strained x)

Your love for others is so admirable. Yes, I agree that humanity needs to come first, before divinity sometimes. I believe that God is within your pure soul when you post in your care and love towards our brothers and sisters.

xxxxxx

Chamomile
22nd August 2011, 10:35 AM
I will address your comments one at a time but I do thank you for all the things you have said to help me. Chamomile, I realized I was being overly sensitive at certain times but it kind of depends what is said to me. I have my own mind and can think for myself so I don't like being told what to do and this is what made me sensitive.

It is probably because of my mother and others always telling me what to do, what is right to do according to God, that made me feel like they thought I didn't have a brain of my own. I am open to suggestions butI have a problem with certain posters only seeing things from my husband's side and telling me I just have to deal with it.



baroness xxx

You are a changed person in a very positive way! I agree, no one should tell you what to do. You have your own mind and you are far more self-aware these days thanks to your great sister of 1aokgal and her tireless commitment to guide you in your journey.

Good luck with your creative projects. You seem to be really good at what you are doing! :)

Hugs xxxx

1aokgal
22nd August 2011, 08:57 PM
Dear Chamomile...

Thank you for you comments on my postings.:p I spent some years fighting anger and also felt victimized and, "poor little me...why is this happening? How can he do this to me? What did I do to turn him off,etc.)
I heard all this in Baroness post along with the inward scream that reminded me of myself. You didn't know on this site, but I made a personal phone call her and we talked.

There was a need to alter things for Baroness, because she has nothing to do with his problems. Her mindset was poison which disables a person. I made suggestions to assist an interest and where she could alter at least, the income for a time. It is a little bandaide, but creativity can replace the feeling of helplessness. One has control over some factors and there is peace. That assists the ability to talk rationally with her husband and perhaps work out some issues.

Employment at this time is almost impossible to find. Her disability claim stands a two year waiting time. While I understand he likes going to the canyon, he should only be getting paid sideline jobs. Many men his age will do that for these times. Baroness is quick to defend his need to go be a "guy" thing, but it defies the reality of their economic needs. When a guy talks about folding a one bedroom apartment, he should be doing nothing freebie. That is my opinion.

It is great to see her composure is better. She enjoys the sewing which is a peaceful task. She can turn her interest and talent into a really good biz. I know more than a few who have done very well with these items.

We all realize when we post here we may not always like the advice we hear. Sometimes we lack clarity that others see from a distance. The great thing is there is a lot of problem solving collective in years of living here. All this advice is given free to one who needs input. While we all came to ASK, many stay to GIVE, and that is the humanity here. We do care.

Will her marriage survive the lack of intimacy and his need for "space" and
the tough times? Times are bad and many marriages will be tested. We hope things will go better for her.

Baroness
23rd August 2011, 12:57 AM
1aokgal, I do want to make the victorian hats but since discovering I like to do this I had to use what I had available. I plan on ordering a pattern to make the bonnets but I looked up the years you suggested 1870-1880 and nothing below 1860 and a lot of those hats are straw and almost like a teardrop hat.

I'm interested is sewing the bonnets but many of what I saw on that link you sent me were not what I was thinking as to bonnets. It was kind of confusing because you suggested the Regency didn't sell as well. I want to do the ones that sell well and that women will order for their victorian outfits. I also like to do the ones I've done so far and you haven't seen the last two and I'm working another one now.

Since I'm new at this I need your guidance in which type of hat is the best. Since I saw several styles I'm not sure which one to do. It is also confusing because there are so many and I'm not experienced enough to know which ones would sell the best other than what you said, I had to start with a pattern.

There is a bonnet I am going to make because I like it and I saw it on ebay and at the time I wasn't considering a certain year. I also got confused I guess because of some of the hats on etsy. I liked some of them very much but unsure as to the time frame they are from even though I have researched them. I like to make all kinds of hats but I want to make money at it too so I have to somehow narrow it down.

Helen, as to what we were talking about with the trust issue with my h and about things he keeps to himself, I ran a credit check on him and i'm happy to say that there are no hidden issues I need to worry about. His credit report was spotless and I read things on there that he had told me about and it gave me great comfort to know he hadn't lied or kept anything from me.

Chamomile, thanks for being supportive through all this. I feel I have come a long way too although I still have moments of frustration and I still think this is a great injustice to me. He's very quiet today and I tried to talk to him but he would only answer yes or no so I told him I give up. He asked me today if I had a movie I wanted to watch and I said no.

I think he felt bad about always watching reruns and not asking me what I want to watch and we did watch a movie the other day but my life is more than about movies and who wants to watch what. I have hats to make and the more I sew the more it comes back to me and I love to do this. I can sit out there and watch a movie but not two in a row because I need to be doing something.

He went out today and bought some groceries so apparently we aren't as broke as I thought and he also left me some money. I don't know what the other day was about but I think he worries about stuff that hasn't happened yet. We can afford this apartment so I don't know what all the excitement was about. I also found out that these payments he gets from his attorney are workman comp. payments and he will be getting them for the rest of his life.

My attorney told me that disability cases can range from one year to five and there are three steps and I am at the third step because of all that i've done before and it should only be another 3 months at the most and if I am denied I have to think about whether I want to pursue this any further. I don't want to be doing this for years so getting a job would be the best thing but not exactly easy.

I asked myself today why I can't just let this go, this non sex thing. Why can't I just accept it and make the best of it without feeling like I'm missing something and need to have it back in my life. That's when I think about leaving or him leaving, because he seems incapable of communicating and incapable of making an effort to make this better.

It frustrates me when he doesn't respond to me when I'm trying to have a conversation with him and then finally makes me angry so I just come in here because I'm tired of dealing with it. He's off in his world of tv and also thinking about things and I have to pull everything out of him and I'm sick of doing that.

Sometimes, though, he talks so much to me that I can't get him to shut up, usually when he's had a beer but not always. I don't think his beer drinking is a problem since he doesn't get falling down drunk and he hasn't had a beer since my birthday on the 4th or maybe a day or so after that.

I have not stopped writing in my diary. I write in it via computer every single day unless I go somewhere all day which is rarely. Just because there were comments about the negativity of keeping a diary didn't mean I would change anything. I have always kept a diary and I always will. I can go back and see things and sometimes they are good and sometimes they are not.

I will put a poem on here that I wrote years ago when all this lack of sex thing had just started and this is a poem about that and I was surprised to read that he hadn't made love to me in almost a year. I thought that was horrible and we have made love since then but its getting close to a year since our last successful encounter.

I can't believe I haven't had sex in almost a year and I can't believe it was that way a few years back. There is something wrong with this man. Not just the ed, but not even wanting to connect on some physical way. And especially in him not caring how I feel about this.

I bet you anything he is just counting the days until I leave him. He's mentioned to me before that he can't believe I am still with him and now with this situation I bet he expects me to leave any time. He knows I don't want to give up this home so he's pretty sure I will ask him to leave instead and he also knows that I can't make it on my own so maybe he thinks he can do whatever he wants.

Regardless of what he thinks, he will have to answer to God for treating me unfairly in this. I should have left when this first started happening but it didn't until I lost my job. These days I spend more time thinking about God and my hats than I do him. My focus is not on him all the time anymore, its on my relationship with God and the hats I create and when I'm working on them I don't give him a second thought.

In a way I'm happier than I ever have been because I've discovered a new creative side to myself and I am determined to succeed. In another way i've never been more unhappy with my m. Sometimes I think I spend too much time thinking about all this when I should just be out doing something. I have already started doing that with the hats but I want to start seeing my best friend more since she lives near here and is single.

Just because he's happy with sitting in front of the tv all the time, it doesn't mean I have to be chained here, and God help the man who tries to chain me to anything in any way!!:D

Baroness
23rd August 2011, 01:15 AM
The Dark Room 2009

I'm writing this poem and I'm holding nothing back, this is how I truly feel
I am in a deep depression and it's the only thing that truly seems real
I am so sick of him ignoring me and treating me like just a friend
This has been ongoing for years now and I don't see the end
He doesn't understand anything and God knows I've tried
But I'm weary with trying to figure it out and something inside me has died

What is this? What happened to him and why does he think this is okay?
Where is it written that women are always the one's to pay?
I wake up in the morning and wonder what I'm getting up for
another day of emptiness, I am truly alone on the shore
He thinks it's okay, he thinks because I love him I will ignore the rest
but he doesn't care anymore and isn't even trying to do his best

I don't know why I continue to stay here and have my confidence shaken
when what I really need is for someone to come along and make me feel quite shaken
I have done my best
he has failed the test
I do everything for him and smile while I'm doing it
but he just looks at me and obviously doesn't feel like pursuing it

I am lonely and I haven't truly been touched in over a year
I am left alone with my doubts and what I truly fear
Is something going on that I know nothing about?
and how long is it going to take me to figure it out?
Is he having an affair?
Does he cheat when I'm not there?

I am suspicious of everything
and I can't count on anything
How much longer can I take this, how have I even endured this long?
Why am I in a relationship that is not fulfilling and seems so very wrong?
Is he counting on my love for him to keep me in control?
What I feel for him isn't enough and I no longer have a goal

I used to look forward to making love at least once a week
but he will get offended if about this I dare to speak
What is wrong with him? He used to be so good
I never had to say anything, he always did what he should
Now we are two strangers because he doesn't even know me
he has no idea that a lot of the time I just want to be free

But there are no guarantees in life and I hate to leave someone I love
it's been over a year and I don't know what he could have been thinking of
What makes him think I will just put up with this and listen to his excuses?
Wanting him and not having him is just one of his abuses
I can't talk to him, he likes to pretend that everything is okay
but I have reached the end of my patience and it came to a head yesterday

Depression enveloped me and took me far away
I'm locked up in a dark room and I can't see the light of day
I resent him and I don't trust him anymore
if I can't feel alive then what am I living for?
In this dark room I don't feel alive and I have no strength to fight
there is no way out, I'm chained here, I can't see the light

Who does he think he is to treat me like I'm not even here?
My depression and sorrow have engulfed me and nothing is clear
He asks me what's wrong and I can no longer pretend
I just want this roller coaster ride from hell to finally end
I keep thinking if I wait awhile he might want me like he used to
but I can't get a reaction out of him no matter what I wear or what I do

For me as a woman this is unbelievable
that a man wouldn't want to be with me is inconceivable
All we have between us is memories and they are fading fast
I no longer see this as something that is going to last
But the worst of it all is that I still want him and I even let him know
but his lack of response cuts me and so my resentment continues to grow

He has taken the best of me and beaten me down until I can't even think
there will be no peace for me until I break this link
But until then I am in this dark room with not a shred of light
that's it, I give up, I have given up the fight
You have nothing to give me and this makes me sick
what a waste that you no longer know what to do with it

I have treated you better than any woman and look what you've done
you have taken the life from me, you are willing to live in a life with no fun
When I finally get out of this dark room I will find a way to break free
and when I go the only thing you will be left with is a feeling of missing me
I didn't want to give up, I tried for so long but you don't care how I feel
so one day I will find a way to again make life seem real

I have tried and been denied for about three long years
I loved you and just set aside my fears
but I can't let you completely destroy me and that's what you're trying to do
You will wake up on the day that I finally say we're through
You have treated me badly in the past
but I just wanted this to last

I loved you more than any man before
but now it will be your turn to be alone on that shore
You have kept your secrets and weren't too good at playing your part
you have taken from me and then you smashed my heart
You have underestimated your opponent
You screwed up so now it's time to own it

I have left you already, you just don't know it yet
I leave you with your loneliness and you will see how bad it can get
I hope you realize before too long that you are destroying us, but somehow I doubt it
I will regain my strength because I have no intention living the rest of my life without it

The memories will be hard to deal with but in time they will start to fade away
but here in this dark room I see no reason to stay
It's too bad you chose the course to destroy me
you have lost the ability to simply enjoy me
Time is slowly running out
but I can't stay until you figure it out

You will eventually lose me and when that happens, you won't be the same
No matter where you go or what you do, Mr.Man, you will always remember my name.

Chamomile
23rd August 2011, 09:12 AM
Dear Chamomile...

Thank you for you comments on my postings.:p

You didn't know on this site, but I made a personal phone call her and we talked.

There was a need to alter things for Baroness, because she has nothing to do with his problems.

That assists the ability to talk rationally with her husband and perhaps work out some issues.

When a guy talks about folding a one bedroom apartment, he should be doing nothing freebie. That is my opinion.

It is great to see her composure is better. She enjoys the sewing which is a peaceful task. She can turn her interest and talent into a really good biz. I know more than a few who have done very well with these items.

We all realize when we post here we may not always like the advice we hear. Sometimes we lack clarity that others see from a distance. The great thing is there is a lot of problem solving collective in years of living here. All this advice is given free to one who needs input. While we all came to ASK, many stay to GIVE, and that is the humanity here. We do care.

Will her marriage survive the lack of intimacy and his need for "space" and
the tough times? Times are bad and many marriages will be tested. We hope things will go better for her.

Dear 1aokgal xxxx

You really are indeed, an angel in disguise. :) Your emotional intelligence and helpful guidance towards others on this site had proven to be so remarkable and effective. You rock! Baroness has been a fine example of your spiritual intervention!

Since baroness is far more aware recently that any advice or observations she hears on this site may not be at all palatable but they are not meant to upset her or challenge her out of spite etc. There's always an analogy of sweets and dental work. Dentists may hurt you but they solve problems e.g. fixing your rotting teeth or tooth. Sweets might taste nice for a short while but they can rot your teeth. Some of us on here do say what we think for exactly the reason which you so intelligently described in your post. Knowing baroness seems to be much happier right now with her new project, I'm sure things will continue to get better further with your guidance.

I'm also still learning from your insightful posts as well. I really do love about this Christian & non-Christian Women's Collective on here! It provides a huge empowerment and support.

xxxxx

1aokgal
23rd August 2011, 03:45 PM
Dear Chamomile..

I address this to all of our posters and we become like family.

We all know the forum is a helping place. We can post, in a concise manner about our basic problems. I don't believe in high drama long posts with every thought and feeling (diary style) posted. I don't read maudlin tragedy poetry, which is depressing to some, because that is too personal and serves no purpose. Maybe we can keep this place for encouragement for all?

I know when here it is for an exchange of ideas for a positive experience. Don't burden me with your every family argument or negative experience because that doesn't add a positive thing here for anyone. This forum is not a substitute for psychiatry or counselling, as we are not professionals, though we might come equipped with education and experiences that are helpful to others.

Let's not depress others with our sad problems played out like a production. Let's stop thinking like a victim, immersed in a drama, and see what is possible to change with some input from others. When we have ideas, we can share them. Sometimes a fresh approach makes things better. I just don't like to see all the negatives of anothers' life posted here like a trunk of woe dumped on the rest of us. Let's not compete for attention because we all live with some problems.

I think you understand I mean this respectfully for all.
xxxxoox

Baroness
24th August 2011, 05:31 AM
Harsh words, 1aokgal, but I get your point and it certainly wasn't my intention to burden anyone or depress anyone. Everything I say is what I am feeling and the poem was just to show others that I am in exactly the same situation except that it isn't as bad as it was. These are just my feelings and I can only express them on here.

However; you are right in some of what you say. To continue to talk about my problems in this manner isn't really helping me rise above it and I'm sure others are tired of hearing it. I am not upset, I might have been previously but I have learned to take criticism with more of an open mind than I had before. I could have done without the 'maudlin tragedy poetry' and the 'manure' comment.

I come here because this is the only place where I can express how I am feeling and it is also the place that has helped me quite a lot and so now I can see that I have been stuck in a place where I talk about my problems with my h and because I do, it is depressing me as well. I mainly talk about the things in my life because I wanted others to understand where I was coming from.

I wanted you all to know me and my h better so you would understand me better. However; talking about the past is not helping me get over this. I made up my mind earlier today that I would just have to let it go. I have to rise above and continue on with my life even though it isn't perfect, but whose is?

You have to forgive me, 1aokgal, and remember that this is a new thing for me, to come on here and express myself, I have not lived a lot of years with this and so I was just reaching out to everyone so I could make sense of it all. To let it go is very difficult but I have done better today and I had to train my mind to not dwell on negativity and to not complain and to just rise about it.

Talking about it over and over again, even if there are new things that happen, is not productive for me. I have changed very much since I came on here. I am no longer a victim of my own torment but have found a way to deal with it and God has helped me very much. I have discovered a creative side I didn't know about and this has enabled me to see beyond what is happening to me personally.

It has given me a purpose and I am not discouraged anymore. I am looking forward to life again and while it isn't possible to forget the past, it is certainly possible to learn from it. He and I are doing better and I am hopeful that we will continue to do so. I just refuse to be unhappy anymore and have decided to be thankful for what I do have.

I have a man who loves me and no matter what his physical body is going through, his heart still belongs to me.

I do apologize to everyone for being so down lately and I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone, I was just under the impression that it was okay to talk about how I felt and now I feel a little uncomfortable doing so. I thank you all for all your help and your insight and I don't know how I would have made it without you. Nothing has really changed here regarding this situation, but I have changed and surely that is a good thing.

1aokgal
24th August 2011, 07:01 AM
Dear Baroness..

While I don't mean to be unkind, you also can't play the same song repeatedly and expect that your life or your situation will improve. Your ideas are very set and and you are a DOER you told us, but what you seek has been sympathy. That won't help you with coping skills for your situation.

This problem , you said, was of short duration, but a review of your notes and memories says this has been going on longer than a year.
How long has he been working at the canyon? Did the problems start before that or did the problems start after he began to be there for the days? Just trying to see what changed in the last year.

A rehash of your story in response to others' posts deny another poster a chance to be heard, as you have gained center stage again. Somehow the reality of your situation has to be that this is not the worst thing that could ever happen to you. This situation is not wonderful, but in a sense it should not be a surprise or the ultimate tragedy.

You chose this man with open eyes and knew he had a problem with alcohol. You knew he lives his life selfishly and hardly communicates he is so introverted. He was no scintillating conversationalist nor are there many interests you wanted to share. I find it hard to hit a common denominator that got you coupled! You knew these things about him, but you expected he would change for you. When women do that then she is a FIXER. One who needs the ultimate ego boost, as she thinks a bad boy will change stripes for her. Then, when that doesn't happen, she is disappointed.

I think your h. altered a lot for your life together, but he is still not the domestic type. This is like cornering a mountain lion and then wonder why he has problems sipping tea. Like you, I wonder what makes him tick.

Sometimes I wonder if your man is passive aggressive in his withholding of sex? You don't share a lot in what you both like. Other than TV, is there something else you both enjoy doing together? So either it is a bar scene or it is hours of TV. It is just too bad you can't spend some time being somewhere together where you actually have to talk to each other. Who knows how interesting that would be.
So long as he has withdrawn himself this is going to hurt and cause upset. If you can't get him to see a doctor than he has no intent to change this pattern which works for him. When it is a question of ED there are pills, tests, pumps and modes to work with this and men who do it keep marriages intact and satisfied. It has to matter to him. If it doesn't, than you have to work through your own needs and find some happiness. You have time on your hands until you are employed or work hard to make this business work for you.

I do think you have changed a lot since you came to the forum. The changes are all positive. It is unfair what has happened in the marriage and we can only hope your prayers and social skills can change some of that.

I'm glad you enjoy the creative work. That can take you a long ways so long as you study a bit about the era styles. Like you, I can spend a pleasant time to plan a new project and enjoy to see it completed in my imagination. I have other items so I don't get into a rut and find a good market with my outlets.
Yesterday was interesting, because my area is 100 miles from the hurricane 100 miles from here. There are also two nuclear power stations close by. It wasn't as strong as I experienced in SF but causes one to pause to be thankful for a life that is mostly good.

Baroness
24th August 2011, 05:45 PM
Him working at the canyon has nothing to do with this. He's been up there since 2003. I do not come on here to get sympathy, I come on here to get another posters point of view. Being center stage never crossed my mind. The thing that brought us together is God and the fact that neither one of us is demanding and lets the other do what they want with full support, also we were attracted to one another and still are.

I never wanted to change him and I didn't want to take a 'bad boy' and fix him. It is not my job to fix him or any man I've been with, I have always accepted men the way they are because you cannot change another person. We have a very strong love between us and I understand that you don't get the volunteering and doing something just because you love it but I am very proud of him for this.

I don't need an ego boost, as you call it and I've already stated that there are times when he does talk to me, just not as much as I would like but that's something I just have to accept about him and I have until this ed thing. He is very much the domesticated type, we have been together for nine years and have worked as a unit to create a beautiful home and we see eye to eye on almost everything.

As for going to the doctor, you know from your own personal experience that there are men who won't go and even if they do will not try to work on things. He is not with holding sex as payback or any other reason, he has ed and doesn't want to risk disappointing me, its as simple as that. As Forever said, he is older, nine years older than me and he has to do something with his life so he volunteers and paints once in awhile.

He is retired and he doesn't have to go out and find a job, he had to retire early and this put him in a tailspin because he was used to working. I really don't think the harshness of your last posting was necessary and I was actually shocked to read the things you wrote. It's like you are dictating to everyone how they should post and I wasn't aware that anyone was in charge on this site. I know that is your opinion but if you'd said those things to anyone but me it could have caused a lot of damage.

I have to admit that I was upset last night thinking about what you said and how you said it and couldn't quite believe you were saying those things to me. You yourself have repeated yourself as to what a wonderful life you had before your h starting not wanting sex. I don't consider a few beers once in awhile an alcoholic problem. He is dealing with everything the best he can and he has to deal with a lot, the affects of the economy, getting older and carrying the whole burden of the household.

I don't believe in just putting the whole financial responsibility on the man when you can help with working or whatever. It is a unit, you work together, not depend on a man to take care of you. You know that because you make your own living. I didn't marry him so he would take care of me, I can take care of myself and in time I will again. He has been very generous with money from time to time and does nice things for me, he bought me this new computer I am on now and many times just gives me money to go shopping.

We do have other things in common, we are both big football and basketball fans and enjoy watching it together and even going to the bar for the superbowl party to be with friends. We also enjoy spending time with my family. We used to go out to dinner a lot and to the movies and still go to the movies once in awhile. This isn't about controlling another person or demanding answers.

As a christian woman I don't feel the need to demand anything because that is just forcing him to tell you what you want to know. He usually tells me eventually but I just get frustrated when I am confused. I am confused now because I don't know what you expect me to do now that you've accused me of wanting sympathy and posting too much about my life. What else am I going to talk about?

Aren't we all on here to talk about our life and the problems we are now facing? It was my understanding that this is what this post was for, and now you tell me I'm taking up someone else's time and that I shouldn't be saying what I have said. Are there rules for this thread that I am unaware of? I've already told you that I have decided not to dwell on this so much anymore and you are the one that is still talking about my posts and what I shouldn't be doing.

I think its important for all of us to think carefully before telling someone what to do or not to do. The wrong words, or harsh words can destroy a person and I'm not just talking about me here. A weaker person might not be able to handle it. It isn't up to another person to judge whether my h should go out and get a job or he should do this or that.

God has the power to change anyone, he's changed me already in a couple of months, so it isn't up to us to say this man or that man is just the way he is and will never change and that he is selfish or cruel. I have a good man who is dealing with a lot and the atmosphere around here has lightened up considerably.

I do enjoy making the hats and having my mind on other things but that isn't going to fix any problem I am now dealing with. I enjoy it because it gives me a sense of purpose and accomplishment and I will continue to do so because it makes me happy. It cannot take the place of what is lacking here but I have turned it over to God and he alone knows the mind of a man or woman heart.

I am not asking for my h to change, things happen in a marriage and this is just one of them. My posts are about me dealing with not knowing what was wrong and bouncing it off others to get a clearer understanding and this I have accomplished. 1aokgal, you have helped me quite a lot during this time and I do thank you for helping me see that sometimes its good to focus on something else.

I was reminded of the good things in my h through posts on here and also reminded that this isn't an earth shattering thing but it sure feels like it when it first happens to you. You have dealt with this for a long time, many years, I have not and I am just doing the best I can. Don't you remember how hard it was for you at first to deal with this? Didn't you think about it constantly and were frustrated and confused?

I have thought about not posting on here anymore because your words confused me and yes, upset me a great deal, but I need to know from everyone here if I am still welcome here. If everyone feels the way 1aokgal feels then I will find another post or not talk to anyone about it. I don't intend to rehash things that have already happened but I don't want confrontation either or to feel bad about what someone has said.

My email is janlestat@gmail if any poster feels uncomfortable about addressing this subject on this thread. I am not apologizing anymore. 1aokgal, in fairness to you I think that maybe you didn't intend to insult me or criticize me and I've always admired you. It seemed deliberate to me but I am done with jumping to harsh conclusions and sometimes that is hard.
Regardless of what goes on from here regarding this thread, I do want to thank you for taking the time with your advice on the hats.

Helen_uk
24th August 2011, 06:11 PM
Baroness , speaking for myself I think it's because it's frustrating that we can't find a way to advise that will help your situation and it's hard to see someone we have come to think of as a friend being brought low by a problem that requires partly , in all honesty , the husband to be able to communicate more.

I don't think anyone is asking you to apologize .

You are so obviously a warm and loving person with a creative streak and I would, as a friend, wish you to have a more fulfilling marriage on the fronts where you tell us it's lacking . For myself I don't post often on your thread as I'm wary of making you feel defensive , nobody is attacking your H , but trying to support you.

chosen
24th August 2011, 07:14 PM
My one desire and prayer Baroness, is that this marriage will carry on and thrive despite this problem that you have at the moment. I would hate to see you go though another marriage break up. I also strongly believe that God can do miracles, but sometimes we need to be patient.

Chamomile
24th August 2011, 07:56 PM
Him working at the canyon has nothing to do with this. He's been up there since 2003. I do not come on here to get sympathy, I come on here to get another posters point of view.

We have a very strong love between us and I understand that you don't get the volunteering and doing something just because you love it but I am very proud of him for this.

I am confused now because I don't know what you expect me to do now that you've accused me of wanting sympathy and posting too much about my life.

Aren't we all on here to talk about our life and the problems we are now facing?

I think its important for all of us to think carefully before telling someone what to do or not to do. The wrong words, or harsh words can destroy a person and I'm not just talking about me here. A weaker person might not be able to handle it.

I have thought about not posting on here anymore because your words confused me and yes, upset me a great deal, but I need to know from everyone here if I am still welcome here.



Hi

I know that 1aokgal is down to earth and I realize sometimes, it hurts when we hear something we'd prefer to remain oblivious but it could be something which may help you/us in a long run when someone is brave enough to speak out for you/us.

I agree with Helen too. I tend to think that we end up getting confused by your conflicting posts. One minute, you're so so upset about your h's shortcomings and your heart is "ripped apart" and once posters suggest something, you, in turn retract what you already said about your h as if you never said anything so negative about your h in your posts yourself? And you do resent responses and you were so offended by them. Then you start posting how wonderful your h has been to you all of a sudden.

Perhaps, you can re-read what you had posted from the beginning and you may find the same cycle of grievances - followed by our responses - your resentment of suggestions and responses, "how dare you criticize my h!" lashing out on posters who happened to try to help you.

And, so predictably, you start describing how "nice" your h has been and how dare we criticized about her h! You do tend to bounce back and forth, you say, he is so awful to you once and the next (usually after someone pointed out that he can be better) you say "how dare you put my h down!" etc etc. This just goes on and we are confused by these conflicting posts. This is why 1aokgal suggested you to keep things in your diary as these are simply venting and you are unlikely to tolerate any suggestions very kindly. Once suggestions are made, you get upset, or get irritated etc.

Of course, there's nothing wrong with you posting and anyone can post as they want. But I can see frustrations in 1aokgal who does go extra miles for her friends. You don't find someone like her so often in this day and age.

Helen_uk
24th August 2011, 08:18 PM
Chamomile,

Well done for putting so succinctly what I was trying to say :) . You phrased it so much better than I can :)

1aokgal
24th August 2011, 11:22 PM
It seems like Baroness has different sides as a twin from day to day. She will ask for honest advise, but will resent the one who rationally gives it. There are constant inconsistencies in the moods and when a poster gives suggestions she shifts to a defense mode or resents the suggestions. Most of us saw certain things in the same light but she will defend the status quo. Somehow that doesn't make sense. It is also depressing to read the minute to minute conflicts from her house.

The litany of the day to day was beyond what anyone can expect others to digest. My suggestion was for her to diary her moods and problems and not a way to police the thread, but to make it productive for all and not a dumping ground for one. I guess that is harsh but truthful.

OMG, do I understand the fury of this lonely problem as it chops away at the identity of a woman and her life. The sexual problems/emotional dysfunctions of her h won't be solved by posters here. The enigma exists in her husbands mind and undershorts. He won't change and she knows it and resents that we suspect that as well. Miracles do happen, but it seems this one is far out there! Unable to change that situation, her frustration was hurtful to her health.

I tried to get her beyond the physical, to the emotional, where her affection for him could remain and her daily life is productive. As chosen would say, faith is displayed and maybe he feels left out as she does so well.
The playing out of every day as a drama in anothers' bedroom seemed depressing, and doesn't embrace the other 90% that is good. My husband in 2010 with had colon Cancer and endured Chemo/radiation and 4 surgeries. He has two more to surgeries due next year. He is Cancer free for as long as God gives him. That is a real problem and not whether sex is a reality or not in a marriage. That's how I see it or maybe I am wrong? I never ceased to love or value him and we went through this time with my devotion and loyalty, as he had it all these years. That is a real problem.

That is not demeaning anothers' problems.
I hope we could bring the forum around again to optimism, faith and caring and not personal "cretching." I have spent a lot of time on Baroness problems. My phone bill paid this month reflects the long call I made to her to bring her up. It was the one step more. Now I'm the bad guy?
For once, I am speechless!

Baroness said to me, " I am not apologizing anymore. 1aokgal, in fairness to you I think that maybe you didn't intend to insult me or criticize me and I've always admired you. It seemed deliberate to me but I am done with jumping to harsh conclusions and sometimes that is hard."
As I said, I am speechless!

When someone posts here there are going to be suggestions from others you might not like to hear. If your mind is set...why ask?

1aokgal
24th August 2011, 11:44 PM
Chamomile...

Little analytical you, who can recap Freuds' theories dead-on! Yes, confusing is the key. :-)
After the conflicted postings, come the retractions, then the sting for the responder. You phrased it well and I couldn't get it across.

BTW...how goes it with you and the house for sale and your progess?

Did you know I am 100 miles from the earthquake epicenter yesterday? That was a strange occurrence and was felt from the NY stock exchange as far south as Atlanta, Georgia.
I was standing in my kitchen talking to my A/C guy in the garage there, as he made his yearly check of the system. Imagine the floor starts moving and I look at my feet and think I might be ready to pass out since the floor seems to shift. Kitchen floors don't move! It was over that quick. The TV news said the east coast hit by 5.8 earthquake.

Thirty years ago in San Francisco my rented house had major shifting in an earthquake. Now we are near two nuclear power stations in the earthquake. They shut down two generators rather than have a Japan incident. Sunday, hurrican Irene is due to hit here with major force. It looks like that will be a sewing day inside. I live on the coastline, but inland enough to be fine.
Now life is pretty dull next to this! xxooxx

Baroness
25th August 2011, 07:18 AM
Chamomile, the last time you posted you said how much better I was doing and how I wasn't defensive anymore, and now you are saying I'm all over the place. so I'm the one confused here. I wasn't upset by what 1aokgal was saying, just the words she used, which were harsh and I can't believe no one else can see that.

It isn't necessary to be insulting to get your point across. Yes, I agree, my postings are conflicting and I don't have to go back and read them to know that. Sometimes I get frustrated and angry with my situation and then other times I have better days where I try not to think about it and occupy myself with other things.

No matter how hard I try to deal with it, I'm having a hard time and I freely admit that. I have been doing a lot better and was thinking I could let it go and just deal with it and move on. That's when I read 1aokgal's post where she said those things in a very harsh way and I was upset. I didn't think it was necessary to use words like 'manure' and so forth.

Lately things have been going well and so I didn't understand. I thought you all would be interested in my life and how it was going. I'm only defensive when I am insulted and I just can't understand why someone has to be rude to me to get their point across. I am not used to being talked to that way because I don't do it.

I am not always defensive when someone gives me advice and a lot of the advice and viewpoints have helped me very much. Haven't you ever heard of good days and bad days? Sometimes I'm fine and other times I'm not and I'm sure you've had days like that. This is my first time posting on any thread and so I'm new at it.

I just thought it was great that I could say whatever I wanted, things I can't tell anyone else. I am just trying to deal with this and it is very hard for me because usually I would have just walked out the door. I have discovered a lot of things about myself since I've been on here, things good and things I've been doing wrong.

I am just so used to thinking one way about this; negatively, and so now I have to change the way I think and that is rather difficult. There is no big mystery here, I am not a split personality, I am just a woman trying to deal with a man who doesn't sleep with her anymore. For those of you who don't know what that's like, I can't begin to tell you how devastating it can be.

However; I can't very well be devastated for the rest of my life, now can I? I'm so tired of thinking about this and talking about this because except for the change in me, it isn't really helping me to keep talking about it. I want to rise above it and just deal with it. Do you think I like being happy one day and miserable the next?

Before reading the post from 1aokgal, I had read one from her in my personal email where she was talking about this but in a different way and I started thinking about it and decided that she was right, for me to keep talking about this was depressing and it was time to move on and stop feeling like a victim, and start being the victor.

So I decided to just accept what is happening and when I did he started getting better about talking to me and I have been cheerful and joking around with him and I feel better and I have asked God to help me stop complaining, even to myself because I don't think that's pleasing to God and it isn't exactly making me jump for joy either.

Anyway, I think its a good idea to look at the positive aspect of this and that is that I do have a man who loves me and I love him too, I'm just sad at the way things are now. I had such high hopes for us and it hasn't turned out like I thought it would but I have no problems with him other than his lack of sexual desire.

And of course I stick up for him, he's my man and we basically work together as a couple and I wouldn't even have a problem with the way he is except for what has been happening for the past year or so. It will be okay, I will be okay, I always am and I'm not going to give up. If I do it will be because there is no hope at all and then it will be time to move on.

I think the key here is that I continue to read the bible and pray because I seem to do better when I do. I don't know what else to say, a lot of things have been said lately and now I just want to move on. There are a lot of things in life that can be very good and I am looking forward to seeing what God has in store for me.

chosen
25th August 2011, 11:43 AM
Having a man who loves you and who you love, is so precious. Hold on to that. So many people have no one. I got so worried because you kept talking about leaving him and really your marriage is worth more than that. I supposes its the cup half full or half empty thing. and being thankful for what we do have rather than what we dont. No marriage will ever be perfect, and no man or woman is ever meant to meet all of their spouses needs, God is the only one who can meet our deepest needs.

Baroness
25th August 2011, 05:18 PM
You are right, Chosen, and I guess I have been wanting a perfect relationship according to the way I think it should be and this can never be. I think I understand what I've been doing wrong. I ask you all to be patient with me and I admit that I have been too sensitive and jumping to defense mode and I am going to work on that.

All I can say is that I'm not experienced in posting and so I just say what I feel but I realize it can be very frustrating for those who read my posts because there isn't really anything you can say or do to help me and sometimes I get really depressing, don't I? I don't mean to be, I have always been a very positive person.

God has helped me see some things regarding this and I have no problem with changing something about myself to make myself better in the long run. I love to talk to people and even more to help them by relating to something they have gone through but lately its been all about me and I didn't even realize I was doing this.

I guess I was reacting to being upset by my h and I have dealt with that issue too and am doing much better. I want to hear what you have to say and I want to stop being so negative, something I never thought I would be. I am thankful that you take the time to talk to me even though I have gone overboard at times.

Perhaps you have suggestions on how to post? I just come on here and say whatever I feel and so I don't know what I should or shouldn't say. I do know it isn't necessary for me to talk about my day; incident to incident but I came on here because of what I was going through and now that I am better with the situation I don't know exactly what to say and not be considered saying too much.

I promise not to be so defensive in the future and try to realize that no one is trying to insult me, but help me and if you didn't care you wouldn't bother telling me things that I might not want to hear. At first I was just shocked that everyone had this reaction to what I said and then I thought about it and realized that I have been going overboard a lot of the time.

The fact that I can admit this to myself is more proof that I have changed quite a bit, I would never have admitted this to myself a few months back. I won't apologize since you've told me not to but I will change the way I've been posting.

The problem is that I've always been very open with my feelings and am unsure as how to reign them in. I will pray about it and work on it and if you still care to hear from me then I will appreciate your understanding.

It also occurs to me that perhaps my h isn't the one totally responsible for the problems I am having with him. Granted, he has ed and he isn't sleeping with me, but perhaps my expectations are too high in this relationship. Maybe I am wanting a perfect relationship when I can't have one, no one can, and because I want things to be the way I think they should be, I'm getting mad at him for not being the perfect husband.

I need to realize that we are only human and things happen but that doesn't mean you just walk away because everything is not to your liking. If love is there then surely there is hope and I have to stop being so unhappy because of things that change in this marriage. Yes, he has a problem but he isn't the only one who has issues and I never realized that before. I thought I was this perfect wife and he was flawed and that is very presumptuous of me, isn't it?

Instead of always praying that he will change and do what I want, I should be praying for my own attitude and stop complaining about every little thing and be happy with what I do have, which is a lot. I have my health, a good mind and a man who respects me and maybe can't help the way his body is. This is a very big enlightenment for me. Maybe that's what God was trying to show me all along.

chosen
25th August 2011, 06:15 PM
Quote ...Instead of always praying that he will change and do what I want, I should be praying for my own attitude and stop complaining about every little thing and be happy with what I do have, which is a lot. I have my health, a good mind and a man who respects me and maybe can't help the way his body is. This is a very big enlightenment for me. Maybe that's what God was trying to show me all along.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
yes you've got it. Briliant baroness.
I think that God showed you this a while back, but it takes time for these things to sink in doesnt it.
I think that recognising that we have issues as well, and things that need working on, helps us to accept others with their weakness and imperfections. Its easy to place all the blame on the other person, and thinking that we are 100% blameless in everything.

I noticed this with husbands former wife, that she told him for years that all their problems were caused by him. She told lots of other people all sorts of things and always blamed him. What she couldnt see(and maybe still cant) is that she is a very difficult person to live with, very hard to please, very high maintence and very controlling and bossy. This is just an example of where we can delude our selves to the fact that we all need to concentrate on ourlseves and OUR issues, and not try to force others to be as we want them to be. Unconditional acceptance and love is so important for all of us in marriage, and several people have said how much my husband has changed and opened up and come alive since the divorce and remarriage. Its sad really as he really is SO easy to please, and she just couldnt see that. Dont you make that same mistake.

Baroness
25th August 2011, 09:09 PM
Chosen, the thing is, I have always been accepting of the way a man is, whether it was an ex or my present h. When others criticized the way he handled things I said it was okay because I didn't need to know every single thing and as long as the bills were paid it was fine with me.

I have always known that the only way a person can change is if God does it and yet I was judging him by what I think he should be like. The ed brought all this on and I started thinking differently because it wasn't acceptable. I wanted what we once had and that isn't possible, people change and so do relationships and I can't realistically expect things to stay the same.

I just wanted the man back who made love to me but there were other things that displeased me about him and I thought why can't he be more romantic? Why can't be talk more? But he accepts me the way I am and I should do the same. I do love him and in many ways am very proud of him and we are getting along very well.

I'm glad you understand what I was talking about in my last post. I am not a domineering woman and easy to get along with and yet in my mind I was constantly putting him down for not trying to have a physical relationship with me. Yes, he could have done this and that but he didn't and I have to respect the way he decides to handle this.

Of course he doesn't want to admit this and I still don't like the way things are but I seem to be coping better now that I've realized some things about myself. I wasn't aware of those things and I just prayed for him and for me and I do have faith in God. I feel like a great weight has been lifted from me.

I also think God is molding me into the woman and wife he wants me to be. I don't know for sure what is going to happen to this marriage but I do trust God and he said to just trust him and so I must. All this time I've been asking him to speak to my h and fix him, when I also needed fixing as well. Of course I never would have realized this if I hadn't been open to God dealing with me on it.

I am also praying about not getting so upset when I think someone is attacking me in some way. I am a sensitive person but that can work in my favor. I can finally say that I want to be in God's will, not matter what that is.

chosen
25th August 2011, 10:39 PM
baroness thats really good about the weight having been lifted. Thats real progress.

Men in general just arent romantic. Thats just the way it is, and in my experience men talk far far less than women, which is why we women need each other to communicate to.

My husband is a very clever man, and his mind is filled with papers that he writes and research that he does, and stastical analysis and numbers, and he isnt all that romantic and just doesnt think that way, but he is such a lovely guy and godly husband that I am not bothered. If I dont remind him that it is our anniversay or that it is someones birthday, he would never remember. its not deliberate its just the way he is. Most of the time he cant even remember how old he is. lol. Thats my job, I remember such things and tell him. He isnt a great talker either (and in my experience not many men do talk a lot) but he will listen to me talking. lol. We just need to love and accept our husbands as they are, and for the good that is in them.

Its a horrible thing for a person to know that they are a disappointment to their spouses, and that they can never be themselves, or be 'good' enough. Its soul destroying, and my husband knows all about that. I am SO glad that he is out of that marriage and situation, and so is he. He said it was like coming out of prison when they divorced. So sad.

God can use any situation to change us and reveal things to us, and He will always bring good out of a difficult situation.

You are also right about change. Change is part of life isnt it, and none of us are the same as we were a few years back. Relationships also change and marriages change. Our marriage of nearly 6 years has changed such a lot already(fortunately its just gets better and better), and nothing ever stays the same.It keeps us on our toes.

Baroness
26th August 2011, 01:16 AM
I hope things get better for me and my h too but they seem to be since I have realized that I was expecting too much. I believe you are a true Christian, Chosen and I had misjudged you earlier on in the posts. You are the only one gracious enough to forgive me for reacting to things said to me. I have apologized but 1aokgal can't forgive me my ignorance in my posting skills.

Probably no one else will either but I can only try to do better and God has revealed many things to me through all this which is just like God, isn't it? I feel bad about what happened but I know that she could have worded her feelings a little differently and I would have accepted it and not gotten upset.

God tells us to have forgiveness and I think you told me awhile back that this would happen. I was really shocked by the whole thing because she never told me about the way I posted before that day and I am usually not so quick in assumptions but I really couldn't believe what was being said.

I got carried away and I admitted that, what else do people expect me to do? I defended my husband because I love him and he is not the person that some has made him out to be. I know I posted when I was angry at him and I know I felt like just leaving him, but it is my right to be upset over what is happening.

However; God is helping me with the way I look at this marriage and how I respond to him. We are fine and once I realized these things about my expectations and the way I was thinking, I just felt a lot of love for him. He really is a kind man and there was an article in the local newspaper about him and his volunteer work.

For awhile there I wasn't sure I still loved him but once the anger left and my resentment then I realized that I still love him very much and I am praying for a miracle in our lives. I know that not many people still believe in miracles but it happened for Forever so it can happen for us to. I believe in the power of God to change lives.

The closer I get to God and the more time I spend reading the word and praying, the easier it is for me to deal with what I have to. He's taking those vitamins by the way and seems to be doing much better. When thoughts come of resentment for him not sleeping with me, I will have to just remind myself that we love each other and there are a lot of people who don't have anyone to love them.

Your husband sounds like a very nice man and has a lot in common with my h as for the not being too romantic or talking a lot. Maybe I talk too much. So I have decided to live my life on a positive note and I thank you for all your input on his behalf. I didn't want to listen to you when you were saying certain things but I think it was because I wanted to hang onto my anger.

I have let it go now and I feel like a new woman and who knows what wonderful thing God has in store for me and him? God bless you, Chosen.

1aokgal
26th August 2011, 03:32 AM
Dear Baroness..

You posted that I could not forgive you for your postings? I have no reason to hold anything against you concerning your posts! Why would you say that? Rather I posted about the maybe "too in depth postings" that I felt were depressing to some here. It seemed we got off track to discuss the subject and how we could make progress in our marriages. Instead the forum got bogged down in the description of "he said this, he said that" and the response by others to help was misunderstood by you. If I hurt your feelings, that was my fault.

You were quick to take offense to those who responded to your description of things that happened when you shared these events yourself with others here. You said they criticized...when you had been the one who talked about these things. So any feedback was not accepted gracefully on your part.

We are problem solvers.....or at least, we believe we are problem solvers of most things. It is frustrating when we can't solve it, and we can't even get the reason why things happen. Everyone here wishes you happiness.

You said in your personal email to me this evening, that I am unforgiving person. I don't have a clue why you wrote this. I spent most of today at the art gallery with my grandaughter and I did not read your last post until late today. She met my artist friends and learned about their work and how they regard me. Later she described it as, "thanks for an incredible day." It made an impression on her to learn about their art and meet people who respect me for the work I do. She is excited that I want to help her with some art lessons. That feels wonderful to make a difference to another person.

Baroness, I think I made a small difference in your life too. It was to give you some creative direction when I suggested the hats and told you how they are successful for some and fun to make. It has helped you to look forward to something positive. It may continue to make some positive input financially for you. It also was my pleasure to share the creative stuff with you. We talked about things that brought us to this forum. I suggested you look at the good things in the marriage and not focus only on the problem area. I never said ,"forget about it" but to focus on other things. Not easy, but it can work.

Don't be so quick to believe the worst about others or to take suggestions as criticism. It is true that it is frustrating when you try to help a situation and it causes misunderstanding.

The thing you were most wrong about was you emailed me personally to say I never forgave my husband because I am an unforgiving person! You don't know me well enough to make that statement. I forgive you for having said something so silly.

Since I have been married 31 years and never considered divorce, I would say that is a record solid as a rock. Of course, my husband doesn't frequent bars, is an educated, moral person and is pretty easy to love. So there is no conflict. Perhaps one day you can say that about your marriage.

Baroness
26th August 2011, 04:27 AM
Yes, you made a difference, a positive one in that I have something creative to do. I said you were unforgiving because in your email to me it was clear that you can't forgive me for reacting to what you said and for not posting as you think I should. You seemed very upset because of other things you said.

I have no problems in this marriage other than the ed issue. We get along okay most of the time and I like to go to the nightclub with him every once in awhile because I am good friends with the owner. Now that I have discovered that I was thinking wrong about the marriage, I see no problems for us other than this. Of course life has its ups and downs but I see now that I was expecting him to be perfect as to what I think he should be.

I was taking every little thing he did and complaining about it because when you expect a man to be your dream come true, it just isn't going to happen. I was also dwelling too much of what has happened and reliving it when I should have just left it to God.

I make mistakes, we all do and the only thing I can do now is to learn from them and go on, and this I plan to do. As for what I said regarding your husband, I cannot discuss something that was said in a private email between us. I would consider that unethical. And I don't recall getting upset with anyone but chosen awhile ago and recently with you.

I get it already, the part about posting, I heard you and how long must we keep saying the same things? I understand what you are saying, okay? Anyway, things will be fine in my m. I needed to adjust the way I was thinking about things and I already prayed about it and I feel better.

There were certain things I didn't want to hear from people because I was hurt and I didn't want to think about his feelings. We are starting to communicate better and I just don't want any ill feelings from anyone on here. This post has helped me get to where I am now. I am not crazy and I'm not drinking and I don't have a split personality.

I was just very angry that he could do this to me. I don't accept change very well I guess. I am a strong woman and will rise above this. Do you blame me for getting a little crazy? My whole world felt as if it was falling apart. But I am more positive now, more like myself and I am grateful to everyone that has tried to help me. Even though I got upset at some of your wording in that post, it still got me to thinking about the way I see things in my marriage, and in turn, helped me realize that I was being unrealistic and was stuck in a depression that had me posting negative things all the time.

I also realized that I can't be offended just because someone is telling me something I don't want to hear or can't accept. I have taken all these things to God because he is the one who helped me see what I was doing to myself.

1aokgal
26th August 2011, 05:05 AM
Dear Baroness...

The only thing I can say to you after these postings is, "Don't assume you know how others think or feel." You said you thought I was unforgiving because......or that I was upset with you. I think things over before I respond to something, usually.
I was gone for the whole day so I didn't think about this forum at all.
Take things one day at a time and don't try to think for others. You might be wrong. You assumed you knew what I was thinking or how I felt. I had no reason to be upset about your posting.

You made the statement about my husband and made assumptions.
I never doubt my husband when he goes out the door as he is always dependable.
He doesn't drink or hang in bars. We boat, enjoy time together and he encourages my artwork.
My husband is an excellent provider so we are financially sound. He has always been concerned for my welfare.
You don't know my feelings from a few emails we exchanged.
To say I have never forgiven my husband was really out there. Pretty personal stuff.

I learned something from this situation too, "No good deed goes unpunished."
I'm glad I was able to offer something positive for you.

I got something too.
I won't try to "mother hen" someone again and I learned to keep my mouth shut.

chosen
26th August 2011, 09:32 AM
Baroness.
I always felt that your husband was a decent man,. and although I wasnt popular with you and others when I said so(and that is why I stayed away from this thread for a while) I felt so sad that the marriage may end over this recent problem.
I understand about defending your husband. I feel incredibly defensive if anyone says anything to or about my husband that is wrong or mean or untrue, because I know what a decent and good and godly man he is. Fortunately everyone that we know now likes and respects him highly, and my kids thinks he's great. Its just his ex and a few of her family and those who she lied to who did that. I cant blame them because they were told thinsg that werent true and distorted. We dont see them anyway so thats no problem.

Maybe your ideas about marriage were a bit romanticised? Maybe you were expecting some effimimate men(like in the historical romance films) to come and be your knight in shining armor? I dont know, but your husband is as he is, and although I believe that we can all change, we are only responsible for changing ourselves(with Gods help) and praying for those that we love and allowing God to work in them.

You are right about how important letting go of anger and resentment is, but as you know, it isnt easy to do. However it does eat us up inside, and does no one any good.

I truly believe that your marriage can be great, better than ever, if you let go of all of your own expectations and give it all to God. Again not easy to do but so helpful.

Helen_uk
26th August 2011, 09:39 AM
This thread is starting to sound like a playground . With people only able to take one side or another instead of taking advice in the spirit it's offered.

Baroness I'm sorry if you feel you were being attacked , however if you react badly to advice offered from the heart then people will cease to post . You are then left with only one or two opinions from people .

I am now one of those people who will cease to post on your thread, I wish you nothing but the best as I have from the start . However if I can't post with honesty for fear of offending then I would rather not post at all.

Chamomile
26th August 2011, 10:18 AM
Chamomile,

Well done for putting so succinctly what I was trying to say :) . You phrased it so much better than I can :)

Dear Helen

*Blush*!! :o

You're too kind & so thoughtful, Helen, as always. I appreciated your kind words xxxx

Enjoy your wonderful long weekend with your future h & your precious ones :) You deserve all the happiness as you are such a wonderful, caring lady.

Hugs xoxoxoxox

Chamomile
26th August 2011, 10:38 AM
Sunday, hurrican Irene is due to hit here with major force. It looks like that will be a sewing day inside. I live on the coastline, but inland enough to be fine.
Now life is pretty dull next to this! xxooxx

Hi 1aokgal xxx

Please do take good care of yourself and stay safe..my thoughts and prayers are with you as well as people and families in the storm's path, bracing themselves.

((((1aokgal)))))xxxxxx

Quoted from news:

With more than 50 million people potentially in Irene's path, residents stocked up on food and water and worked to secure homes, vehicles and boats. States, cities, ports, industries, oil refineries and nuclear plants scrambled to activate emergency plans.

"I filled my tank up with gas in case I need to leave in a hurry or something, and get a lot of food supplies, taking everything out of my yard ... anything that can fly into a window," said Patricia Stapleton of Newport, North Carolina.

Irene, a major Category 3 hurricane, lashed the low-lying Bahamas on Thursday and was expected to hit North Carolina on Saturday before heading up the coast to New York and beyond.

chosen
26th August 2011, 10:51 AM
This is bizarre here. Most of have only wanted one thing, and that is to help. I am so glad that baronness is getting there and growing through this. If I feel I can help I will post, and if I feel I cant then I wont, regardless of what others say or do, or dont say or dont do. I dont usually take that much notice of what others say, but am more conerned by the person that needs help.

1aokgal
26th August 2011, 04:27 PM
Hi Chamomile..

How kind of you to be concerned. :-)

Yes, this hurrican by reports is due to be a monster storm. This is a coastline city so there is likely to be major flood damage in one nearby city that was hit hard hard last time. My daughter lives 10 minutes away and her street had water to the hip. People couldn't get in or out for several days. Her driveway has an incline so at least the house was dry.

My neighborhood has beautiful large trees. The sound of saws went for days as branches and trees were removed. We lost power for 5 days. Sure is a shock when everything we rely on is electric! We have bridges into this area and evacuation has begun for the lovely beach and canal area homes. My best friend has a luxery beach condo facing to sea here. I will invite her here as her house on stilts may get a bad hit. All this area homes built on the water may have damage as there is likely to be incredible high surf conditions. This is the negative of coastline cities.

Today is storm preparation with shopping, water to buy, and yard furniture to be stored and secured. I am a bit worried on this one! My daughter will work during the storm as our emergency people take such risks with downed lines and traffic lights dead.
The whole east coast is due for major hits.

1aokgal
26th August 2011, 04:46 PM
Hi Helen....:D

I have left the playground. It is too risky with the falling rocks.:eek:

Baroness
26th August 2011, 05:03 PM
Helen, I have at no time resented anything you said to me and in fact, I thought we had good words between us. I don't understand why you think I'm so defensive when it was only 1aokgal's post that I objected to. I went back and read the posts and everything seemed fine to me, everyone was helpful and I got no bad vibes from anyone.

1aokgal, seems like you are playing the martyr now because I objected to your harshness in your post. Don't I have a right to object or am I supposed to just say nothing like everyone else? I have told you many times that you have helped me in more than one way and I felt a connection with you, which is why I was so surprised at the things you say and mainly the way you said them.

We've already been over this many times and I've said I learned from it anyway and realized some things about myself and that I would try and not take it personally when someone says things that I think are inappropriate. I also admitted that you were right in that my posts were kind of depressing because I went back and read them, and also I was posting every little thing which I won't do anymore but I didn't realize I was doing anything wrong or incorrect at the time.

I do not wish to rehash this over and over again, saying the same things. Let's just set the record straight right now; I am sorry if anyone got offended by anything I did or said, but let the punishment fit the crime and lets not crucify me for not knowing exactly how to post. This has turned into a big deal and it shouldn't since I have already said I was wrong in a few of the postings.

I resent having to keep apologizing, it was an honest mistake.

Chosen, I thank you for trying to help me and caring enough to look beyond everything else to encourage me. I'm glad you understand about the sticking up for your husband part. However; if I hadn't revealed so much about him then people wouldn't have said what they did and not all of it was negative, so I guess I asked for that.

In reading my previous posts I saw that you told me a while back not to put expectations onto my h but to accept him the way he was. I was not ready to accept that advice at the time. My expectations didn't come from an image such as a hero in a movie or novel. I've always just known the way it should be between christian husband and wives.

I was raised my a christian woman and so my expectations came from what I was taught but I was judging him by what I think he should be like and I can't do that because a marriage is accepting the flaws in each other and loving them anyway. I have accepted a lot of hurt caused by him in the past and I was hanging on to all those memories.

I am trying to live in the moment now and put the past where it goes, in the past. This has been a hard lesson to learn and it isn't easy to forget wrongs that have been done to you but if Jesus can forgive us for things we've done then I should be able to do the same. I have a bit of a perfectionist in me and that's why I was frustrated that he wasn't handling things the way he should.

To me there is a right and wrong way to do and say things and there is no in between but perhaps I should change the way I see things regarding that too. To me everything has always been black and white with no gray areas and when this ed happened and he wouldn't admit it or even try to bring us physically together, that fell in the 'wrong and black' area and it frustrated me.

I guess the same thing happened when I read 1aokgals post a few days back, that was also in that category and I realize I can't react to everything in life with those standards, at least not in this relationship. I have realized that now. It was my own standards that set my expectations of him in motion and there was no way this could have worked out okay.

We can't always have it the way we want and people do not always react the way we want and they definitely don't say the things we would want them to say. Others may think I have been presumptuous from things I've said but I had a reason for thinking and saying them. Now I want to go forward with God's help to a life that can be happy.

I just had to get myself out of the way first. My whole attitude has changed since I've been posting on here and I have gotten so much closer to God that I never want to go back to the way it was. Trials will come, whether it be from something someone has said or done, but it is like a purification process.

If you pass this test then you have achieved something, if you don't you will have to pass it some time in the future because this is God's way of molding you into what he wants you to be. My way of thinking about my man was wrong, as was my constant complaining, even if it was to myself mostly. God wanted to weed this out of me and in the long run I think it will make me a better person.

I have no expectations that life will just be peaches and cream from now on. I know that things will happen that will upset me and I know I will still have days where he frustrates me, but I need to just turn all of my burdens over to God instead of getting upset and lashing out and telling myself that I don't have to put up with this, I can just leave him.

You do encourage me, Chosen. What you have said to me is mostly all scripture and you have some very good points and so did Forever in her last post. It was because of what she said about my h that I started thinking differently. It isn't good to just be satisfied with the way you are and refuse to budge. To think you are right and everyone else is wrong.

Fortunately I can change things about my life and the way I think while others don't want to change because they think they are right and they refuse to see anything else. I think my h is a little like this but I have seen God work in his life, speak to him and his mind was changed. I hope he is still open to God.

Its as if I was walking around with heavy armor on my back and I was just dragging it along, sometimes barely able to move forward, and then God came along and tried to remove it off my back but I wouldn't let him by my refusal to see that he could help me. Then it seemed to get heavier and heavier as storms came and then finally I looked up and said I wanted his will and he removed the heavy armor and not I am walking straight and the weight has lifted.

This is a happy ending I can claim and I can have it right now.

chosen
26th August 2011, 08:09 PM
Hi Helen....:D

I have left the playground. It is too risky with the falling rocks.:eek:

Its only a play ground if those in it make it so. I avoided this thead for a while because it was like an exclusive club and not a playground. Now apparently some of us are allowed back in who can maybe give a slightly different viewpoint? Thats progress anyway.

Baroness. The things you have said about God today are so encouraging, and show how much you have learnt through this all. God does use all the horrible times to draw us close to Him. Also remember that things can change, and God can change people and marriages. As you said look at Forever who has had to put up with so much from her husband, but has trusted God regardless, and God has done (and is doing) amazing things in their lives. She is a women with a very strong faith .I have seen the same in friends of mine, whose husbands have changed, and their marriage improved, through prayer and trusting God. It can take a lot of time and patience but it works.

Everyone else. Baroness has appologised for anything she did that may have upset you. Why not let it go?

Helen_uk
26th August 2011, 08:13 PM
Actually I resent that chosen . I've always given a balanced opinion and I fail to see how a balanced view can be obtained if only one or two people are replying to a poster .

Helen_uk
26th August 2011, 08:20 PM
Baroness,

I've only ever given you advice I'd take myself . I'm not a Christian so am unable to advise you from a Christian viewpoint , however I have always strived to talk to you as a friend .

Of late I've been quite unwell and haven't visited the boards as often as I previously did , I'm also disinclined to get involved in petty squabbles .

This is why I've decided to leave the thread . As I said previously I wish you well , and I mean that .

chosen
26th August 2011, 08:55 PM
Actually I resent that chosen . I've always given a balanced opinion and I fail to see how a balanced view can be obtained if only one or two people are replying to a poster .

Helen I wasnt aware that you had posted here that much and wasnt thinking of you when I said that only 2 others were regularly posting.

However, I agree and that was my point. It had got to the point where generally only 2 others were posting. I think its always better to have several opinions and ideas.

Helen_uk
26th August 2011, 08:57 PM
And now there will be fewer . Which I guess will mean even less balance.

chosen
26th August 2011, 09:06 PM
thats possible but anyone is free to post(and they can hopefully be free of the playground)

Forever
26th August 2011, 10:22 PM
Hi Baroness,
I am back from Mexico...mouth is sore but I have movie star quality teeth!!! I cant believe what quality of work they did on all of us, and at 1/3 the price! I am glad to see you are doing so much better. Yes, God does indeed do miracles!!! Sometimes we have to wait a long time to see them...meanwhile, we change into something more pleasing to Him during the process. Never give up hope, you are doing so well now.:) There will be days that wont be as good as other days, but that is when we need each other to give us a lift.

Take care, and God Bless you!

chosen
26th August 2011, 10:35 PM
Forever, glad that you are back and fine after your dental work.

Baroness
27th August 2011, 03:42 PM
I'm so glad you are back, Forever. As I said, your last posting really helped me see my h in a different light. Its so wonderful to hear from Christians because after all, we are sisters in Christ. We have that bond. I think I have pink eye or something. The side of my right eye is bright red and there's a small clot over the iris and I don't see a difference this morning.

I did research on line and they say it could heal itself and go away but it will take anywhere from 1 week to 2 and of course it could be something more serious but I am not claiming that. I asked God to heal it and I believe he will. It's a little swollen but I don't really have any pain. Most of the time this happens when your eye is hit or something but nothing like that happened.

I know I was rubbing it a lot a couple of days ago and they say something can just get in it so my h is very concerned but I believe God will heal it or it will clear up on its own, I will wait a couple of more days and see how it goes, but it looks terrible.

Chosen, thanks for your words of encouragement and you are right. I am leaving in just a little while to go with my best friend over to her house for the night while I do laundry. We will have dinner together. She used to be a christian but turned away from God long ago but she still believes in him but doesn't think he is a personal God.

When she or her family get into trouble, whether it be from illness or whatever, she always calls me first and asks me to pray. I am the only Christian she is around so its important to keep this friendships which is a little over thirty years so she can be exposed to things of God because when her family members are healed I tell her that I know it was God.

I met her when I was seventeen and she was fourteen and we went to church together for years but when God didn't give her the man she wanted she just turned away from him but she encouraged me to go to chruch and she knows my whole family and has for years and she used to be a half cousin by marriage.

She's a little domineering at times but was very supportive when I was going through the vodka thing and never judged me. Someone from this thread recently asked me if I was drinking and I didn't think that was too cool because everyone knows I quit vodka 2 years ago. I'm not even tempted to drink vodka when I go to that nightclub about once a year. I quit just like that and God helped me I'm sure.

But now I can help others who may have had a drinking problem because I went through that. My problem was not the vodka itself but being in a bar and having a good time so I just kept drinking. That is behind me now and I truly believe that everything happens for a reason.

Other than my eye problem we are still doing very good and its amazing that once I changed the way I thought, everything seems more comfortable here and the whole atmosphere lighter. I did think briefly about him not sleeping with me last night but I just talked to God instead and I believe he will move in this area.

I always have a good time when I go over my friends house and we're going to curl up and watch a movie and eat!

chosen
27th August 2011, 09:23 PM
Isnt that sad when someone turns from God because he didnt give them something that they wanted? Maybe if she asks you to pray another time, suggest that she prays herself because her prayers are just as good as yours!
Girl friends are great arent they.

Baroness
28th August 2011, 10:20 PM
I'm back and I had a lovely time and my h was worried about my eye so I guess he stayed by the phone. Half the time he doesn't even answer it. He also said he missed me when he came home so that is always good. My eye seems to be a little better but I'm thinking of going to the doctor anyway, not that I have health insurance.

It is good to be home though. I took my hats over there to show her and she liked them and I have a friend here in the complex and she was so excited about them she was thinking of ways to sell them. When I take new pictures of my new additions I'll put a couple of them on here for you to see. Yes, it was hard when my friend didn't want anything more to do with God because our whole friendship started with us both being Christians.

I don't preach at her at all, not my way but God can't help but come up because he's part of my life and she doesn't mind hearing about it. She has always been a supportive and kind friend and we help each other out all the time with things around her house and her taking me shopping, etc. She lived further away and not she is very close so I am happy about that.

We get together the first Saturday of every month and have breakfast out and then go shopping together. She's not sure this new hat business of mine will work out and her and my h don't have anything to do with one another because they had a falling out years ago when she judged him and expressed her doubts to me about him. It's like he has to prove himself to her and he isn't going to prove himself to anyone.

He doesn't care for domineering women and so he doesn't discourage our friendship but he doesn't want to hang out with her either. He has friends I'm not crazy about either but I like most of them since I've known them for years. He needs to forgive her but since she's never asked for forgiveness or admitted she was wrong about him, this is the way its going to be.

That's fine, its been this way for years. He doesn't mind when I go over to her house and he will drop me off sometimes but most of the time she just comes and gets me. Well, its good to be home because I sleep better in my own bed. She did tell me that she was glad he didn't give me a hard time when I go over there.

He gets to get out almost every day while I am here and sometimes I'll walk to the store, which is right around the corner, but we don't really have the funds right now to go out and do things together and he will not go to a Pentecostal church with me and he's up at the canyon on Sunday morning anyway. I thought we would find a church to go to together long ago but they depend on him on the weekends until noon.

I went out of my way to volunteer up at the canyon last year so we could do something as a couple but he won't do the same for me regarding going to church. Maybe someday but I don't think he gets it that its important to have fellowship with other Christians, him being an ex catholic and all. Perhaps God will show him differently.

Baroness
31st August 2011, 03:10 AM
I haven't been feeling too well the past couple of days, my eye is really bothering me and didn't seem to be getting better and I got a call to go on an interview and yesterday I started feeling light headed and had to lie down and I was having a panic attack because I thought something was seriously wrong with me.

I went to the doctor and my eye will be fine but it will take a couple of weeks to be completely normal again. I was afraid it was something serious because I read about it on line and it wasn't pink eye which is contagious and since I'd never had anything like it before I was making myself sick I guess. Anyway, I feel better today. My h was really understanding and caring.

I guess you find out how much a h cares when something happens to you and he gets all worried. It was such a helpless feeling and I don't ever want to feel that way again. I think it was an attack of the enemy because I've been doing so well. But i'm not giving him credit for anything. I have an interview at the local library and I would love to work part time there and its pretty close.

I haven't seen anyone post on here for a few days and I hope everyone is all right. God bless.

Baroness
3rd September 2011, 03:19 AM
I don't know where everyone is but I told you I'd show you my hats and so I'm going to try and do that. My eye is a lot better and I had a really good interview yesterday for a library clerk position. Things are okay here, just getting ready for the holiday on monday.

He's still doing what he does every day, watching movies, but he seems in good spirits. I noticed there has been no sign of affection between us now for over a week. I tell you, if I don't make the effort it doesn't get done. I am still reading my bible and praying and that's how I get through the days. I actually am in good spirits lately even though nothing has changed at all.

Going to that interview helped. It was in front of a panel and I wasn't nervous at all but came off as professional and confident. I had forgotten how well I do at those things. I may have another interview next week as well. Getting out and working even part time would be good for me.

Baroness
6th September 2011, 07:49 PM
Good news. My h and I slept together last night.

chosen
6th September 2011, 09:17 PM
Yay, thats progress!

Baroness
7th September 2011, 03:26 AM
Yes, its been awhile but he probably won't sleep in the bed with me tonight. He does this every once in awhile although its been quite some time and I really wasn't expecting it. There is no pressure on him so perhaps that's why he felt comfortable. We had a nice time listening to music last night and talking but I did not bring up anything about our lack of sex.

It was a fun and relaxing time together and we hadn't done that in awhile. It left me with no doubt that he does indeed love me but that this is something he either can't or won't help. I truly believe it is ed because the last thing he said to me before going to sleep was that he loved me very much.

Since I let go and let God take over my thinking about this, things have been better for us. I hope I am not just fooling myself. It concerns me a little that because I don't bring it up, he thinks its okay and so he doesn't have to even try. Do you think that is a possibility?

George
9th September 2011, 11:05 AM
Hello again to everyone. It's good to read that Baroness seems to be on the right track with her h, uplifting in fact. However it appears as though there's also been some bickering and less than supportive posting on here recently, which to be frank put me off coming back and answering questions which were put to me a good few weeks ago now.

But I had to post what I read in the the Times yesterday about a court case in France, as it is directly related to the thread topic.

"The cost of no sex after marriage

So, now we know the official value of l’amour. A French woman, “Monique”, has successfully sued “Jean-Louis”, her husband of two decades, for failing to have sex with her “for a period of several years.” The judge declared that “sexual relations must form part of a marriage” and Monique won €10,000.

Amazing. And not just because most British women would simply shrug, make a cup of tea and think: “Oh, well — one less job to do.” How was such a sum arrived at? Is £8,700 the going rate to mend hurt feelings when your spouse deems you unravishable? It’s hardly a life-changing amount.

Still, let’s work it out.

The couple were married for 21 years, so let’s assume that 15 of them were sexless. The average married couple has coitus twice a week, which means that Monique missed out on 1,560 *****. The settlement thus equates to £5.57 for each time Jean-Louis failed to “sweep the chimney”. That’s less than the price of two pork chops.

Poor Jean-Louis. I’m not sure which is worse: that a courtroom now knows he couldn’t rise to the occasion or that even if he had, his efforts were valued at less than a Chinese takeway."

Carol Midgely Journalist/Columnist for The Times, 8th September 2011 (slightly edited)

Raymond
9th September 2011, 12:44 PM
Bad decision I think and will lead to faulty case law. Sex that takes place because of a fear of being sued is worth nothing.

Baroness
9th September 2011, 06:14 PM
Very interesting. Too bad I can't sue mine because then I would be able to make it on my own or at least go shopping!

Raymond
10th September 2011, 09:23 AM
Who's stopping you going shopping now Baroness? Are you saying that if you had the money you would go on your own?

Baroness
11th September 2011, 01:01 AM
Probably so. Sometimes I feel that way and then other times I don't. For no reason today he just came up and hugged me. These are times when I love him but it seems as though no matter how hard I pray, I don't see any changes. But the spiritual book I read on a daily basis says first you plant the seed and wait for it to grow and maybe it hasn't grown yet.

Just because I think its time for things to change doesn't mean that's what God thinks or that he's not doing something that I can't see. I gave it all to him but yes, sometimes I think it would be so much easier to go it alone. I'm so tired of nothing changing and I get weary with it all.

Raymond
11th September 2011, 05:54 PM
When you say change him what do you mean by that?

Shouldn't our prayers be to bless our spouses in their roles, in their health, physical protection, their security in work and finance, their emotional life and their faith and spiritual walk etc?

Baroness
13th September 2011, 03:09 AM
I said I don't see any changes, not necessarily in him, but in our relationship. I'm not trying to change him per se, just our relationship in that we could spend more time together romantically. Of course I pray for him every day, for his health and for him to be happy and for him to listen to what God is trying to say to him.

I don't think I would want him to change the man he is, there are many things about him I admire, like his volunteer work and the way he treats people, but he isn't taking the time to just be with me. I suggested that we hug each other every day and he liked that idea. Just so I get some kind of physical contact.

We watched football together yesterday, one of our favorite things to do together, and had a nice time and when I wanted to go to bed I went and kissed him and he said he loved me. I went to bed in about ten minutes the light went out in the front room. I could see he was tired when I was still in there with him and you'd think he'd come to bed since we were both tired.

But he didn't and I guess i'm just supposed to accept this and not be upset about it, I think that's what he wants. I used to get upset but prayed about it and I felt that God wanted me to just show him love and not walk around angry or upset. So this is the way I have been for the past few weeks and we get along well.

The other day I walked by him and said 'separate lives' and went into the other room and in a few minutes he came in angry and asked 'What did you just say to me?' I said 'separate lives', you are in there mostly and I am in here.' He said what do you want us to do? I told him I certainly wasn't going to spend all my time in there watching reruns.

And then went back in the front room and every time I went out there he wouldn't look at me and I knew he was still upset. I decided to get out of the house for awhile so on my way out he was still avoiding me so I walked out without a word. I took a bus up to the thrift store and looked around and bought a few things and came back.

I'd been gone about two hours. I do this when we argue sometimes, which hasn't been too much lately, but it gives us both a chance to think about what has just happened and when I came back his whole attitude had changed and he asked where I'd gone and I said the thrift store and from then on we were okay.

He needs to realize that our relationship is not normal. It isn't normal for two people who live together to spend most of their time apart until its time for me to cook dinner. Even eating dinner we are apart because I'm at the table and he's sitting on the sofa watching tv. If its something interesting I will sit with him but if it isn't I will sit at the table.

He will only sit at the table for special occasions because I used to ask him to and he would say he's watching something so now I don't bother. I like to sit at the table and eat. He's always very polite when I bring his dinner to him and says 'Thanks, honey.' and afterwards I do the dishes and then my back hurts by then so I go take a bubble bath or something.

It is not unpleasant here but neither is it romantic or very loving, just once in awhile so that's why I suggested giving each other a hug after he came and hugged me one morning. Did we hug each other today? Afraid not. I've been kind of busy on the computer because my browser crashed and I've been spending several hours trying to fix the problem.

I just wish I knew for certain it was ed, I was sure it was by our last encounter but he's never confirmed it and acts like everything is fine but surely he must know I know it isn't. Next month around the 20th will be the last time we actually made love and it be successful. That's a whole year. There have been a couple of attempts but nothing for 6 months and that's a long time not to have sex with your h.

Raymond
13th September 2011, 09:16 AM
Well done for praying for him. Don't let that drop. So long as you realise that you cannot change him by your own efforts and shouldn't try and change him anyway. We are the ones who need to change and that comes out of relationship with God who also uses circumstances as well.

One cannot manipulate the sexual arena and the more you try the more offence he seems to take.

As a christian it is obvious to me that I do not have power over my own body but the wife does and vice versa 1 Cor 7:4. This problem shouldn't come up for a christian, ed or not. He obviously doesn't see it that way. If there is a sexual need in marriage it should be met whether it is the wife or the husband.

However you need to start from where you are. One cannot demand sexual rights. They are freely given or not worth anything. If he studies the bible he would see clearly what the duties of a husband should be, the main one being that husband's should love their wives, which would include everything. This is not only feelings but loving on purpose.

The problem therefore in my eyes is that it is spiritual and that should be the direction of your prayers: his faith and spiritual walk. One of the tools in this is the way you live and behave.

Baroness
13th September 2011, 10:29 PM
Raymond, I believe that he does have ed and doesn't want to start something he can't finish so that's why he is always reassuring me that he loves me. No, I don't want to change him but I have changed quite a bit since I read and pray every day. I don't feel so unhappy or like I'm missing out on something because I know my h loves me and what's more important, I know God loves me and will work this all out.

If not, and it continues do you think I have a right to leave since my needs are not being met by him? I still care for him a great deal and we are getting along very well but I think about the future and its hard for me to accept that I will never again make love to anyone. Of course I can't make him try to make love to me but you see my problem.

We have a life together and most of the time it runs smoothly and we have a good time together and sometimes we're just doing our own thing and that's fine. I don't demand he be with me and visa versa. But am I supposed to just live like this? He isn't doing what the bible says husbands should do and if he's m then he'd kind of cheating on me, isn't he? And under those circumstances do I have the right to leave?

I would prefer not to leave even though we don't have a lot of things in common but he's the only man I want to be with. But am I supposed to live the rest of my life like this just because he won't admit the ed and so he won't go and seek help for it?

I got him the vitamins and he's been taking them but I see any movement in my direction regarding sex. Sure, he slept with me, but nothing happening and we have started hugging and kissing each other almost every day but is that supposed to be enough? Right now I'm not really stressed out about it.

God has taken the frustration and urgency and panic from me and so I am just trusting in him and not worrying about things, but my question to you is this m cheating? And do I have a right to break up with him in the future because he isn't fulfilling his husbandly duties? I want to know what you think in case this is the case in the future.

Believe me when I say that I am not in a bad place right now, either physically or mentally. We've been getting along really well but nothing has really changed and we still don't talk about it. When I tried he bristled and just went along with what I said so I would stop discussing it and he acts like there's no problem, he's just been tired, etc. But there is a problem when in a few weeks it will be one years since we've made love.

Raymond
14th September 2011, 10:50 AM
If you are in a good place Baroness then you want to stay in a good place and not let things get to you.

To me you seem to being saying two things. One that this does not bother you so much as you are in a good place. Two it does bother you and you are asking whether divorce would be okay if it came to it.

I would say personally that you do not have grounds for divorce as a christian but that depends on how you see it. As I see it adultery is the only grounds for divorce but even then some couples can get over this. It is true there are some situations where mental adultery (porn) has taken over and in some cases could be grounds for divorce. I wouldn't say it was an automatic one and one would have to seek God over it. Of course there are the obvious situations like extreme cruelty etc. where the marriage has broken down and not much can be done. I would be the last to be legalistic in these situations and force them together when it has clearly ended.

From what you say about your husband there is a lot we do not really know. You mention that you saw him once mb to some porn but I don't see he is habitually into it or you would know it for sure.

I do think he is not fulfilling his duty as a husband as he should be attentive to your physical needs. I reckon he is thinking more about his own problem than you in this. I believe where there is a will there is a way but who knows what is going through his mind.

I think the answer initially may be verbal in the way you talk about it. You have to find a way into the subject which will take a lot of skill on your part which means you don't talk about his duty. We are all sexual beings him included. Maybe if you could get to the place of conversation on the subject without him feeling threatened to perform it will yield dividends. Perhaps you can meet his sexual needs first which will surely open up the road to having sex on the agenda again.

He surely has sexual needs. Trying to meet them in the wrong way is proof of that.

Baroness
15th September 2011, 02:34 AM
I am saying two things, Raymond, and that is that is doesn't bother me all the time like it used to and we are in a good place, and I was asking about the leaving him part because I was curious as to what you think and because at some point I may have to think about this and I wanted to know where another christian stood on this issue.

He does not watch porn and hasn't since the one time and he saw I was so upset. I actually did talk to him about this and in a way where he wasn't defensive at all land he agreed that we should spend some physical time together but it hasn't happened yet. I don't get angry or have an attitude about this. I show him the same attention and love as if we had a great sex life.

I am no longer angry and frustrated about it most of the time. There are times at night when i'm in bed alone that I do think about it and for a few minutes I get upset and then step myself and talk to God instead. I have to mentally will myself not to keep thinking about it and I know God has helped me with this.

He must have sensed the change in me or God is dealing with him because its almost as if our relationship has gone back to the beginning. Now he comes in and smiles at me and says, Hi, Honey! I smile back and we talk now whereas before we wouldn't really talk or smile much at each other either. We hug each other and there is a video of him on youtube where a woman was touring the canyon and she stopped to talk to him and he was joking around with her and was so cute!

I told him he was famous and that it was really great and kissed him and told him I was proud of him. There is only a positive communication between us now and in the atmosphere. I don't talk to him about the problem anymore because we're getting along so much better and I know that physical contact is more likely when things are good between us.

However; I am not constantly thinking about this as I was before. I see him making an effort to include me more in the day to day activities. Of course I still miss the sex but since he is being more affectionate, I find that I am happy with that for now. When I realized it would be a year since we had sex I did get a little upset and could hardly believe a year had gone by without us actually making love.

I think what motivates his actions is that he does still have some sex drive but is afraid to try and disappoint, so he hasn't tried. I also know that he has our finances on his mind and he works hard up at the canyon and so that takes a toll on him. I have noticed that the vitamins I give him have helped him not be so tired. I will give you an example of the difference in us now;

Yesterday he was a little quiet when he was sitting there watching tv. Before I would have asked if something was wrong and he would have said no and I would frown and go to my room and be upset about it and probably not talk to him the rest of the night. It's hard to talk to someone when they are not responsive.

When he got this way yesterday I said, You're kind of pensive, are you in your quiet mode? He said yes and I said cheerfully, Okay! There is change here, it isn't the change I was hoping for but it is a change and it makes it easier to be here with him. As to seeing to his needs first, that is always what happens.

I always see to his needs first and then he sees to mine and then we make love. Now he isn't making an effort at all and because I don't get upset when it doesn't happen, perhaps he thinks it okay with me. Next month on the day when we last made love last year, I am going to tell him it has been a year.

I don't think he actually thinks he's hurting me by not making any attempts to make love to me. I have talked to him about this a few times and I can do no more. He doesn't want to talk about it so I haven't done so and now we get along better. I do think he's selfish in only thinking about himself but I think its more fear than anything, fear of failing, fear of me thinking he's not the man he used to be because, believe me, he was quite incredible for a man that age.

I miss that man and for a long time I was angry that I couldn't have it back the way it used to be but I have been reading in this booklet my mom gave me that is spiritual and they talk about relationships a lot and how they change and how to deal with it. I don't know what else to do except to try and have a good relationship regardless of the sex issue.

In essence; I have lightened up on him and my thoughts especially and just try to enjoy our life together. We still spend a lot of time in separate rooms and if anything, I am too nice and caring to him. I treat him like the king of the castle and this is the way I have always treated men but I do this for him in particular because I know that women have not treated him well in the past.

We love each other and while this is hard for me, I have faith in God and I believe he can do anything. If it doesn't work out and it keeps going like this and I get so upset I just can't do it anymore, then we will go our separate ways. But that will not happen as long as I feel God wants me to stay here because there is a purpose for us being together.

From the beginning I have felt this. He was a mess when I met him and was so angry and resentful of his past that he was hard to get along with. He has changed so much since then it is remarkable and I know if we hadn't gotten together this would not have happened. God has a work to do here, and not just with him, with me also as I have discovered the past few months.

I am trusting that God has a plan, otherwise why wouldn't he have provided me a way out? Yes, I still think about it, i'm only 56 and so giving up sex was never on my agenda. However; we have a love that has always been deep when I was convinced that love cannot last. We also have a bond of the heart and not just for each other but in the way to help and speak to other people, always offering a helping hand and just kindness in general.

He said this is what drew him to me in the first place and not my face and body, but my attitude. I can't give up on us, not now, for I don't know the future, but for now I'm going to give it my all and make him happy just like he says he always is and trust God to do the rest.

Raymond
15th September 2011, 09:11 AM
You are your own best counselor Baroness at least in the post you have just written. You have got it right spiritually but are going through a kind of dying to the normal sexual relationship in a marriage.

You said that you used to meet his needs and then he met yours. As at the moment he has a fear of whether he would be able to meet your need, would it be a good idea to meet his need without the offer of anything in return? At least sex would be happening and anything can happen from there. You would have to make it clear that you are meeting his need and do not expect anything in return. I think he is aware of not being able to meet your need so you wouldn't need to push this again. It's just a thought and it would be a very selfless thing for you to do, but sometimes when we give of ourselves things happen. Give and it shall be given to you?

Baroness
15th September 2011, 07:01 PM
I have done as you suggested and he just shook his head and said, Don't be ridiculous. He acted as though I was crazy to suggest such a thing because he said he enjoys having sex with me, its just that he gets tired sometimes. So there you have it. I was tempted to tell him its almost been a year but didn't and he wasn't too happy about what I said.

I said it in a nice way but he's denying there is a problem and made me feel like an idiot for offering. He is either in denial or is just pretending nothing is wrong because he doesn't want me to think he isn't the man he used to be. I feel like a fool now and it isn't your fault, I knew he would react like this but I thought I would give it a try.

I had to wait for him to mute the tv to even talk to him. Since we have been getting along I will just let this go but if he thinks I'm living this way for the rest of my life he is very wrong. I don't have what it takes to just say ok, I can go without sex for the rest of my life.

Raymond
15th September 2011, 07:33 PM
mmm I enjoy having sex with you - what a year ago?

Sorry if you got embarrassed Baroness. I am not sure what you said to him or what you offered. Apparently he didn't take it as a gift so he still has pride about his manhood apparently. I think the offer will be there in his mind. If he ever wants to be real he will have to accept the facts as they are now. I think he is deceiving himself which doesn't help where sex is involved. Some ed is purely psychosomatic did you know.

Baroness
16th September 2011, 07:51 PM
No, I didn't know that. I am basing the assumption of the ed on the last time we tried, which was last Feb. I think and he couldn't stay erect and said he was just tired and there was another time when he tried and failed but told me he had an orgasm when I know very well he did not. Even though we wouldn't have an o he still at least tried.

Now he isn't trying but that could be my fault since the last time this happened I got upset during foreplay and said he wasn't getting hard and he said yes he was, and was angry and left the bedroom and went out on the sofa. I am usually quite understanding but I can't do foreplay for over half an hour! That was just me doing it, not him.

I don't mean to say things that are inappropriate but I don't know how else to explain things to you and others. He was sitting on the sofa just now and I impulsively went over to him and kissed him. There was a time when I was just beginning to post that I would never have done that. I wouldn't go near him and so we had no affection between us.

I don't know if my shows of affection are helping the situation but I can't help but think that love can conquer all and showing someone you love them can only be a good thing and make them feel confident that someone loves them even though they aren't doing right by them in this area. This also shows him that even though he isn't really trying in this area, I am going to love him no matter what.

This is why I have put up with things in that past from him that I wouldn't ordinarily do, things that hurt me, because from the beginning I felt strongly that God wanted me to show him love, that someone truly loved him even though he was being a jerk. The result of this is that he changed quite a bit. He started opening up to me eventually and said he was amazed that I still loved him and was with him.

I don't know why I felt to do this but the feeling was strong and that's what I was trying to accomplish because no woman has stayed with him and most of them were domineering and had a problem with alcohol. I had a problem with vodka, as I've said, but I corrected the problem. I quit when I realized how I was acting and never looked back.

I did this for myself and for our relationship. He might have deserved some of the things I said to him but it wasn't a good christian example and I've always prided myself on being a lady and so I couldn't be like that any more. I am going to continue to show him love because I don't feel released from this relationship.

I have faith in God and the change in me has been a very good thing. I should have known there was no way for me to be truly happy without God in my life and without putting him first.

Raymond
19th September 2011, 09:26 AM
Your attitude is very commendable Baroness. If there is healing and acceptance he is needing then you seem the right person.

I don't understand when you say you don't feel a release from this relationship. Why would you ever unless he was into adultery or something? Isn't marriage a commitment for life?

With regard to sex I think it was a big mistake for you to mention during foreplay that he wasn't getting hard. At his age he would need to relax and take his time. Bringing attention to that aspect would have put a lot of performance pressure on him. Did you know that he can still orgasm even with ed. The pleasure would be still there believe it or not. What he would be worried about is not being able to satisfy you. He would be more amenable to sex if that pressure wasn't there. I don't know what you can do to release him from that but you must find a way. There is a lot he can do to improve the situation but it must start from the basis of nil pressure. He must be allowed to enjoy sex regardless of it. The ability to enjoy sex regardless of it would most likely lead to an improvement once he is released from performing. Can you not think of other ways to enjoy sex even as a temporary measure?

Baroness
20th September 2011, 01:48 AM
Of course I have another way to enjoy sex and have often thought it was better since I didn't have to deal with his problems but it can't take the place of a man touching you. I said I didn't feel released because I guess I expected God to take the love from me and in a way he is cheating on me if he's m.

And even though he is 65 he is still very energetic during sex. He doesn't take his time at all, he just gets to it and this works for both of us. He doesn't make love slow but quickly and passionately and it was still that way the last time we were together.

We were having a nice time yesterday watching football together. I made a nice dinner and we were talking and somehow the month of October was brought up and without thinking I said yes, next month you and I have a date and he said okay. Then I said because next month on the 20th will be a year since we made love. He said, Jesus! He was genuinely shocked that it had been that long.

I said he knew I kept a diary and then I didn't say anything and neither did he. I thought my letting the conversation go would give him a chance to think about it since he was obviously shocked but he didn't say anything and it occurred to me later that he could have said something. He could have apologized for letting so much time go by or addressed it in some other way but he didn't say anything else about it.

Of course when I wanted to go to bed later in the night I said I was going to bed and he said he was going to stay up a little longer. He used to say that when he would watch tv for a few minutes and then he would come to bed but he didn't. You'd think that he would have wanted to sleep with me after finding out how long it had been, but no, it didn't change a thing.

I wasn't going to tell him yet but the time seemed appropriate. There was a couple of nights ago when I was in my room and noticed the lights were out in the front room and I thought he was m. The next day I asked how come he went to bed so early and he said he was meditating. He meditates in that he will close his eyes and clear his mind and repeat the name of Jesus over and over again and just be still.

I've done that too sometimes but I would rather just talk to God, but the point is I was thinking he was m when he was communicating with God instead so I can't assume he is doing that. When an ed commercial comes on or the subject is broached on a talk show; you should see how quiet the room becomes. He listens but makes no comments.

The past couple of days I've been kind of fed up with the whole thing and asked God why he wasn't doing something in my life, if not in this situation, then something else, just something to make me feel encouraged but I got no response in my spirit or otherwise and I had to apologize for my words and assured God that I have not lost faith in him.

I told him I just wasn't the kind of woman that can just accept this, which is why i'm doing good for several days and then I get frustrated. I mustn't do this but I don't know how to stop. I have needs that aren't being met and no matter how brave I try to be and how understanding and loving I am, this is still going to bother me.

To just accept this way of life would not be me and there was a time when I would have already been gone but I still love him and he was wearing this tank top and of course his muscles look great now and I said to him that a lot of good it did me, because I can't use them. I have always liked his muscles and he knows that and he is quite proud of them by the way he flexes them for me.

He feels no pressure from me in the sex area and hasn't for a long time and that hasn't helped him in wanting to sleep with me. He knows its a lot to expect and that another woman wouldn't be so gracious and yet he still acts like there's no problem. Today he told me he wasn't taking those vitamins anymore because his chest hurts and thinks its the vitamins.

I told him I would get him some others so its time to step up on the pills I get him. There's another natural herb that I'm going to get him, I just wanted him to get used to taking a pill a day first. I'm not sure its doing any good. I have to stick to natural herbs that help other things as well and not resort to anything stronger.

He had only one pill left in the bottle so he'd taken the whole thing and he might have been more talkative and energetic as to going up to the canyon, but I didn't see any difference it made between us. I've been reading other women's comments on different post sites and this happens to a lot of women.

Yes, leaving is one way to get rid of the problem but I can't give up now. We've been together too long and to leave now would mean I have wasted the last nine years and I don't believe that I have wasted them. I can be patient with him as a rule, but even I get impatient sometimes. I did notice that he didn't mind me telling him about it being a year since we had sex.

I said it in a kind of light way and he didn't resent it or stiffen up like he used to when I would bring up sex. But I now realized that all the times when I think he's in there m, doesn't mean that's what he's doing. I haven't seen any signs of it when I come into the room like I have been seeing for a long time.

I think its the not knowing that is the hard part. I know he has to be doing it and I do know that they can still do it even though they have ed. Perhaps I should just be happy that he isn't watching porn or cheating on me as people have suggested, but I find that small consolation when he doesn't even make an effort.

I don't know why I said we had a date next month but he seemed to readily agree. All I know is time is wasting, years are being wasted when we could be having fun like we used to, and satisfaction and a real deep connection. He used to tell me I was it, he looked forward to making love to me and I have to wonder what changed.

When we were having great sex we had other problems. Those problems have been resolved and we get along better now than ever most of the time, but now we don't have sex. Can't I have both? It would be so easy to just break up and find a man who likes to be with me in the sack, instead of one who prefers tv and a sofa to being with me.

I do trust God but I also know he can't change a person if they don't want to change and I just hope that isn't the case. I asked God for direction, for help in dealing with this, but I can't ask him to change the person I am for he made me like this. So what is the answer? For another woman it could be to just leave because she tried and now she's done.

For yet another woman the answer is to stay and hope things change but stay regardless because she loves the man she's with. What is the correct answer? There is no correct answer because what is right for one person may not be right for me. I know what the bible says but he isn't doing what God wants husbands to do.

Should I feel sorry for him because he's going through this and he's always been such a virile man and it must be hard? Or should I think of myself and not subject myself to another five years of this and then just leave when I'm much older?

I don't want to waste my life on a man who doesn't care how I feel and won't talk about it. And yet, do I walk away from love when there is no guarantee I will find it again? These are questions I dont' have the answers for, I don't know what to do and so I turn to God and when I do I just get; 'Show him love'. That's what I've been doing.

Show him love until i'm seventy and all my looks are gone and he never did touch me again? That's what I'm afraid of and maybe I've already waited too long. This is quite a puzzle. When we fell in love years ago I felt like I was going to be happy at last, that I couldn't believe I found true love.

Now there's times when I don't even want to look at him because I'm just sick of the whole thing. I have to work this out within myself but I have changed already because of this and why should I be the only one making the effort? All I ever wanted was to matter to someone and I thought I had found him. Apparently not. If I mattered he wouldn't be putting me through this.

I would never do this to him. I could never pretend everything was fine when I knew good and well it wasn't. I could never lie and make excuses just because I was too much of a coward to at least try.

Raymond
20th September 2011, 12:52 PM
Baroness I was not implying that you should have sex without him at all. If it is wrong for him to do that wouldn't it be for you? I have heard of wives doing this to awaken themselves for their husbands but I don't think this would apply to you.

No, what I was saying, if you read my comments, was to find a way to release him from this pressure to have an erection and enjoy sex in other ways with him for the time being until his confidence returns. If you can find a way to do this and release him from performance pressure, encouraging him as he is, he may well respond. In due course he may even get back to where he was.

The main thing is to undo the damage that may have been done when you commented on him not having an erection during foreplay. You may not think it was much to say but it does appear that he has taken this to heart and now feels pressure to perform. If you can undo this with acceptance of his condition and accept having sex with him as he is I would make a guess that he would enjoy this and be released from pressure.

Please read my previous post again as I don't think you are getting what I am trying to say.

With regard to love you are doing well but I think there is a danger of you tying it to sexual response when real love doesn't seek it's own but is given freely. Yes it will often come back to us but we don't give for that reason.

Baroness
21st September 2011, 12:17 AM
Sorry, my mistake for misunderstanding but I am guilty as charged as to that subject. My body cannot go for this long without some kind of release and I don't think it is wrong because I am forced to this. I didn't mean to get into this but people on this site suggested such a thing but they really didn't have to.

We all have needs and I am not ashamed of it and if he was doing what he was supposed to anything of that nature wouldn't be necessary. I do apologize if I am offending anyone. The truth of the matter is he doesn't respond to anything of a physical nature. He will not come to bed and do things half measure.

If and when he decides to make love again it will be as it always was and he shows no interest at all so I have to let him be. I am as loving to him as I can be and apparently, even though he was shocked to hear it, a year of no love making is not enough to make him move, and it isn't like I don't dress in a sexual way when I'm home.

Not on purpose but I wear short and tank tops because its so hot and that would effect a normal man but he acts as though he could care less. However; I don't know what he's thinking so I will not assume he isn't still attracted to me and it is only fear that is preventing him from trying. We love each other but its like we are just roommates, except that I am also housekeeper and cook.

I don't mind cooking and cleaning house because I take pride in both but other than hugs once in awhile and the occasional kiss that I instigate, there is nothing physical about our relationship. I have done and said all that I can. I talked to him in a patient and kind way about it and don't show anger over it and he still isn't interested.

I have never in my life had to interest a husband or any man in sleeping with me and so this is difficult for me. Its up to God now. I can't fix him or even help him get over this or try to be with me. If he doesn't want to I can't force him too and talking about it some more will only alienate him and I don't want to do this.

On the surface it seems like a lost cause but I believe God can still do miracles, but whether my h will accept help from God is another thing. He is a christian, albeit by way of being a catholic, so he knows this isn't the way to have a relationship but its like he doesn't care about anything except his own activities and life.

However; he is very kind to me and makes sure I have things and is thoughtful with giving me roses and such. I do have something very good to share with you and it has changed my whole attitude. As I have said, my best friend is not a christian, but I have a friend who was very close to me in the past and she was a minister's wife and we lost touch about 12 years ago.

I asked my mother to try and find her, her name is Patty and we went to the same church together and hung out and she has the type of personality that is very positive and she just puts a different spin on things and we've always been close from when we first met when my son was about three and he's now 36.

My mom found her and I called her and it was so wonderful to talk to someone about things and of course she is very understanding about his situation and knows all about it, she's a counselor now, and I can't tell you how wonderful it felt to talk to her again and it was as if the last 12 years never happened and we talked last week.

It's just what I needed. We do a lot of laughing together and this is just the best thing that's happened to me in a long while. She has never been judgmental and we are a lot alike in our natures, physical and spiritual and this is just what I needed and I'm so happy. She just called and I talked to her some more and its a great feeling to talk to someone who knows you so well and in all the years we were friends we never once got into a disagreement about anything.

She was an alcoholic before we met and her husband at the time was a member of the Hells Angels motorcycle group so she is very street savy and someone that was very special to me and now I have her back. This is a very good thing and changes everything. She understands what I've been going through and we're still trying to catch up but when I talked to her I was just so happy.

Of course I told my h about it and he just looked at me, his face never changing expression and I felt like I shouldn't have bothered. As to him and I she said you never know what's going to happen in the future when God is working for you. This is what I needed and of course God knew that.

Raymond
21st September 2011, 12:54 PM
I wonder if you are even taking in what I am saying about pressure to perform Baroness.

Baroness
21st September 2011, 05:10 PM
I have told you that there is no pressure on him to perform. I don't talk about it or get upset when he doesn't try, nothing. I leave him alone and just show love and support and he isn't interested. What is it that you think I should do? Keep talking to him and alienating him more? He has a problem that he doesn't want to get help for.

He doesn't care about my feelings in the matter and has no plans to change anything that I can see. It is not up to me to fix this man, I can't anyway even if I wanted to. When I got upset with him that one time I was justified in doing so. I have been very patient and even kind throughout this whole ordeal which has lasted a long time.

If I make any attempt to bring up this subject he will get upset and be uncomfortable. He wants me to just go along with what is happening and pretend like he does that everything is fine. He doesn't care enough about my feelings to make any effort at all, at least not so far. I have gone above and beyond what any other woman would in my situation.

A needy woman, one who has to have a man take care of her, would just go along with whatever he dished it, even if it meant cheating on her but I am not a needy woman in that I need him to take care of me. I can take care of myself and have been doing it for a long time. I'm talking financially and when things need to get done I do them, and rarely ask for his help.

I wait on him and do nice things for him like bringing his dinner and sometimes taking his empty plate if I am finished as well. I leave him to watch his reruns and occupy myself because I can't just sit around and do nothing; it isn't my way. I also can't let this man destroy my self esteem because he doesn't want to sleep with me.

I treat him well and always have and he is decent to me as well but there are times when I'm talking about something he will say it doesn't have anything to do with him. He is like a separate island all to himself and he isn't interested in my past or what I went through and changes the subject when I try to share with him but has no problem talking about his past to me.

He loves me but its a strange kind of love to not be interested in the person you are supposed to be in love with. He doesn't care that I have had to go without sex for all this time, he won't discuss it and just expects me to adjust. I thought he knew me better than that. There is no pressure on him to do anything, much less make love to me.

I don't nag him and I don't speak to him harshly and if he's done something I don't approve of I will talk to him in a calm and rational tone most of the time, but the point is he is not making love to me and hasn't in awhile and doesn't care. Whether its from fear of failure or just pure selfishness, I don't know.

If he truly has ed, and I think he does, then I sympathize with him as a man who can't admit he can't perform like he used to but I tell you now, Raymond, this is never going to change,at least not from him. God could speak to him but I am like every man's dream come true as a partner because I make no demands, go out of my way to please him, and don't complain about things, just deal with them.

His friends I have made my friends but he has no interest in forming any kind of relationship with my friends. He will have nothing to do with my best friend because he thinks she's domineering and when I mention the old friend I just contacted he had no response because he has no interest in meeting her because I told him she was a christian and in a ministry.

When I was at my moms her next door neighbor is very spiritual and was a minister and when he was there I wanted him to meet her and he wouldn't just tell me and my mom he didn't want to meet her. He told me to go to her house and he would be along and he never came. I found him working on the van and he said he had to do that instead.

I told him I knew the reason why he didn't come and it didn't have anything to do with the van, it was because I said she was a minister. He didn't say anything. We have no christian friends together and as an ex catholic he has issues with christians trying to tell him how to live. I told you he has issues and he does.

He says the bible is open to interpretation which means what I read in it doesn't mean that's what he reads in it. We don't go to church together because he's up at the canyon and won't give that up and has no interest in going to church because he thinks all he needs is to meditate. I can't talk to him about what a real christian is like because the walls come up. The walls come up regarding a lot of things and talking about our sexual relationship is one of them.

We hardly have anything in common anymore except maybe football and music and a few movie selections. I am always busy with some project, he's happy to sit on the sofa and do nothing but watch tv and go up to the canyon. I don't think he needs me in his life at all other than to bring him his dinner.

This morning he was up early and I got up and he knew it and left before I came into the room and he's done this several times. No good morning or anything, its like he's avoiding me in the mornings or something and I may just ask him about it. The only area I've ever seen him passionate about is if someone was rude to him up and the canyon or making love to me. Those two things he is passionate about but only if he's had a couple of beers.

Sober, he isn't passionate about much and is quick to get frustrated when I'm trying to explain something technical to him and he in turn does not explain things to me well. He doesn't bother telling me what he's thinking because he can only see things from his perspective and doesn't care what other people are thinking.

At first he was still trying to make love because he was afraid I was going to leave him, but he knows I wouldn't give up my home and because I have stayed even though we have no sex life, he feels safe that I will stay no matter what he does or doesn't do and that's where he's wrong. I will not be taken advantage of.

I am not a woman that is weak or will take abuse of any kind, physical or mental and yet I have been very patient with him and have loved him anyway, regardless of him being self centered about this. If you truly love someone you will care about how they feel and how you are making them feel, but he doesn't care about how I feel obviously and just gets an attitude every time I try to discuss this subject.

I truly believe that if I left him he would manage just fine. I know he would miss me but he wouldn't do anything to get me back just like he didn't do anything before when I left him. Is this a man in love? Sometimes I doubt it and sometimes I just think that's the way he is.

The problem is that when we got together he was different because we were in bars and he was always passionate, but when we quit going and I quit vodka things began to change. The closer I get to God the more distance there is between us. I am a happy, positive person and he is not. He used to be and he will say he is happy. Why shouldn't he be? He runs the tv and does whatever he wants.

He has a good woman who will not tell him what to do or screech at him and one who treats him like a king and doesn't leave when he stops making love to her. He says he loves me and we will always be together and yet there are times when he can't believe I am still with him. There are times when I can't believe it either.

I am trying to tell you that I treat this man good and don't pressure him in the least. We have an easy understanding about the way we live as far as things we want to do. We don't ask each other's permission but will accept advice on whatever it is but he will go ahead and do what he wants anyway. He has no clue as to how a christian marriage should be or even how a relationship should be.

Every relationship he's had and that includes his ex wife has been with women he met in bars and except for the time he was raising his daughters on his own, he has always drank and in the beginning I told him I didn't think we would have much of a life outside the bars because that's what our life was based on at first.

He said that wouldn't be the case but the truth is that he doesn't really have much of a personality without drinking. I have to wait until he has a couple of beers before I talk to him about some things and there has never been a time that we have made love without drinking, that I can think of. I'm telling you all this so you can understand where I am coming from.

When he was an emotional wreck I was patient and loving to him. When he hurt his back in my apt. and couldn't move, I took care of him and waited on him hand and foot and I had only known him 2 months. When he lashed out at me when drunk I defended myself and we would argue but I always forgave him.

When he would leave this house and not come back because he was at the bar, I took it and told him how much this upset me and for him to just tell me where he was going. And when I called the bar when he didn't show up for hours, he would tell me he was coming home and it would be another few hours before he would show up and I took this too.

When he kept things from me that I found out on my own I just accepted it because I don't demand to know everything and he is not accountable to me nor I to him and I have lived this way and just dealt with it. But when he stopped making love to me I had a problem with it a couple of years ago when sex was only once in awhile.

Now it is a year of absolutely no sex and I have a problem with it, you bet I do. I have put up with a lot and that isn't to say he hasn't put up with some things either, but after all that we've been through he can't make the effort to either be with me or get help? Nine years of heartache, happiness, and frustration and this man doesn't care how I feel?

No way, not in a million years will I just accept this and live my life without any kind of affection. God of course deals with me and helps me at the same time and its only because of God that I can treat him the way I do. Loving him is easy and showing love is even easier because its in my nature to do so. Living the rest of my life without this man making love to me is not in my nature to do so.

Raymond
21st September 2011, 06:15 PM
I know where you are coming form Baroness as you have mentioned it so many times on this thread.

I see a man who you said had passionate sex with you. One day he couldn't quite get an erection (sorry to be so blunt). You questioned this during foreplay which I believe could have produced the pressure to perform in his mind being the sort of man he is. Maybe he was trying to get an erection when you caught him that one time. Who knows? However nice you are to him now your niceness may not be enough to take away the performance pressure he might feel in his mind. This is why he might be getting upset when you mention it. You must admit he is mighty touchy about it.

I think the answer might be you getting across that you are not expecting an erection if that is the way it is but we can still enjoy something together can't we? I'm not saying you use those words. I think in his mind he is thinking that you think he should be able to perform and have sex with an erection. If you can dispel those fears it might go some way in reducing the performance pressure he has in his head.

It is not a case of you not putting pressure on him it is a case maybe of releasing the pressure performance he has already taken on in his head.

Obviously it would help if he was a christian so don't give up on that one.

Baroness
23rd September 2011, 04:03 AM
It wasn't 'one day' he didn't get an erection so I snapped at him.It had been going on for a year or more, less sex and no orgasms for him at all even though he said he had them. I don't think he even remembers the incident since he was drinking at the time. Maybe he does but he can't latch on to something I said because I was telling the truth and had been trying to get him hard for over half an hour.

It wasn't happening and if I were to say to him for us to get pleasure another way or whatever, he wouldn't like that very much because it would be insinuating that he wasn't up to the task. And as for me expecting an erection; if he can m then he can surely rise to the occasion with me in bed. He got an erection that night but he couldn't keep it and was expecting me to help him get it back.

From being with him for years in bed I know that if it isn't coming back in 20 minutes, it isn't going to and I think we were both frustrated that night. That has nothing to do with all our nights of successful lovemaking. Now he has ed but can m. I don't know if he's successful or not but he has the desire. I didn't get impatient with him just because he couldn't rise to the occasion, like you suggested.

I'm not like that, I always say that's fine, I'm tired anyway or whatever. The point is that in a very short while its going to be a year with no attempts from him at all and I resent him thinking that this is okay with me. We don't discuss sex, not even when we were having it. We just go to bed and have at it and no words are necessary.

I told you we have always made love while drinking and now it seems neither one us knows how to broach the subject when we're not. He has never asked to make love to me, thank God, I hate it when they ask, he has just taken what he wanted and that's the way I wanted it. It was always understood that this is what would happen.

We'd have some drinks, listen to music, he'd take a shower and I'd be in bed waiting for him and 45 minutes later it would be over and we'd hold each other. Now he doesn't move from the sofa, no shower and no sex. It appears that we have nothing between us except an easy living arrangement and friendship to a certain degree.

There is no sex and it doesn't look like he loves me, but I know he does. He is going through a terrible time because he can't perform like he used to. Its easy for him to stay out there most of the time because he isn't drinking now and he has never made a move when he's been sober. This is a man who has been in bars so long he doesn't know how to act outside of them.

His personality is different when he's drinking and he's more loving and affectionate and yet he still doesn't want to make love. Even when he sleeps in here he will say he loves me but will make no move towards me and I am laying there naked under the covers or on top of them and he just turns his body and goes to sleep. Sometimes he will hold me. I think he will never have sex with me again.

I asked him a couple of months ago if we were ever going to sleep together again and he said yes and he knew I was referring to sex but I don't believe that. He is being very unfair to me. It wouldn't take anything for him just to say he was getting older and slowing down and that he loved me and it wasn't because of me.

No, he lets me think whatever I want to about this, including thinking he isn't attracted to me anymore. We get along great and even laugh together sometimes and we have an easy relationship but there's more to a relationship than that. There has to be some kind of physical contact or it will all fall apart.

I believe some women can remain with a man like this, I think they had a life with their man and aren't willing to give it up and sex isn't that important to them anyway. I am not a woman like that, sex is very important. I don't sit around and think about it all the time but sex is part of who I am and I was a late bloomer but I caught up.

Now I am living with a man who can't or won't even try to make love and no matter what I said to him one night out of frustration, this does not excuse him ignoring me and pretending like everything is fine. He really owes me an apology but he won't admit there's a problem.

Maybe he thinks it will go away or come back, whatever the case may be, and meanwhile I have to live like this. I try not to think about it and keep busy but I can't do that for the rest of my life. No, he doesn't even want to try anymore, he prefers m if he's even doing that anymore, who knows? He's had a long life in the bars getting really drunk and now its all catching up to him.

He knows no other kind of life, it was all in the bars with bar women and now for the past few years he's been with me and actually has a nice home but he doesn't know how to act around a woman who isn't constantly drinking and for awhile I was drinking as much as he was, but I'm not now so he doesn't know how to have a normal relationship.

That's why he thinks of only himself regarding this, that's why he keeps things to himself because he's done it for so long with women he didn't trust, and now he thinks I will just go along with anything because I love him. Can't you see how unfair this is to me? I don't deserve this. I have always been open and honest.

I think this is just a case of a drunk living with a decent woman. Or an alcoholic. Its affecting his body and perhaps even his mind and he's 65 and this could be it. No more fun for me!

Baroness
23rd September 2011, 04:34 AM
Raymond, I don't think I want to post anymore. We are just going around and around and nothing is really getting solved here. You say one thing about pressuring him and I have to defend myself and my actions and I'm tired of doing that. I realize you see things from a mans point of view but we both know this isn't fair to me.

When I am able, I will probably leave him and find someone else and have a normal relationship. Perhaps I won't find someone else but its never been a problem before. I don't think I trust men too much anymore, they always have some problem and more than once I've had to defend myself on here.

I've told you your suggestions would not work in our relationship and I ought to know. I resent you putting this all on me for getting frustrated one night after several nights of him lying to me and saying he had an o. There is no doubt in my mind that this is his fault. He changed our relationship and didn't even tell me why.

Is it sad? Yes. Do I want you to feel sorry for me? No. You should feel sorry for him because after I leave he will just go back to what he was doing before and that is hanging out in bars and maybe one night if he's lucky, a woman just might be drunk enough to sleep with him. Except that if he can't get an erection that won't be happening either.

Even when we split up for 8 months he never went with another woman because he loved me and didn't want anyone else. It will be the same but this time I won't be coming back. I post on here and tell you my feelings and yet when I see him tomorrow I will smile again and we will get along because I won't speak my mind and tell him how hard this is for me.

If he'd been honest or even concerned that I not think it was because of me, I might have stayed with him, sex or no sex, but because he deliberately treats me like this and thinks I'm so stupid I don't know what's going on, I will not stay with him and be treated like that.

I told him in the beginning I just wanted honesty and he has always kept things from me which is why at first I thought it was another woman but not many women can deal with such a man. The drunk ones can because they are drunk and don't care.

It was a mistake for me, being a christian, to hook up with a guy who spent most of his life drinking in bars. I never had a drinking problem before I met him and drank vodka. I never had a problem with men wanting to make love to me either.

But coming on here just forces me to talk about it and think about it while I hadn't thought about it really all day long. Especially when it seems as though you are blaming me for this. Getting impatient with him one night during sex is nothing.

What I should have done is pack my bags and get out when he stopped even trying to be with me. And what is the sleeping on the sofa all about? He thinks I buy his excuses about that anymore? He doesn't even bother to say anything and its like a slap in the face. Who does he think he's dealing with? I could go out tomorrow and find a man, I don't need to sit around here and wait for him to think i'm worthy enough to make love to.

I think his problems started long before he met me and will still be there long after i'm gone.

Raymond
23rd September 2011, 01:10 PM
Baroness I can see by your response that you still don't grasp what I am saying and are taking things as an attack on you, but I am not going to labour it anymore.

You have a good relationship and that is important. Plus you are looking to God which is very wise.

I hope you find your answers.

Baroness
24th September 2011, 04:32 PM
I grasped what you were saying a long time ago but you just don't understand that I can't do anything to change this. It isn't that I feel you are attacking me, its just that you keep saying the same thing to me and you don't understand him or how he thinks.

I'm not the one responsible here. I have decided to just remain here and see what happens since we do have a workable relationship. You shouldn't tell people that they have to fix their spouse because as a christian you know that everything is up to God and that he is the only one who can fix things.

One night of me being frustrated doesn't really matter in the scheme of things since this was going on long before and yes, he might be afraid he can't perform but I never asked for much from him in that area and never told him anything negative in all the times we've been together.

The problem is, and i've tried to stress this to you, is that he doesn't even try and seems satisfied with m. Lately i've been wrapped up in other things like trying to start an online business so I haven't given this much thought but I refuse to be responsible for this.

He knows this isn't right and so do you and yet you keep telling me to do something to fix it and I can't do anything. If I suggested what you said he would only resent it and I will not have resentment between us since things are on an easy going level right now.

He is a wonderful man in his own way and I am still trusting God in this. It is still frustrating sometimes but I must disagree with what you said regarding love and sex is only for showing the other person you love them and not for yourself. Untrue. The man or other person is not the most important thing.

The important thing is that you both get satisfaction and that is the way God intended it. He doesn't own me nor I him and each of our needs are just as important as the other. It is important how I feel and he is disregarding that or doesn't care.

But he shows he cares in other ways and when I say I don't feel released its because God hasn't taken away my feelings for him and I don't feel he wants me to leave at this time because he hasn't provided the way. God will take away feelings because he did it for my mother who was married to an alcoholic and cheating on her.

I consider my h cheating on me because I don't know for sure if he's watching women on tv when i'm not in the room and m. If he's m that is taking away from our sex life and that is cheating. Again, i've said this before. I do thank you for making the effort in all these postings but what you suggest doesn't work for us.

He has it made it having me here with him because I am a caregiver and I don't mind doing things for him because I love him. I also have it made because he's not demanding and supports me financially thru this hard time and in whatever I want to do. The only problem we have is not having sex and I hope that changes and I will get him stronger natural herbs to help this situation.

If none of this works and God can't get through to him then I will have to eventually leave. There is no need to worry about me if I do this because I have always been okay no matter what the circumstances. God looks out for me and always has and he can bring me someone who truly knows how to love a woman. I am not worried about this at all.

I will come back on here periodically to see if chosen or forever post because I would like to talk to them. Goodbye, Raymond and I hope you have a nice life and I hope God shows you that it would be better to tell people to trust in God rather than try to fix the problem themselves, that's where we all get in trouble; taking things out of Gods hands.

Raymond
27th September 2011, 12:49 PM
It's your marriage Baroness and you have to do what you need to do. Of course sex is for both partners I didn't mean to convey that it wasn't.

What I was trying to do was show you how some men's minds work on this subject. Unsuccessfully it seems.

God doesn't do it all you know. We have our part which God will bless as we look to Him.

Anyway I will just have to put this down to one of my failures.

God bless you.

Baroness
28th September 2011, 12:51 AM
No. it wasn't a failure, Raymond. You helped me see how a man thinks and I'm sorry I didn't acknowledge that earlier. I just can't do anything more than to show him love and it appears to be working. He slept with me again and everything is much better. I guess it just took him some time to feel comfortable. We are doing fine actually.

If it wasn't for everyone helping me on this thread I would have already gone but you all helped me see that when God puts two people together it is for a reason. I just get frustrated when I can't understand why this should be happening. I knew if I just left him alone for awhile he would feel more at ease and not feel any pressure at all.

I think we will be okay and I'm not thinking of us splitting up anymore. However; he is older and who knows what can happen but I can't leave him because he's getting older. True love is not like that and we've been together for a long time. Its been quite a battle for me and I know i've lashed out at times and I am sorry for that but I didn't think anyone understood how how hard this was for me.

I believe God is helping him and we are much more at ease with each other now, speaking our minds and holding nothing back. Its a tricky situation because a man has his pride and I didn't want to stomp all over it and that's why some of the suggestions I got from others would not have worked for us.

He seems to be doing so much better now and we're actually having fun together. Maybe I think too much but I just panicked. Another thing I had to come to terms with is that I can't have a perfect m. Things happen and its unrealistic to want us to be the way we were in the beginning. People get older and times get harder but we have managed to hang onto the love we have for each other.

I'd like to thank you for all your help because you were there in the very beginning and it helped to have your viewpoint. I listened to you even though I might not have wanted to hear some of the things you said. I had to come to terms with this and look at myself as well as him. I guess I was thinking I was this perfect wife and he had done this to us.

Yes, he made if difficult but i've known him for a long time and I should have realized how he would handle things but I feel the hard part is over for now and I just want us to be together and be stronger. He has started spending more time with God and that definitely helped. Sometimes things don't go at our pace, but if we let go then God can do his work.

You all have helped me very much and I would like to thank each and every one of you. I'm not saying that there won't be difficult days but my thinking process has changed somewhat and I know that I have to let go to let God move the way he wants. I do love my h and don't want to lose him and even if there comes a time where sex is not possible, I don't see how I can walk away from him.

I've just never had a problem like this before. He's even being more romantic of all things. He asked me to marry him again and while it doesn't make much sense to me, maybe it does to him. I count myself lucky that I do have him because he is a kind and decent man. I wish things could be the way they were, making love regularly, but I have to just take what he's willing to give.

I might have found someone else but this is the man I chose and my feelings or attraction to him hasn't changed. I've been very angry and frustrated over the past few months and now I am turning it over to God. I think God wanted me to be closer to him and if everything was perfect that wouldn't have happened.

God is concerned with our soul and our walk with him and I wasn't paying attention to God that much, but without a job and without a normal relationship I turned to God instead of going my own way which every instinct inside me told me to do. But when you walk with God he starts changing the way you think and I hope he continues to guide me in my life.

When I was young I only wanted to please God and then I got caught up in other things and forgot what is most important; my walk with God.

Raymond
28th September 2011, 01:20 PM
A wonderful post Baroness. You give yourself wonderful counsel in your own post. Long may it continue. Everything will come out of the good relationship you have. A three ply cord is not easily broken. Your relationship with God is crucial which you already know. Out of that will come the answers for your marriage.

Baroness
1st October 2011, 03:49 AM
God is starting to answer my prayers in other ways. He made it possible for me to find an old friend of mine I knew very well twenty years ago and we reconnected and she understands all about this problem my h is having and encourages me to be understanding because he sounds like a solid man.

And then I recieved word that a place we've been wanting to move to is now available. We've been on a list for over a year and its a nicer and bigger place and about $200 cheaper than the place we're in now. I wasn't expecting to hear about his place until next year sometime and it just opened up and will have a vacancy next month.

This will considerable release some of the strain on our finances and its a lovely home at that. Maybe then he will pay more attention to our relationship. There was a time when I wondered if i'd even want to move with him to this place or not. His interest in me seems sporadic at best but good things are happening to me personally.

Of course I can't share my excitement about this with him because he always looks on the negative side and said they probably raised the rent and I said if he didn't mind I would not latch onto something that he doesn't even know is a fact yet.

The price has not changed but he has the need to be negative when we should be happy. I know we haven't got it yet but must he always rain on my parade? My friend thinks he sounds like a good man and she knows me well and guessed what he looked like. I can talk to her about anything so this is a good thing that we found each other again.

She's married and has a husband with a liver disease and sex isn't a real big issue for them but she understands what I mean. She is also a christian so that helps. These are good things and God knew what I needed I guess. The house is all decorated for Halloween and looks spectacular. I like to go all out for the holidays.

Raymond
3rd October 2011, 10:23 AM
That's good news baroness. You husband is a bit negative but don't let that stop you being positive. You will influence him in a positive way.

Great news about the house. I don't know about the Halloween though. I would keep clear of the spirit behind it.

Baroness
3rd October 2011, 01:54 PM
The Halloween decorations are all cheerful, not vampires or witches or scary things. I know all too well about the meaning of the day and what can go on. Just orange lights and cute scarecrows and beautiful flowers. My h brought me this beautiful purple colored flower arrangement yesterday and it was huge so I had to separate it into four individual vases of flowers and they are beautiful.

I asked him what the occasion was and he said Jesus. Maybe God has been dealing with him about things. I know we've been able to talk more than we have before. He's still sleeping most nights on the sofa though and I just decided to say nothing anymore and see how things go. I cannot limit the power of God in this matter.

We actually sat in the front room last night with my head on his shoulder and we were holding hands. Kind of a special moment and I took the initiative of moving close to him and laying my head on his shoulder with my arm entwined with his. Maybe he just needs me to show him affection first before showing it back.

Anyway, kind of excited about moving but it isn't for sure yet. I have prayed about it so we will see what happens. I can honestly say that I'm pretty happy. Some things still need to be worked out of course but I am staying pretty positive these days My h said if we wind up not getting the place then it wasn't God's will in the first place.

It appears he's getting closer to God because he brings HIM into our conversations a lot now.

Raymond
4th October 2011, 05:39 PM
That sounds all good Baroness especially your husband opening up more, to you and to God. You must be influencing him for good. Keep up the good work.

Baroness
8th October 2011, 12:40 AM
He shared with me about how worried he's been over finances and how tired he gets lately. He bought me a beautiful flower arrangement and said he was sorry and yet is making no moves to sleep with me. We've been getting along well and are still waiting to hear if we are going to get this place or not but so far it looks good.

If we do get it then a lot of the stress will be lifted from him because we'll have a couple hundred more a month. I am still waiting to hear about my disability case and have an attorney on it. It seems as though our relationship has changed somewhat in that we now talk more about our feelings and we are not afraid to voice what we feel.

He was very irritable the day we went to fill out the paperwork for the new place and he raised his voice and slammed the van door when he got in. I felt like telling him I didn't want to move anywhere with him but I just got in the van and didn't say anything. It wasn't because I was willing to be talked to like that but because I knew if I said anything it would only make it worse.

The next day was better and he told me that he hadn't felt good that day which isn't an excuse but explains it a little. We are at the point in our relationship where we get along well most of the time and every once in awhile one of us will get irritated at the other one and say so and then we just move on.

He gets me so mad sometimes and yet I find myself turning to God with my feelings and actually praying for my h even thought I might be upset with him at the time. This is really like a miracle for me because when someone lashes out at me, my first response is to do the same. Now I turn to God and pray about the situation instead of saying something that would only further the argument. I think its been over 8 months since we had a disagreement about anything.

I no longer have thoughts of leaving him. I admit when I got mad I thought it but I truly don't think of going out and finding anyone else and since I am close to God now I find myself having difficulty with old habits that I had before I became closer to God. I now think differently about things and don't do things I wouldn't have thought twice about 6 months ago. Its like I'm a new person in a way because I consider what God would want me to do first.

Of course this isn't changing our sex life but we are more affectionate to each other and I find I don't get angry and frustrated as much as I used to. Instead of being in bed and wondering if he's m and getting upset, I might think about it but then just dismiss it from my mind and think about something else or talk to God.

I believe that he does still m but since I can't be sure I can't very well get upset about it. I do think he m because its the easy way out. He knows how I feel about this but I have no way of knowing if he's successful in these attempts and when I walk out into the other room I don't catch him in anything and don't go out there purposely to see if he's doing it, like I used to.

I am giving him the benefit of the doubt but of course I know that he must as least try to m every once in awhile and i've asked God to convict him and show him that this isn't fair. I've asked God to help him deal with stress and to heal his mind so that he isn't thinking of the past or hanging onto to issues from the past. He asked me to marry him again and that was surprising but no more was said about it.

Since he has spent most of his life in and out of bars I think he is trying to adjust to a sober life now. My friend Patty said he was a 'dry drunk' one who doesn't know how to life a sober life. One who is used to having alcohol influence the way he thinks and behaves and talks to people and she says thats why he has a hard time opening up to me sometimes.

He is getting older and I realize his days of drinking may be catching up to him and perhaps that is the reason for the ed. My problem is that I have never had to try and get a man to sleep with me so I don't know the first thing about it. I've never had to initiate anything and now i'm afraid to try because of being rejected.

I don't want to keep talking about us not having sex because that would put him on his guard and maybe make him feel obligated. God has shown me that the way to win in this is to show him love because love conquers all and you can get more with honey than vinegar, as the saying goes. I know this is an odd relationship in that we don't sleep together.

God has also shown me that if I focus on Jesus and leave the rest to him then everything will be okay. I am not like myself at all. I have a peace instead of mounting frustration, I smile at him and say I love him rather than getting angry and not speaking to him. I don't understand how this man can look at me and not want me, but perhaps I don't know what he's thinking.

Maybe he does think about making love to me and I just assume he doesn't. His actions or lack thereof seem very selfish to me. I would never do this to him. And yet he treats me very well and brings me flowers and gives me money. I hope I am not fooling myself in that we can have sex back in our relationship.

Before I was afraid of staying with him and then one day finding out that it was all a waste because he had no intention of every making love to me again. Now I think that its right to stay with him because I love him and change is only possible when you are together, because if you are apart then it is over and you will never know what God could have done if you hadn't acted rashly.

Quite honestly, Raymond, it is very hard for me to remain in a relationship like this. My impulse is to end it and find someone else and yet I do still love him and we've been through a lot together and I like our life most of the time and we get along well in that we aren't domineering and give each other space and we both love God.

So instead of fuming in my anger, I pray for him instead and God gives me a peace and I find myself turning to God instead of trying to figure it out myself. I truly trust God and have faith in him. He has always taken care of me and he is my true husband. I have been through so many changes I hardly recognize myself anymore.

Baroness
15th October 2011, 12:54 AM
Well, I just had the worst experience of my life. I told you we were trying to get a bigger place. Well, we did all the paperwork and things were going fine, I got along with the manager of the apts. who had been a little unfriendly before and we paid for the credit check and background check and then waited for 10 days before we got any results and it wasn't good. I tried calling within that time and was told the manager would contact me when she got word.

It seemed like a long time but I didn't think there was a problem because my h has excellent credit and its mainly his credit they were interested in and I knew our background checks were fine because we'd already passed them for our volunteer work up at the canyon. I work for a friend of mine and they sent her a letter and she sent it back and yesterday we got a certified letter stating that we were refused because they couldn't verify our rental history or my employer.

I was shocked. They knew we lived in a senior housing complex and we have been here 4 years and never late on the rent. They said they tried to call and the phone was disconnected which is ridiculous. Two women are in the office at all times and there's voice mail. My friend sent in her letter and they told my mother, who they did manage to call, that they couldn't get ahold of my friend, both surprisingly and ridiculous reasons.

My friend took me into their office this morning, willing to sign another letter and the woman wouldn't even consider having her do this. She was glaring at me and said they had rented the apartment to someone else. When they couldn't verify these things they were told to reject us. I couldn't understand this. I told them the phone number for our apts. was the same and we had voicemail.

I know I wrote it down right and am sort of articulate with business matters. They said they never got the letter and couldn't get a hold of her at all and she told them she has a record of who calls and they weren't on there and if they did call, why not leave a voicemail? She wouldn't answer any questions or work with me at all.

I couldn't understand this woman's reaction. Even when we said that what she was saying was impossible and me and this manager had even previously talked about where I lived and she knew it well, it is impossible that she would get a no longer in service message and she wouldn't even check the number even though I had a card from the apts. and the girl in the office of our apts. told me no one had called or sent a letter.

My friend asked if I was still on the list, we had waited a year and a half for this opening, and she said no in an unfriendly tone and she just wanted us out of her office. I was floored and just walked out but have reported them for discimination and found out who owned the building and email them and now I am following through with reporting them to the housing authority.

My h told her earlier that he had worked with the company that had designed the building and she didn't realize that I could find out the name of the company that owned the apts. I am very adept at finding out anything I want on line and I found out their phone number, address, and email. I decided to oppose the decision as is my right to do and wrote a letter officially informing them of this and that I was going to report them as discriminating against us.

I can't believe this has happened and what I thought was something from God turned out to be a nightmare. I liked the apartment and wanted to move there but more than that was insulted by the way they treated me and by their flimsy excuse. They could have said anything else and I might have believed them but she was totally rude to me and my friend and wouldn't even consider checked the phone numbers or anything else.

I don't think its possible that I wrote down the wrong number cause I copied out of my little phone book. I can't believe she was so friendly and then so rude and unmoving. I told her it wasn't fair and just left but this has hit me very hard. Thing is, my h told me from the beginning that he didn't like her, that there was something going on that we didn't know about but I ignored him because I thought he was being paranoid.

I am so disappointed and disillusioned. We waited so long for that apt. and it was like a bungalow and had more room and a patio and now I have to stay here in this small apt. listening to his loud music and dealing with the same problem of him not sleeping with me. I realize we would have had the same problem there but at least I would be busy unpacking and we would have more room.

He acts like it doesn't matter to him and just says if God closes one door he will open another but I am very upset. Nothing has happened between us in a physical sense except that he told me he didn't know why he was so tired but in the evenings he has no energy and goes to bed early. I guess he was trying to explain why we haven't made love and I reminded him on the day when it was a year of no sex.

He said he remembered and I said he did? He said yes but no more was said about it and now this major disappointment is almost more than I can bear. I thought God was answering a prayer and how could such a thing happen? We are in no position to find another place because that was a much cheaper rent and everything in this area is high.

I just get so disgusted when nothing ever seems to work out for me. He doesn't seem to care about anything but I care deeply. I can't sell my hats or even things on ebay, can't find a part time job and haven't heard about my disability yet. I feel like I have nothing to look forward to except living with a man who is not going to even try to get closer to me.

We have been getting along rather well and he tells me he loves me and brought me some more flowers but he has taken away something that I used to look forward to very much. Most of the time I am okay because I read the bible and pray but every once in awhile when I go to my room by myself I get upset about this all over again and then pray and talk to God about it.

I know now that I will always feel this way. There will never be a time when I feel okay with it but I treat him the same which is with a lot of love because I start feeling better or I stop thinking about it and i'm beginning to think that it isn't ed at all but low sex drive. I got some advice from another site and they told me that's what they think it is. And he did say he was tired a lot.

Why did such a horrible thing happen with the apt? There is no explanation and I will never know the reason why. It seems as though everything I try fails and i'm not feeling sorry for myself but this is the way its been since I lost my job in 2009. I can't get anywhere and don't understand why God isn't answering any of my prayers. Why do horrible things like this happen to good people?

I feel different now, tired of struggling and afraid to trust anyone in the world now because it never works out. I am truly depressed and fell as though I don't really have anything to live for. I have my children and i'm not suicidal but I get nothing but bad news. I look at my life and except for my talents, I see nothing good. I don't think i've ever felt this low before, not even when I first came on here telling you all about my h lack of interest.

Now I have to deal with this other thing on top of not feeling fulfilled as a woman. I am a strong woman but I feel myself starting to crack a little. I've been through a lot, a husband who won't make love, quitting vodka, dealing with losing my job and having to get unemployment and when that ran out, general relief, and I never thought I would be in this place.

I thought getting closer to God would make a difference and he has helped me but now I feel as though he has abandoned me and I don't understand why he would allow this to happen. I've always tried to do what is right and treated people with kindness and loved my husbands even though they treated me badly, and yet I still show love to this husband because I still love him.

I've been patient and understanding and didn't go out and cheat on him when I thought that's what I needed, I stayed with the sinking ship so to speak, and always show love to him and others and go out of my way to help friends and family, and this is what I get. Now I think that love has never done me any good at all and no matter what I do or try, it never works out.

I sound like i'm feeling sorry for myself, but to me i'm just calling it as I see it and above all I just don't understand any of it.

Raymond
15th October 2011, 11:14 AM
You just need to talk yourself up as you normally do without our help Baroness. I am sure you will as you consider what has happened. Does seem like some funny business going on. Your investigation will show possibly. Maybe they wanted the bungalow for a friend. Who knows. I think Hubby speaks some sense here.

Baroness
16th October 2011, 07:06 PM
Yes, he did and come to find out he didn't really like the apartment even though it was bigger. Of course I have the type of personality that bounces back with the help of God. A good friend told me it would take 2 weeks at least before I wasn't upset about it anymore and I told her no, that isn't the way I am. I find something positive in negative actions and while I was really diappointed and angry the first couple of days I seem okay now.

I went to those apts. and was willing to work it out and she wouldn't even talk to me about it. Said we were off the list and that was that. My employer was with me and I have contacted the owners and submitted reviews on line and that's about all i'm willing to do. My h wants to get an attorney and fight this but I think it would be best to just let it go. I don't want this experience taking over my thoughts and life.

My mother, who is a good christian, told me that maybe God saw something bad happening there once we moved in and was blocking it to spare us that. My h says it doesn't matter cause he's leaving it to God. It does seem like he's talking about God a lot lately. It was a set back but who knows what would have happened once we moved in?

And since I know my h didn't cared for the manager or some aspects about the place I would have constantly had to worry about him getting upset and I don't want to do that. When we began this process he told me he didn't like her and something was amiss and he added that he's telling me that so I will no be surprised at his 'I told you so's'. I had no idea he had these feelings about the place.

He is kind of negative sometimes and I just can't believe our reactions to this place were so different, especially since he isn't happy here and kept saying he wished they would call us. This is a very small place but now I am motivated to get a bigger place eventually. Still waiting on disability but they do have larger apts. in this complex so maybe we could see if we can get one of those.

If not, God will show us a different place. I just rearranged the bedroom, I do that sometimes and now it feels like a different room. I spend a lot of time doing things and keeping busy so I don't dwell on our problem with his low sex drive. I don't know why this terrible thing happened to us but I think it might have been a test.

Would I still be faithful and read my bible and pray even though I didn't get what I want? The answer is yes! Disappointed but not defeated.

chosen
17th October 2011, 02:38 AM
Good on you baroness.
Of course you were disappointed, but your husbands faith is certainly growing and that is fantastic.
We tried to move 3 times since we married 6 years ago and it never worked out. The last time we got very close to moving, and each time we were disappointed, but its always for a reason, and I am still believing that God has something far better for us. The second time, it turned out that the place we loved was only a half a mile away from where his ex was moving to(and we didnt even know she was moving), so God saved us from that.The first time my husband stopped working in that area, so it would have been pointless to live there, and where we are now is far nicer.
I agree that the whole situation with the appartment was very odd, and that Probably God didnt want you in that situation. Its hard to trust Him when we feel disappointed, but He is doing the very best for you both. You will look back and see the bigger picture.

Raymond
17th October 2011, 01:10 PM
Reminds me of the house we lived in in London. Constant beat music through the walls, even at night. One never knew when it was going to be quiet and even when it was one anticipated the start of the music again.

God gave us a verse in Is 25:4/5 about the blast of the alien beating against the wall like the burning sun and a cloud coming to quieten it and then the song of the terrible ones being diminished. I couldn't get anywhere with my efforts. Then the company moved out of London and us with it. That was certainly a release that I couldn't manufacture on my own.

Baroness
18th October 2011, 04:36 AM
Nice to hear from you again, Chosen. Well, I'm happy to say that I haven't thought about what happened with those apts. in a couple of days. I've moved on, chalked it up to God seeing something in the future that we couldn't know about and I haven't thought of it all day. I did contact the owners and told them what happened and that's all I'm willing to do.

It surprises me that I have put it behind me so soon. I was so upset at the time and thought I would just hate it here now but I rearranged my bedroom and I like it and it gives me more space and I have just adjusted. I have a knack of adjusting to things quite easily but this time I thought I would have a problem and so did everyone else, but its in the past and now i'm focusing on other things.

Me and my h had a nice time watching football and I made lasagna. I thought he might sleep in the bed since his side is right by the door and he did say something about that being his side but hasn't slept in here yet but at least he knows its easier to get to because I had the bed pushed up against the wall where he would have had to crawl over to lay down and he has laid down but I no longer dwell on it.

I've decided to lighten up a bit and not dwell on things. He told me yesterday that he thought I would eventually 'kick him to the curb', thats how he put it and he's said that before. I told him not to be ridiculous and he should know if i'm staying with him under these conditions then he doesn't have to worry about me leaving him.

I know why he says that. He thinks something this good will eventually end because this is his longest relationship and he isn't even making love to me so he must be surprised that i'm still here and he's told me as much. I am here to show him that when God puts two people together, no matter what they go through and how hard it gets, love remains and they somehow work it out.

It isn't easy and I know he still hasn't come to bed but for some reason when I look at him i'm filled with all this love for him. I don't know why because its very frustrating to want someone you can't have but I haven't given up. I think we will be together again, when things settle down with our finances. Whenever i've questioned him about if we will ever be together again, and its been quite awhile since I did, he says that it isn't over yet.

I believe that it isn't over yet. We talk more freely about it now and both of us are at ease. He told me he gets tired in the evenings but that next year he was going to cut way down on his hours up at the canyon so we could spend time together. He's the type of man that if he's worried about something, and right now its the van, he puts all his thoughts into that and then when its taken care of, he's fine.

I told him that the reason he and I work is because we both love God and he agrees wholeheartedly. Things are good, even if I get a little frustrated sometimes, I bounce right back to my good humor because he is more than a husband to me. He is my friend.

chosen
18th October 2011, 11:13 AM
Thanks Baroness
I was away for 2 weeks and a week after returning from the holiday, only last week, I got taken into hospital and had to have my appendix removed.I Am recovering now but still tired and weak and bruised. Still cant expect too much after only a week of the op can I.

Raymond
18th October 2011, 01:07 PM
Nice to see you back Chosen. I thought you had gone. I had a hernia op four weeks ago. My first ever op. As well as the scar it takes a lot our of the body which has to heal from the cutting about. I had a few false starts thinking I was back to normal just because the scar healed. You do need rest. After swimming in the sea on my anniversary and beating my friend six love in tennis, I knew I was then okay and it proved so. The zip will come back if you are kind to your body.

chosen
18th October 2011, 01:29 PM
Thank you Raymond. My wound hasnt even healed completely yet, and also the anaesthetic takes time to get over as well. My tummy is very bruised and colourful.lol. Am just trying not to expect to much of myself but do miss swimming and dog walking. They reckon 2-3 weeks till full recovery and no lifting for 6 weeks. My daughter had hers out alomst exactly a year ago, and she took 2 weeks to recover, but she is 24 years younger than me which helps.

Its very interesting in Hospital, as all social barriers come down and it brings out the best and worst in patients and their family.I did a lot of quite praying for others there while I was laying there feeling ill and in pain both before and after the op.

Also the surgeon was Australian, like my husband, the same age, and was from the same part of OZ as him(Brisbane). It tuns out he was doing his medical training at the same uni that my husband was studying for his phd at, and his (the surgeons)dad lives in a town just outside Brisbaine where my husbands family live. Its such a small world isnt it, when you think of the size of Australia.
The hospital, our local one, is fantastic, and the staff great. Its my second op there(third in total)
God Bless the nhs!

Raymond
19th October 2011, 08:39 AM
Sounds similar to me. My tummy was black and blue. No sex for a while. I got back to swimming pretty quickly though as somehow it didn't pull. I think I messed the cut up somewhere though as part of it is a thin line and the other looks like it came undone and is a thickish line.

Baroness
20th October 2011, 02:36 AM
That's too bad, Chosen. I'm fortunate in that the only time I was in the hospital was when I had my 2 children which were 9 years apart and the last time in 2001 I had a dnc. That sounds painful but gives you time to reflect and relax. I hope you feel better soon.

chosen
20th October 2011, 09:41 AM
Thank you Baroness. On the positive side, I have lost 6lbs weight in 10 days so that cant be bad.:)

Baroness
26th October 2011, 12:38 AM
I went to the doctor yesterday and he put me on permanent disability. Before this I at least had hoped to return to work. I do have an attorney working on my disability case but my back hurt so bad last night I could hardly walk. I feel a little better now but my h seems unsupportive and has made no move to comfort me or anything, which is surprising since he went through the same thing.

He just acts like he wants to be left alone. We didn't get that place but I have adjusted to it, thinking maybe God saw something in the future that we know nothing about. I just feel like everything I try never works out and yet I know I must have faith and now my body is acting up and I don't know how to be weak and sick and just accept it.

My h has made no attempts to get close and I feel there is a great expanse of space between us now. He's polite enough but seems to just want to be left alone to watch tv. Things are not so good and all my well intentions have done no good. Things are the same and maybe even worse and I feel that if I have to live with such pain, what is the point of living? Last night it was really bad, i've never felt such pain.

I'd rather go back to work than win the disability case but there is no cure for what I have. Yesterday my h went up to the canyon instead of taking me to the doctor and I think that's why my back was so bad last night. I had to take 2 buses and do some walking and he wasn't even teaching a class up there. I just don't understand him. Sometimes I really hate him.

I was doing really well and then he started watching naked women again on tv in movies with me sitting right there and a lot of sex and he just doesn't care if i'm sitting there. Its humiliating and I feel so alone now. I have my family and friends but the man I love is sitting out there and acting as though I don't exist.

I really can't post anymore right now. I just feel like crying.

Raymond
26th October 2011, 08:34 PM
You have a lot of negatives today Baroness. Are you sure there is no cure for what you have? I thought you was a pentecostal.

Hubby seems to be straying a bit in what he is watching. I sympathise with that.

I am sure you will talk yourself up and win the negative battle as you always do.

Baroness
26th October 2011, 10:52 PM
Its osteoarthritus and there is no cure and you're right, I am doing better today because about six this morning I started reading my bible and praying and became determined that not even arthritus is going to get me down. The idea came to me to fast and pray for these issues in my life. The only cure is if God heals me and I believe in healing and I know he can do it.

It looks like I don't have much going for me in that my body hurts and my man is like a mannequin just sitting there watching tv and I get no encouragement from him, but I have God the the bible said to delight thyself in him and he would give you the desires of your heart and to wait on him and that's what I plan on doing.

I felt so much better after my time with God and I spend over an hour just thanking him for the answers. Yesterday I felt like there was no reason to live if it had to be like this and nothing has changed with him but God did touch me and my back is much better today and I can't let the enemy win. I am an assembly of God christian but I have learned to be open minded and not so 'one way, only way' like my mother.

I believe in the bible and in God and even though I have rough days, if I keep my eyes on him and in the word then maybe I won't handle the rough times like I have been doing. Its just hard when everything goes wrong but I know this is the enemy because i'm getting closer to God.

Raymond
27th October 2011, 08:23 AM
You sound much better today baroness and have talked yourself up or encouraged yourself in the Lord. Well done.

Remember by His stripes you were healed. I know it's a matter of appropriating that and it can be a battle but the provision for our healing has already been made.

There's not much you can do about hubby except to seek God for yourself. That will affect him in the long run.

Baroness
27th October 2011, 08:17 PM
That's exactly what I have been doing. It has occurred to me for the first time that God might have a ministry in mind for me and i'm so focused on what is happening here that its holding me back. When I was younger I had the gift of healing in our church. I was very young but God would lead me to who needed healing in their body and I would lay hands on them and they would be healed.

That was a long time ago and I also had faith for others in their lives, my mom is always telling me I have a lot of faith and I do intercessory prayer for others, I don't know if you know what that means. It seems that I do have a lot of faith when it comes to over people, but its just my own life I have doubts about. However; I have given my life over to God and everything in it.

I don't want anything to hold me back when God opens a door for me spiritually speaking and it is my own thoughts and disappointment that keep me from believing God can make a difference in my life. I believe that he can but I get bogged down with this boring man I live with who doesn't seem to want to do anything.

I have to rise above my own negative thoughts and disappointment and go on for the lord no matter what my h acts like or does. God will only change a life if that wants and accepts Gods intervention. I have changed quite a lot since I have been praying for him to change. He hasn't changed at all that I can see. He still makes no effort but I might have to just accept that he is the way he is.

But that doesn't mean my life has to be as stagnant as his is. He is very stubborn and believe that I will leave him one day. He says it in jest but I think he believes that after all these years. But I don't see him making much of an effort. The effort is basically all mine and now I have to let it go. I can't spend all my life worrying about if i'm ever going to have sex again.

I have to turn this over to God because he has greater things for me and when I continually dwell on how my marriage is lacking, it isn't moving forward. I have to look at the good things that I do have, and yes, even the things about him that are good. This doesn't mean I deny what is or isn't happening, it just means I have to leave it to God and somehow get through the times when I am depressed about his lack of........well, his lack of life, really.

He's like a dead person who just sits there and watches tv and get annoyed when I disturb him. If this marriage fails it won't be because I didn't try or gave up. I can only do everything I can but I'm done with trying to get him to respond to me or even talk to me because its useless. If he wants to live his life in a cocoon of just tv and running up and playing in the woods, then so be it.

I am going to look forward to the wonderful things God has in store for me and I will go on, arthritus or not, and do what God wants me to do and I have already started by putting him first in my day. Sometimes I feel trapped in this house of silence, but I don't have to be. Jesus will free me of the shackles that have bound me so far.

Raymond
29th October 2011, 09:37 AM
You can do much worse things with your time than healing the sick and interceding Baroness but you still have to keep right in your marriage as that will affect what you do. It won't be a hobby or distraction but a calling, if that is what He is calling you to.

I think you need to be a little careful in the way you talk about him. When you talk about him as boring it doesn't quite ring true to me. I know you are just venting but you can create a wedge if you are not careful. You obviously need other activities and you will be bored if you are not doing them.

Baroness
29th October 2011, 09:36 PM
I will explain to you what I mean by boring, Raymond. He goes up to the canyon in the morning. He comes home and sits on the sofa and watches tv. He does not move all day except to go to the bathroom. I fix dinner and take it to him. He says thank you. I do the dishes and he's watching reruns so I go on my computer and sometimes watch movies. I don't see him again unless he comes into the bathroom and then he doesn't say anything.

In all this time he does not talk to me and when I try to start a conversation he will nod and act like I am disturbing him. I stay in here until its time to go to bed and he will either already be in bed with the lights out or will stay up watching God knows what. Every day is like that except for thursday when he doesn't go up to the canyon and then he sits there from morning to night doing the same thing.

On sunday because there is football he will buy beer and will sit there and watch football and I will too and he will be more friendly when he drinks and even tells me he loves me and sometimes makes me laugh but mostly stares off in his own world. It used to be, over a year ago, that he would come to bed and we'd make love, now he just sits there until I go to bed and sleeps on the sofa.

If this is not boring then please tell me what is.

Baroness
29th October 2011, 09:47 PM
Also, I do keep myself very busy. I am painting christmas houses now and I also am working on a novel. I do many things that are creative including decorating the house for the holidays. In the 4 years we have been here we only went out to dinner once and that was for my birthday and I wanted to go to Olive Garden. We do not go out to the movies anymore and we do not eat out.

We have no friends coming over because he doesn't like my best friend Mickey and so he likes to just sit where he is. Most mornings he is gone up at the canyon and so I can watch what I want. There is no affection or anything unless he has had a few beers. He never tells me I look nice or compliments me in anyway and the only interest he has is the news and politics.

He is not interested in going out with me and says we don't have the money and the only way he has a personality at all is if he's drinking. He's tired all the time and takes naps and while he isn't going to the bar anymore, he is doing the same thing here. He is very popular up at the canyon but he isn't popular here.

However; I show him a lot of love and smile at him and just accept all this because the alternative would be to argue and still get nowhere. When I pray and read the bible this helps me to deal with it all. But at night when I go to bed it is very difficult. I told you he treats me like a roommate and I am not exaggerating in anything i've told you.

This is exactly what happens on a day to day basic unless he snaps at me for something and last time I snapped right back and then we forget about it and so this is what my life is like. When he does talk about when we'll have more money he says then we can go to the bar. That's what he thinks us getting out and doing something consists of.

I have lived this way for a long time and we do co exist together pretty well unless he's irritable about something. When something bothers him up at the canyon he will spend a lot of time venting to me but when I need to vent he is not interested. I am not trying to paint a picture that is false. This is what I live with.

He isn't interested in trying in this relationship. He is kind though and speaks to me in a kind tone most of the time but does not want to discuss our relationship or sex or anything else and he expects me to just accept the way he is. The only time he really talks to me is when he's been drinking and then I will have a nice time with him every once in awhile. Still, the evenings used to wind up with sex and now they wind up the same way whether he's drinking or not and that is me alone.

This isn't a marriage anymore, it is two people who basically get along living together. I am a very loving person but he keeps everyone at a distance.

Forever
29th October 2011, 09:48 PM
That's BORING....Who is the real person? The one he is when he is drinking...or the one he is when he is not?

Raymond
30th October 2011, 10:11 AM
I agree that is very boring for you Baroness.

I think you just have to be a livewire yourself without him. There will be answers as you seek God and develop a lifestyle for yourself. My wife doesn't wait for me. She does all sorts of things when I am work and I am glad that she does. She's out and about all over the place but she always picks me up from work. Then we might go swimming or get ready for housegroup in our house or just enjoy pottering about.

It sounds like you have married an unbeliever inbibing TV all day. Or maybe he is a believer and needs to stir himself up a bit. I don't know what you can do about it except pray and model Jesus in your life. Do what you are doing I would say. That's when you are talking yourself up of course. You will bear fruit if you keep at it.

Baroness
1st November 2011, 08:40 PM
We actually had a good talk sunday and I think I finally understand him and why he's been acting the way he has. Of course I still don't understand why he doesn't sleep with me totally, but I'm beginning to. He has a lot of stress right now, which he opened up to me about. We make it financially but have nothing left over and he said we can't even go out to dinner and this is what he's been thinking about; that he's tired of this.

I had an alternative solution for him. We could move out to the desert where my mother lives and I showed him pictures of two bedroom houses for anywhere from $525 - 625 a month. We pay $810 now and that would free up a lot of money. He said that next year around June we would probably do this because things are pretty bad here as far as high prices go.

Not only would I finally have a house but I would be near my mother and brother and be available as my mother gets older. He doesn't want to leave the canyon where he goes every day but I told him there is a big forest up there and he can volunteer. I can tell he doesn't want to really do this but he is also open to God opening doors. We talked about God and he was venting quite a bit and I said why not just trust in God?

He said he is and he's been meditating but when I trust God I don't keep talking negatively about it to him over and over again, which is what he does. He's said the same exact thing to me last sunday. He is so caught up in fixing the van and paying the bills that he gives little thought to sex and may be incapable of it but that doesn't explain the past year but I didn't push it. He said he knew we would be together forever and that he loved me.

Since then I have been my same happy self whether he is talking or not. I see no reason for me to continually be silent just because he is. I intend on just being myself and being affectionate, which I do not do when he just sits there and doesn't say much. What he's doing is sitting there worrying about all this and there is no need to. First of all, I gave over everything to God and its like a heavy burden has been lifted and I don't feel depressed anymore.

Usually in the morning I'm kind of quiet because when I wake I think about what he isn't giving me but now I read my bible right away before any negative thoughts can come. I truly am not worried about my future. God told me everything is going to be okay and if he wants to sit there and brood about things that haven't happened yet; fine. But I'm going to be happy and look forward to the things God has in store for us. I think he was a little surprised yesterday when he was getting ready to leave and I jumped up and said, Hey! You haven't given me a hug in awhile! And then I hugged him and he hugged me back. Maybe he just needs a little encouragement and to know that we are in this together.

He's done this before, been all quiet because he's worried and it always upsets me because he isn't thinking about us, but that's the way he is and I usually react to the way he is, but why should I put myself through such mental turmoil? Just be myself and maybe he will even see that a true christian trusts God and believes in him, not just lip service, and believes in him so much that they thank him for the answer first.

I believe now that God closed the door on those apartments because he either saw something that was going to happen or he has something better for us. A nice 2 bedroom house with land all around it is definitely better than a one bedroom with a small patio. My h is the outdoors type and we have no yard or patio here so once he's out in nature he is happier.

With a yard and room to breathe I know we would both be happier and I believe also that this is what God had in mind from the first. Everything happens for a reason. I don't really believe in coincidence or things happening by chance. Not when you are looking to God for answers. He may not want to move away from this canyon but who knows what God has in store for him up there and how he will use him?

We are talking about God more in our lives and somehow during the evening of conversation ,my worries about him and I, left. Maybe once he doesn't have a car repair over his head and is in a place where we can free ourselves of stress, he will relax and pay attention to this relationship. I don't understand why he can't do both, but I know he is like this.

The answer to your question, Forever, is that he is more himself when he's had a couple of beers because he's relaxed enough to tell me what he's been keeping inside. When he's sober he keeps things to himself because he doesn't want to worry me and this is what he told me. I personally believe worry is a sin because if you truly trust God you shouldn't worry.

However; I am guilty of something similar when I give everything to God and still have moments when i'm upset that he isn't sleeping with me and I feel frustrated because we are wasting so much time. I do trust God but its hard to wait sometimes. I still feel he isn't being quite fair in not making an effort to be with me. What's wrong with turning to the one you love in times of trouble?

To make love and strengthen your bond, to just hold hands or hold each other when you sleep? When i've had a hard day I go to him for a hug. I guess men don't feel that way, at least this one doesn't but I have to let him be himself and accept it and I also have to be myself and not let his moods determine what kind of day I have, or whether i'm in a good mood or not.

The good news is that my back feels so much better since i've been taking these over the counter back pain pills. There are no side effects and it doesn't make me drowsy and I feel 10 years younger. I plan on occupying myself with things I like to do and I have been doing this but I would like he and I to do things also, but first we have to take one step at a time.

I just hope nothing else is going on to cause his lack of interest in sleeping with me, like he'd rather m or something. I know he has been faithful and I know he loves me, its different than the way I love him. I would do anything for him and have and if I didn't want to have sex and I knew he wanted it I would make the attempt because I loved him. However; I haven't had any more instances where I walk into the room at night and his movements make me think he's been m. I don't know if he has or not but I know a normal man would not prefer that to being with a woman who fulfilled his needs and he's told me he loves to make love to me before.

I know its a little different for a man because if his member doesn't work then the party is over and I think stress can do this, but he's told me himself that God obviously has something better for us so he needs to practice what he preaches. Anyway, if I feel affectionate i'm going to go hug him, if he comes in with a frown, i'm going to smile at him. It isn't important that I feel these things might not be reciprocated.

And who knows? Maybe he needs me to be my cheerful self, maybe amidst his stress, what he needs to see is me being happy and self confident. I haven't done that because when I try to talk to him he just nods and acts like i'm disturbing him. Well, I'm going to disturb him! I'm going to disturb him right out of his negative thoughts!

Baroness
3rd November 2011, 04:00 PM
Good news. He went to get the van smogged and it passed. He did a partial tune up and we saved $150 and you should see the difference in him. He's more relaxed and he actually slept with me and held me all night tightly. We're getting along better and he's talking more. I told him that I had told him that God would take care of everything and he didn't have to worry.

There wasn't much doubt in my mind that it would work out and he just worries about things he doesn't have to. Thats where faith in God comes in. I told him I prayed about it and I knew God was going to take care of things. I didn't know we'd wind up saving $150 but when God does something he does it right.

His whole demeanor is different. We were dancing together in the front room to oldies and singing together. He's an excellent guitarist and he plays the banjo and has a good voice and I do as well, I was in the church chior for all of my youth and it was nice to sing again. Him holding me all night was nice also and sometimes I think he's waiting for me to make the first move, like in the morning but i'm unsure because the last thing I want to do in try and initiate something and be refused and him make excuses.

I even put on the neglige he likes and we had a nice time. This is more like the h I knew but work still needs to be done. At least now I feel comfortable enough to tell him what I'm thinking and he has gotten some of his sense of humor back. He had me laughing yesterday and he's right, we will be together forever.

I'm sorry if i've repeated anything. I don't remember what I told you on the 1st of Nov. God is helping me get through a difficult time. I don't like change much, especially in my relationship, but its obvious that he still loves me and wants me and I think I need to lighten up on all the thinking I do about him and me.

I need to focus on God, which is what I've been doing, but not dwell so much on what I think is missing in this relationship. I didn't say anything to him about not making love to me because I want him to feel he can sleep with me without repercussions of any kind. I still love him very much and I'm looking forward to our thanksgiving, just the two of us. For whatever reason; we seem to work together, even if things aren't as I would prefer.

The most important thing is that I know he has no desire to cheat on me and I know he loves me and watches out for me. I feel safe with him. God help me, but I am still attracted to him.

Baroness
11th November 2011, 06:56 PM
I don't think I will post on here anymore. I'm not really getting much feedback and things are not changing in my relationship. There is no reason for me to continue to be unhappy. I am still praying and reading the word but the truth is that he isn't putting an effort into this relationship and I don't think that will change, whether I pray or not.

God has given me the strength to not wallow in anger but things are going wrong in this household and sometimes I feel like I am out of God's will. One bad thing after another happens and it has driven us further apart in many ways. The fact that he worries about things that are happening with our finances should have nothing to do with whether he sleeps with me or not.

Meanwhile, I have all this love to give and I don't feel comfortable in my own home anymore. I know its difficult for couples when bad things happen but there doesn't seem to be anything between us anymore. I think he does love me but that it is a selfish love. I think he has been m all along and it hardly matters if he has or hasn't because he is not fulfilling his responsibilities regarding us as a couple.

I've said all along that I don't think relationships can last without sex and I think I am right. There might be some women who can live this way but I am not one of them. I have asked God to open a door for me to leave if that is what he wants. We have a common law marriage and not one where we actually had a wedding. He wants to have a wedding, or so he says, but he keeps making excuses for that as well.

I feel like i'm married to him and in the eyes of the law I am because next may we will have been together ten years but that isn't in the eyes of God, I don't think. It will go one of two ways. He will either start paying attention and making an effort or this relationship will just fall apart. I have mixed emotions about it but feel he is holding me back spiritually since God has a calling on my life.

He will not go to church with me. He meditates by himself and that is it. Meanwhile, God is teaching me many things about my own self and other spiritual things that have little to do with this marriage. I am tired of trying to hold things together but I am trapped here right now. He is putting more pressure on me because I have no money coming in here and I am still waiting on disability.

I'm tired of him venting to me about how hard he has it and if I don't get disability I don't know what it will be like around here. My back is getting worse and he is always withdrawn so I can't share anything with him and he seems to have no empathy about the pain I live with because he hurt his back years ago. If I get worse he will not be able to take care of me. He is often edgy and moody and I can't have someone like that where I would feel I am a burden.

I bent over backwards to take care of him when he was flat on his back and I had only known him 2 months. The feeling will not be reciprocated and I have my family who would be more than happy to help me out. My back hurts and neck but I still have good days. Why should I have to spend the rest of my life like this?

When we got that break on the smog check for the van he went to the bar and spent the money we had saved. He could have taken me out to eat or something and so I say once a drunk always a drunk. He hasn't been going to the bar for a long time but when he gets money that's what he does. That's what he thinks going out means.

He's too caught up in his own world to realize he's in danger of losing me. How did he think this would work? No attempt at closeless or sex or anything at all. He's perfectly happy to sit in there and watch reruns and have me go in here. I cook for him and clean house but I am not his nurse and caretaker. I am too young to just give up on life like he has.

I am capable of deep love and I can make a man happy and have always done so but there comes a time when the time for just settling for what you have is over. I have been praying about this and if God opens the door I will walk through it. He is bringing me down to his negative outlook and if it wasn't for God I would be very depressed.

I have the victory and I know God has good things in store for me!

Forever
12th November 2011, 07:14 PM
We had no idea that the two of you were not married. That changes the whole landscape. As for not getting much feedback...well, sometimes we feel that someone just wants to vent...and other times, especially when we dont have all the facts, we dont have all the answers.

Baroness
12th November 2011, 08:36 PM
No one has all the answers. I came on here to see if there was anyone living thru something similar and I found out that there are many women who do. In the eyes of the law we are married and have been engaged for over five years. I feel married, i've been with him for so long. He says he feels like we are married too and that a piece of paper isn't going to change that. I have to go by what the bible says even though we don't sleep together anymore.

Regardless, I have to stop thinking about what is wrong with us so much and wait for an open door to either move on or remain. Since I obviously can't accept my relationship the way it is, it might be better to move on but I am waiting for God to show me how to do this. Finances are the problem right now but won't always be and I have to be careful in what I decide.

No one can tell me what to do about this. It did help to hear of other people having the same problem but I am not the type to just accept this and just deal with whatever he dishes out. But today I made a resolution to stop dwelling on this, to stop talking about it on line and to my family and friends. Its getting me nowhere and only makes me frustrated.

I'm okay with it a lot of the time but then comes the time when I am alone in my bed that I am not okay with it and I don't think I ever will be and so you see, there is a lot of work to be done and a lot to think about but it isn't helping me to constantly dwell on it.

Whether he purposely shuts me out or he doesn't mean to, is really beside the point. I am being shut out and after I have opened my heart and life to him and have for many years. I do not fear for my future. I am trusting in God to show me the way. I have complete faith in him and so no one has to worry about me. There has never been a short supply of men in my life but the last thing I need is another disastrous relationship.

Perhaps God wants me to remain here, perhaps he's not finished with his work in my fiance, if you prefer me to call him that. I don't know, but I do know that God will show me but I have to trust in him. That's what this has been about all along. Me getting close to God and trusting him. The enemy is attacking me in many ways but I will not be defeated.

I love god and believe in the bible and feel he has a calling on my life. All the things I have gone through in my life can help me to help other women who have gone through some of the things I have or maybe all of the things. A lot has happened to me that I haven't put on here and I believe we are allowed to go through things because God can use that.

I'm not saying God wants us to make bad choices but we do make them but instead of living with guilt I think he can use our mistakes to glorify him in the end. Thank you all for talking with me and sharing and it has enriched my life and in a way brought me back to a closeness with God, but better than I had before. I was drowning before I came on here and seriously contemplating an affair.

Now I wouldn't do that because I am walking closely with God and can no longer do things that are not pleasing to him. My walk with him has changed the way I think and now I have decided not to dwell on the negativity in my life and that includes this man who shuts me out even though I have given my all.

I do not hate him or even resent him all that much. Clearly he is incapable of understanding me or he doesn't want to and he is also incapable of understanding me as a christian and in fact, doesn't desire a closer walk with God because he thinks he has arrived at what God wants for him and there is no more. But there is more, there is much, much more.

Forever
12th November 2011, 08:47 PM
Have you ever read that part in the Bible about Jesus talking with the woman at the well?

Baroness
13th November 2011, 01:14 AM
Yes but refresh my memory. What does that have to do with me?

Forever
13th November 2011, 01:32 AM
Well, the man you are now living with is "not your husband" by God's standards. So you can walk away without condemnation in His eyes since you never got married in the first place.

You both may feel married (as do others who shack up), but God has higher expectations for His children than just how we feel about the things we are doing. The woman at the well may have felt married too, but Jesus stated that she was not...He considers those who live that way to be living in a state of Fornication.

So the advice that you were given all this time on this particular forum was invalid for your particular situation because we all thought you were actually married and were advising you as if there were a Covenant sealed by God and the Law...no wonder you felt as if walking away were an option for you...it actually was!!:eek:

I understand that you came to find out how others handled the particular type of problem that you are having at home...but we could have told you things more in keeping with the whole situation had we known it.

So my advice (now) would be to get separated as soon as you are able to... you both need to decide on a date for a wedding as well as what is to be expected from each other within that Covenant.

There is no such thing as "common law" marriage in Gods economy unless you wish to think of yourself as an Old Testament Concubine....somehow I think He wants better for us women than that....and if that is how you wish to think of yourself, know this...concubines were not allowed to just up and leave when things got rough either. They just did not have the higher status of a real wife.

Baroness
13th November 2011, 02:07 AM
I just read, or shall I say re-read the passage of the woman at the well and there is a lot more to it than what you said to me, but the point is that I love him whether he be fiance or husband and I have still made a commitment to him. Why is it that before, when you thought we were married, you and others attitude was to just stay with him and take whatever he dished out and now you're telling me to dump him.

In reality you are saying that wives have to put up with whatever their husbands do and when you love someone but aren't married to him you don't have to put up with anything and you can walk away. Then you say to separate right away which really isn't something you should be saying. You shouldn't tell someone what to do and I have been married twice and I know the way this works.

Just because you're married it doesn't mean you have to just put up with your husband cheating, looking at porn and masterbation but some of the women on here do exactly that. I understand about what you say about a covenant and that marriage is one, and I say that you can be faithful and have a covenant or an understanding with a man you aren't yet married to.

I had my husbands cheat on me, this one has never done that. Yes,I can walk away at some point but only when God has released me to do so. God wanted us together in the beginning and if you knew how he was then you would understand. He has come very far, closer to God than he was before and it is our soul that God is concerned with first.

I think you should be very careful before telling other women to leave their men because they aren't married to them. First of all, I have a home with this man. You expect me to leave my home with all my things and walk away even though I have no finances at this time? I am not married to him but even if I were I would not expect him to pay for everything like most wives on here do.

I am still my own person and we still have built a home together and there is still love between us. A young christian might have taken your words to heart and actually packed up and left with no where to go and then where would she be? Is that what God would want? The answer is no. When I make a commitment to someone its a very serious thing and has nothing to do with us actually being married.

I know a common law marriage is not recognized by God or other people. I don't care about the other people but I am also not committing fornication, as you call it, I don't, because I am not sleeping with him and haven't been for over a year and even when I was I did not label it as a 'dirty' thing as you have insinuated. It was wonderful and he asked me to marry him and I said yes.

And what would anyone have said differently in the beginning? They wouldn't say, yes ,we know how you feel because my husband is cheating on me or my husband doesn't want sex or my husband looks at porn, etc.? If you ask me, the women on here have put up with far worse than I have had to put up with.

And yes, I can leave anytime but that would be the case if I was married to him also. I doubt the woman at the well felt married but we can never know that, God looked beyond her sin to her inner being and she wound up telling everyone about the messiah. You do not know what I had to put up with in my marriages. One was a drug addict and the other cheated on me and was mentally abusive to my son.

My fiance has never done any of those things and at first I didn't want to marry him and then the more I knew him, the more I loved him. We have been together for almost ten years but I haven't lived with him for all that time. Only since 2008 and I thought things would be so much different. I thought we would get married and live a happy life because we had been together for awhile and this is when I was not that close to God.

I won't explain why but a series of events transpired and so I wasn't going to church and even though I would pray, I was on my own course. Now I am back with God and I don't like the circumstances of not being married and the other things, but not being married is the least of it. I will not leave him as soon as I can, as you suggested, and you had no right to suggest such a thing.

If I leave it will be when I am able to do so, if I stay it will because God has willed it so. My intentions are honorable here and I thought I would be married by now, not that marriage is such an important thing to me, but because of what the bible says. He says when our finances improve we will get married and we discussed this again recently. His first marriage was done in Vegas and he wants us to have a church wedding with all the trimmings.

Now, if he decides to marry me, then I have to decide if I want to marry a man who doesn't want to have sex, and this is a problem for me. Whether I am married or not has nothing to do with the situation, it is still the same and I still have a problem here. If you are too prideful or think yourself too self righteous to understand what I am saying and sympathize, then don't respond, but I might remind you that pride cometh before a fall and you have no right to judge me.

Be careful, Forever, lest you take a less stronger christian down a path where she does not wish to go. Marriage has never been kind to me and so I must be sure that's what I want to do before joining the rest of the helpless wives you must always submit to their husbands every whim.

Baroness
13th November 2011, 02:47 AM
I would never judge anyone or tell them to leave someone and so I have to say if anyone cannot support me or understand then I really don't want to hear it. I am not into judging people or telling them they are wrong or condemning them. This is not what God wants. I have laid out my heart to people on this thread because I needed help. I certainly don't need to be judged or for someone to tell me whats in the bible when I already know it. If I wanted advice I would ask my mother and I have.

We are both praying for him but my mother, a true christian, does not condemn either one of us because she likes him and wants the best for me but even my mother put up with a lot from my step father who was a minister and she raised me to do the same thing from a young girl. She said I would have to submit whether I liked it or not but that I had to do what my husband wanted. I didn't buy it then and I certainly don't buy it now. Marriage is supposed to be a partnership, an exchange of respect, not for the man or the woman to do ungodly things regarding sex, and for the other partner to just put up with it because they are married.

I don't think God wants women to lose their identity or self preservation just because they are married. I don't have to give up my mind and will just because the husband thinks he gets the last word. If a husband can show respect and welcome his wife's opinions then that is a different story but I have yet to see that in any marriage. My ex husband tries that with me, telling me the bible said he was head of household and I told him when he came up with something that made sense I would agree and go along with it but I certainly wasn't going to bow down to his decision just because he wore the pants in the family. If a married couple can't learn from each other and talk it over and be willing to listen to the other person's perspective, then that is no longer a marriage but a dictatorship.

If this is the last entry I do and the last time I read anything from anyone then I would still like to say thank you for all the positive comments and I am assuming that everyone else is supportive of me whether I am married or not.

Forever
13th November 2011, 03:00 AM
Baroness,
You have two choices. You can leave because you were never married in the first place...that is wonderful...changes everything because there is no legal or moral Vow before God and witnesses to have to worry about. I did not tell you to dump him...I advised you to move out (you had no business as a Christian shacking up in the first place) and establish a wedding date as well as expectations for what you both want and expect if you both decide to continue to go forward. That is going to provide you with a chance to think about whether or not you actually want to marry someone who will not perform....it will also give him a chance to realize what he stands to lose if he continues to not seek help for his problem.

Second choice is to keep your commitment to stay whether or not you marry....continue living in that situation as room mates and let the chips fall where they may. I think NOT being married is what gave you the idea of feeling you are "more free" to leave or to contemplate having an fling than what another married woman would have thought to do....and you are correct.

As for fornication...well, it seems that you were willing to continue in doing just that and would be STILL be doing so if your partner was willing or able to accomodate you. You had been up until a year ago...but your partner "petered" out. So do not pretend it was ever a pleasing thing to God, nor will it EVER be pleasing to Him in the future.

Please do not assign more to me than what I actually stated. I will not be fighting with you.

chosen
13th November 2011, 05:58 AM
Baroness I have to agree with forever here.I was so suprised when you said that you arent married.
God cannot bless a relationship where the people arent married. It just doesnt happen. THis may be at the root of all your problems.
Why hasnt he asked you? What does that say to you that you have been togather for so long and he still hasnt committed 100% and you have allowed the situation to go on and on?

Now I know that in todays world, getting married isnt thought to matter, and many live together, but God does clearly tell us to marry and not live with a person. You say you have been engaged for 4 years, so whats stops you from marrying? Getting engaged is supposed to be the promise to marry. There is no point in waiting that long especially if you live together.
Forever, said to seperate UNTIL you get married and not for good. I think that may be a good idea in the circumstances actually.
It really doesnt matter what your mother thinks or what you feel, but what matters is what God says if you are a believer. You are both living in a sinful situation, you did have lots of sex initially and may have again if things change, so you do need to marry. Of course he has everything he wants as you are, so why does he need to marry you?. You are not young and there was no reason why you have needed to delay it for so long.

I think that you need to rethink the whole relationship and either both comitt 100% to marriage, (and you can marry in a very short time, you dont need much money) or consider parting if he refuses.

My sister in law was like you. She is a believer but she choose to move in with a non believing man, and couldnt see that it was wrong. Recently her faith has grown and God has been convicting her. After 6 years with this man, who still refuses to marry her, she has taken the hard decision to move out and end the relationship. She is very brave but has done the right thing. She is our age.

You 2 need to talk seriously about this, and if he wont marry you then you may need to reconsider the whole situation because I have to say, if a man wouldnt marry me, I would have been off long ago. THis is very serious baroness, and as forever says it does change everything. You have been asking God to mend that part of your relationship, and bless you both, when he clearly says that sex outside marriage is forbidden, so how did you expect Him to answer your prayers???? Get right with God, do what he tells us to do, and then pray for the healing of the relationship.

Chamomile
13th November 2011, 12:59 PM
Hi

I'm not planning to go back to re-read the whole account again but at some point, I did suss that out even though B kept saying "my H" or "our marriage" etc.

I even asked her a very direct question, "are you married?" before. She continued to describe this relationship as marriage. In a way, we were all misled by her account..not that I enjoy saying this.

We do pick up on other things e.g. intuition, even when someone says otherwise in their threads, don't we? Some people don't really tell the whole truth, unsurprisingly.Is this a deceit? I would say that we all need to be prepared to know that not everyone would recount the whole story as it is over a public forum where we could read only what they write but we fundamentally don't know the posters or the whole story. We all need to read things with a pinch of salt.

chosen
13th November 2011, 02:09 PM
Hi

I'm not planning to go back to re-read the whole account again but at some point, I did suss that out even though B kept saying "my H" or "our marriage" etc.

I even asked her a very direct question, "are you married?" before. She continued to describe this relationship as marriage. In a way, we were all misled by her account..not that I enjoy saying this.

We do pick up on other things e.g. intuition, even when someone says otherwise in their threads, don't we? Some people don't really tell the whole truth, unsurprisingly.Is this a deceit? I would say that we all need to be prepared to know that not everyone would recount the whole story as it is over a public forum where we could read only what they write but we fundamentally don't know the posters or the whole story. We all need to read things with a pinch of salt.

Chamomile, I am usually very intuitive, and pick things up easily, but I never suspected that baroness wasnt married. I sort of feel we have been decieved, as all of our advise as Christians was given thinking that they were married. If I had known they werent, I would have advised her to either get married or seperate.This has been going on for so long and this vital and basic piece of information was not given to us for whatever reason.

Chamomile
13th November 2011, 04:55 PM
Hi Chosen

I appreciate your sentiment and understand where you're coming from.
I'd say, at least, truth has come out (it often does).
I often don't believe everything ppl would say, on the forum.
Healthy dose of scepticism is unfortunately, necessary unless you know the person very well. The same thing in a real time situation. Maybe, I'm a bit too philosophical..x

xx

Baroness
13th November 2011, 05:41 PM
I never pretended that it was right to sleep with him without being married but when this relationship started I was not with God, so to speak. I always loved him but I was doing things that I knew were wrong, drinking, sex outside of marriage, etc. Now I am back with God and my thinking is different. I was always grounded in God and the bible when I was younger and I haven't forgotten anything about what sin is and I am accountable for what I am doing now.

I am sorry that you all feel you have been deceived but in my mind at the time I felt married and I can't explain to you how I felt but since you were all supposed to be christians I wanted to talk to a christian because most of my life, that's what I have been and even though I wasn't walking as God would want me to I still loved him but I did what I wanted instead of what he wanted.

I'd gotten advice from non christians and didn't like what I heard so I came on here and didn't really know you were christians at first and then when I discovered you were I decided to hear what you had to say and it helped me because I was starting to pray again and I had already asked God to forgive me for my sins and I knew that he had.

Gabby had asked me to marry him before we moved in together and then he asked me again, or reaffirmed it about a month ago. I had a talk with him two months agp and said if he didn't want to marry me then that was fine but that I wasn't going to go to hell over a man and that the bible says we are committing fornication. At that time we were not sleeping together so we weren't sinning but I stated the facts to him anyway.

He said he wanted to marry me but we didn't have the money and that he wanted to have a wedding in a church because of being married at vegas with his first wife who was pregnant and so they had to get married. We discussed getting married in Lake Tahoe and having a few friends. I gave him an out and he insisted he wanted to marry me and then again last month he said he loved me and wanted to marry me.

I didn't feel comfortable telling him he either marries me or I'm leaving so I prayed that God would deal with him about this and my mother prayed as well and that was when he asked me. I was very upset last night when I read forevers post but I understand why she would say such a thing. I felt that same way about other women who were not married.

I wouldn't feel this way at all if I hadn't gotten closer to God and put him first in my life but I have and I can't regret and while I might not agree with the way you have told me the things you have, I know that you are right. I don't have a problem facing things head on or admitting that I have been wrong but I didn't intend to deceive anyone, I was just trying to see how a christian woman would handle such a situation.

I did not think of it as lying to you or deceiving anyone, I was only trying to reach out and get answers for the problem and in the process I came back to God fullforce and so now I have to deal with the situation I had gotten myself in a long time ago. I thought it would be so different. When we moved in I assumed we were going to get married, but it wasn't all that important at that time.

Now it is important and I have stressed to him how important it is to me and when I told him what it says about it in the bible he said the bible is open to interpretation. Being a christian most of my life and being brought up in an assembly of God church, I cannot agree with what he said. The bible is not open to interpretation and I told him this, its quite simple and straight forward but this is how he believes.

He believes that because we love each other its okay. My love has always been so strong for him that I didn't want to leave him, I wanted us to get married and I do believe God had some work to do in him and I believe I helped bring this about by showing him love. But now I feel I've done all I can and my situation is not changing and so I find myself in this terrible position where I'm going to have to tell him that I can't stay with him if we aren't married.

He is not going to like this because he will see it as me giving him an ultimatum; either marry me or its over. I never wanted to do that but now there are other aspects of this relationship that aren't right and it seems as though I have to make a choice and I don't want to make it. He has a lot of pride and won't like being told what to do but I have already told him how I feel and it apparently doesn't really matter.

He says when things calm down financially then we will get married. The thing is, ladies, I shouldn't have to try and convince him to marry me. I never had to convince my ex husbands and every man I've known has wanted to marry me. I have given this man everything and I know he loves me and yet a year ago when we did have the money, he chose to spend it elsewhere instead of marrying me.

This is very hard, I hope you understand that. It is especially hard because I still have feelings for him and I will have to leave or ask him to leave and I can't support myself right now. I know the type of man he is and this isn't going to go well, he will see it as me threatening to leave unless he does what I say and what man would like that?

I can't live like this, I believe in the bible and I can't do this anymore. I have given him every chance to make this right and now I just can't do this because deep inside me I have always felt guilty for being in this situation. I brushed it aside and prayed that he would do the right thing, as my mother says, and now I believe that he probably won't.

We are not sleeping together and haven't for a long time but it occurs to me that this is probably the reason why things are continually going wrong for us. I know things happen in life but the bottom line is, regardless of how I got here, I now have to put it all right and this is very scary for me because that means giving up our home together and our life together as well.

Months ago I had tentatively formed a plan in my mind that by next May, when it will be our 10th anniversary, if we still aren't married then I was going to sit him down and tell him that I can't live without being married. Actually, I had this plan after the first year we were here but didn't follow through with it because my head was in a different place and it didn't seem all that important to me at the time.

Now I have to put that plan into motion except that I can't wait until next May. I have no where to go and i've said I don't want to just leave all my things behind. I have prayed about this and told God if he wanted to me leave then to please supply the means to do so. I have prayed this way since I got back to God and I still can't get a job and now my back is hurt and i'm waiting for the disability decision and I will be going to court over it this January.

Why didn't God allow me to get a job so I could be self sufficient? I took it as he wanted me to stay where I was for whatever reason and of course I've gotten closer to him since then. The only thing God has said to me through another christian is for me not to worry about the future, that he had everything under control.

I can't go stay with my mother because she has my brother living with her now because his marriage has fallen apart and I can't go to my best friend near me because she has a house but isn't allowed to have someone live with her, so what am I supposed to do? Saying all this I still feel uncomfortable about just leaving him because I help with food and utilities and if I go he will lose this place.

The government does supply me with a small amount a month for 9 months but isn't enough to live off of. Its easy for you to say to just leave and work things out with him, or not, but I don't have anywhere to go really and I don't want to be a burden on anyone. I don't know what to do.

Some of the things all of you have said kind of hurt my feelings but I don't live in denial, I know I am in a situation where it isn't right and yet i've lived in it for a long time now, waiting for this man to marry me and he still says he wants to marry me. He is not going to understand me telling him I'm going to leave if we aren't married. To him, if you love someone, you are with them and he doesn't believe he or we are sinning at all.

I don't know what else to say except that i'm very upset over this and I know God is not the author of confusion. I have to pray about this and try to decide on how to even think about this much less what to do about it.

Forever
13th November 2011, 06:54 PM
Baroness,

The truth is something we as Christians can work with so thank you so much for your candid explanation of events.

Okay, now this would be my advice (if you wanted to hear it):

Remain right where you are as loving kind "room mates" until you see an opportunity to leave via God opening the door...(really,what else can you do?)...(note I did NOT say dump him...just tell him you are leaving and why it is Biblical if the opportunity presents itself).

Determine whether or not in your heart if it is right to marry this man due to his particular beliefs or if you even want to...ask God for His help in discerning His Will for this.

Dont ever bring up getting married to your fiance again. You dont even know for sure that you want to, given the "problem" he has, and he does not want the pressure or ultimatums coming from you...that has to be an inner conviction from his own heart.

If ( and this is a long shot...but never underestimate what the devil can produce once you make up your mind to resist him) your fiance suddenly presents you with an opportunity to have sex with him...sweetly tell him that you will take a "rain check" until after the wedding if there is going to be one. That will be pleasing to God and it is never too late to repent.

Hope you can receive the advice which is given in Christian love and concern. You have had a hard row.

Chamomile
13th November 2011, 07:50 PM
Hi

Yes. It's a difficult one.

I can almost put my money on that he's leading you on based on what you said in your recent post. He keeps promising a wedding "next month" then it turns into "next Spring" and then "next Summer" etc. Then it has to be another time again for various excuses e.g. not enough money and when he has money, he gives you another excuse for you to believe in and wedding simply never happens.

As you say, he won't be able to afford to rent a house alone if you had left and he knows you're not particularly happy about the situation but he keeps you hanging around suggesting a wedding on occasion whenever you complain. I'm fairly sure that he also knows that you won't be able to afford another place all on your own. Hence, the situation is in a constant stalemate.

It's just a hunch but my guess is that he's promising something he's not planning to deliver.

Baroness
13th November 2011, 09:42 PM
Yes! I can do that, Forever. I've been talking about it to God all morning and I thank you for your advice and I do accept it. I will do as you suggest and the time might come where he wants to have sex, he's come close, and I will tell him that I will wait until after the wedding, if there is going to be one. I also agree with you suggesting I don't mention marriage because I shouldn't have to force him to marry me.

If it isn't in his heart then why would I want to marry him? You are also right in me thinking about whether or not I should marry him and yes, the lack of intimacy in bed can be a reason but it isn't the main reason. I might could stay with him with little or no sex but what bothers me is that we are not on the same page in a lot of things. I am open and honest and would do anything for him and have an unselfish love.

He, on the other hand, seems selfish to me because he knows how I feel about us not having sex and he also knows how I feel about not being married. Besides that, we are very different. We never go anywhere and he will go to the bar upon occasion without me and doesn't care that I am not with him and I assure you it would be different if the situation were reversed.

But since I have committed my life to Christ I don't think I should be hanging out in bars anyway, in fact I know it, but that is his idea of going out together. Also, I am open and honest and he keeps things inside and is sometimes moody and sits there and doesn't talk for hours. Lets not forget the reason I have a problem with him, the lack of sex is only one example.

He is not a christian in the way that I am and I can't help but think there is a christian man out there who will go to church and believes in the bible the same way I do. I don't know for sure of course. The thought of leaving him kind of sends me into a panic because we've been together for so long but I have told God that whatever it takes; I want to be in his perfect will.

Chamomile also has a point. Even though he has brought up marriage to me three different times, he seems unwilling to set a date and gives me the same excuse. One year around christmas he said do you want an engagement right or to go to your mothers for christmas because I can't do both. Of course I said I wanted to go to my mothers.

Other than the times he brought up marraige,and all of them when he had had at least one beer, he does not mention it at all and just tells me to wait until our finances are better. My theory is that he's afraid of marriage since his first one went so badly but he should know by now that I'm not going to suddenly change once we're married.

I think he says he still wants to marry me because he's afraid of a confrontation if he is honest and says he doesn't. However; he would never admit he was afraid of marriage and I could be wrong on this because he is the one who keeps asking me when I'm not even talking about it. He also gives me excuses for him sleeping on the sofa and for not having sex.

Says he's tired or he snores or whatever, I'm not stupid enough to believe this because when he does sleep with me those problems don't seem to bother him in the least. He did sleep with me not long ago and just held me and nothing happened and months before we would be in bed together and he would say he loved me and then turn his back and go to sleep.

In other words, he's not interested in putting himself to any trouble on my account, to make me feel better and do I really want to marry a man like that? I would have a lifetime of the same kind of treatment unless what he's saying is true, and he's just tired or getting older or whatever. Our van is down now so he walks 3 miles every morning to go to the canyon and sometimes he gets a ride home. He walks that in one hour.

If he has the energy to walk 3 miles and then work up there and sometimes walk back, then he certainly has the energy to walk five steps into the bedroom. He says its because I'm on the computer but most nights I go to bed before him so that is just an excuse. I have to say neither one of my ex husbands ever made excuses for not sleeping with me and in a way its a slap in the face.

It isn't like I'm 300 pounds or something, I'm the same weight I was when we moved in there. I don't know the reasons behind this. I do know he does go to bed early and gets tired and sometimes takes a nap while watching tv but its clear I don't mean enough to him to make any kind of effort at all and its insulting that he thinks I actually buy these same excuses after all this time.

Now that I've said that I think that I shouldn't marry him. He has a kind heart and is decent but true love isn't like that. If the situation were reversed I would put myself out to sleep with him because I know it would mean a lot to him. You are also right in that he knows I have no money to support myself and so I am stuck here.

What I find is confusing is that sometimes he tells me he knows I'm going to eventually kick him to the curb when I get money and then at other times he will say that we are going to be together forever. Can you see how I might be confused? I'm beginning to think it doesn't matter to him if i'm here or not.

And yet the other day when I was helping my friend for most of the day and came home he said 'Honey, where have you been? I missed you!' I thought it odd because he's the one who drove me over there so why is he asking me where I've been? Man, this is a complex man and I know him better than anyone which isn't saying much, apparently.

I thank you for your input. Maybe I needed to get to this point, upset or not, to re evaluate my position in this relationship. To tell you the truth, even when I wasn't walking close to God, because of the way I was raised and my love for God, it always bothered me that we weren't married. In the beginning I could brush it aside, especially when he proposed, but now its a different story.

I think I haven't been told the truth about why he doesn't sleep with me. I know it isn't another woman because he only goes one other place, the canyon and I call there once in awhile and he is always there and then he comes home. I don't believe he would cheat on me because in his own sordid way he does love me.

And who would want a man who can't perform? I lived with it because I loved him but I will not put him before God anymore and that's basically what I've been doing even though I didn't think so at the time. God has been showing me some things about myself and others and you may think its crazy, but the other morning I anointed the walls of this place with oil and asked God to get rid of anything here that wasn't of him.

I'd been having nightmares and I included his m, if that is what he's doing but I haven't seen any signs of it, but that doesn't mean it isn't happening. Anyway, I pleaded the blood on this household and cast out anything unclean or evil from this house. I was raised penicostal and this is what I was taught long ago and since then I haven't been having horrible nightmares.

I feel like I am being pulled in two different directions concerning this. One, I have loved him deeply and in many ways we do get along, and two, this isn't working for me anymore. I'm tired of being unhappy and guessing what his true motives are all the time. Why can't he just be honest? I've seen him bend over backwards to help someone and yet he can't even try with me. He puts no effort into this relationship.

Anyway, I will take your suggestions and think carefully about this and keep praying and even ask God for a sign and wait for the time when I need to make this decision, when the door is open. I feel that God will be with me no matter what happens but somewhere along the way God became much more important to me than this man.

I believe he loves God but I also believe he is limiting him. In the long run this could all be a good thing because God sees what's going to happen and sometimes when we're in the valley of despair we can't think beyond our own misery, but I trust God with my whole heart and I want to do what pleases him.

Baroness
13th November 2011, 10:05 PM
Yes! I can do that, Forever. I've been talking about it to God all morning and I thank you for your advice and I do accept it. I will do as you suggest and the time might come where he wants to have sex, he's come close, and I will tell him that I will wait until after the wedding, if there is going to be one. I also agree with you suggesting I don't mention marriage because I shouldn't have to force him to marry me.

If it isn't in his heart then why would I want to marry him? You are also right in me thinking about whether or not I should marry him and yes, the lack of intimacy in bed can be a reason but it isn't the main reason. I might could stay with him with little or no sex but what bothers me is that we are not on the same page in a lot of things. I am open and honest and would do anything for him and have an unselfish love.

He, on the other hand, seems selfish to me because he knows how I feel about us not having sex and he also knows how I feel about not being married. Besides that, we are very different. We never go anywhere and he will go to the bar upon occasion without me and doesn't care that I am not with him and I assure you it would be different if the situation were reversed.

But since I have committed my life to Christ I don't think I should be hanging out in bars anyway, in fact I know it, but that is his idea of going out together. Also, I am open and honest and he keeps things inside and is sometimes moody and sits there and doesn't talk for hours. Lets not forget the reason I have a problem with him, the lack of sex is only one example.

He is not a christian in the way that I am and I can't help but think there is a christian man out there who will go to church and believes in the bible the same way I do. I don't know for sure of course. The thought of leaving him kind of sends me into a panic because we've been together for so long but I have told God that whatever it takes; I want to be in his perfect will.

Chamomile also has a point. Even though he has brought up marriage to me three different times, he seems unwilling to set a date and gives me the same excuse. One year around christmas he said do you want an engagement right or to go to your mothers for christmas because I can't do both. Of course I said I wanted to go to my mothers.

Other than the times he brought up marraige,and all of them when he had had at least one beer, he does not mention it at all and just tells me to wait until our finances are better. My theory is that he's afraid of marriage since his first one went so badly but he should know by now that I'm not going to suddenly change once we're married.

I think he says he still wants to marry me because he's afraid of a confrontation if he is honest and says he doesn't. However; he would never admit he was afraid of marriage and I could be wrong on this because he is the one who keeps asking me when I'm not even talking about it. He also gives me excuses for him sleeping on the sofa and for not having sex.

Says he's tired or he snores or whatever, I'm not stupid enough to believe this because when he does sleep with me those problems don't seem to bother him in the least. He did sleep with me not long ago and just held me and nothing happened and months before we would be in bed together and he would say he loved me and then turn his back and go to sleep.

In other words, he's not interested in putting himself to any trouble on my account, to make me feel better and do I really want to marry a man like that? I would have a lifetime of the same kind of treatment unless what he's saying is true, and he's just tired or getting older or whatever. Our van is down now so he walks 3 miles every morning to go to the canyon and sometimes he gets a ride home. He walks that in one hour.

If he has the energy to walk 3 miles and then work up there and sometimes walk back, then he certainly has the energy to walk five steps into the bedroom. He says its because I'm on the computer but most nights I go to bed before him so that is just an excuse. I have to say neither one of my ex husbands ever made excuses for not sleeping with me and in a way its a slap in the face.

It isn't like I'm 300 pounds or something, I'm the same weight I was when we moved in there. I don't know the reasons behind this. I do know he does go to bed early and gets tired and sometimes takes a nap while watching tv but its clear I don't mean enough to him to make any kind of effort at all and its insulting that he thinks I actually buy these same excuses after all this time.

Now that I've said that I think that I shouldn't marry him. He has a kind heart and is decent but true love isn't like that. If the situation were reversed I would put myself out to sleep with him because I know it would mean a lot to him. You are also right in that he knows I have no money to support myself and so I am stuck here.

What I find is confusing is that sometimes he tells me he knows I'm going to eventually kick him to the curb when I get money and then at other times he will say that we are going to be together forever. Can you see how I might be confused? I'm beginning to think it doesn't matter to him if i'm here or not.

And yet the other day when I was helping my friend for most of the day and came home he said 'Honey, where have you been? I missed you!' I thought it odd because he's the one who drove me over there so why is he asking me where I've been? Man, this is a complex man and I know him better than anyone which isn't saying much, apparently.

I thank you for your input. Maybe I needed to get to this point, upset or not, to re evaluate my position in this relationship. To tell you the truth, even when I wasn't walking close to God, because of the way I was raised and my love for God, it always bothered me that we weren't married. In the beginning I could brush it aside, especially when he proposed, but now its a different story.

I think I haven't been told the truth about why he doesn't sleep with me. I know it isn't another woman because he only goes one other place, the canyon and I call there once in awhile and he is always there and then he comes home. I don't believe he would cheat on me because in his own sordid way he does love me.

And who would want a man who can't perform? I lived with it because I loved him but I will not put him before God anymore and that's basically what I've been doing even though I didn't think so at the time. God has been showing me some things about myself and others and you may think its crazy, but the other morning I anointed the walls of this place with oil and asked God to get rid of anything here that wasn't of him.

I'd been having nightmares and I included his m, if that is what he's doing but I haven't seen any signs of it, but that doesn't mean it isn't happening. Anyway, I pleaded the blood on this household and cast out anything unclean or evil from this house. I was raised penicostal and this is what I was taught long ago and since then I haven't been having horrible nightmares.

I feel like I am being pulled in two different directions concerning this. One, I have loved him deeply and in many ways we do get along, and two, this isn't working for me anymore. I'm tired of being unhappy and guessing what his true motives are all the time. Why can't he just be honest? I've seen him bend over backwards to help someone and yet he can't even try with me. He puts no effort into this relationship.

Anyway, I will take your suggestions and think carefully about this and keep praying and even ask God for a sign and wait for the time when I need to make this decision, when the door is open. I feel that God will be with me no matter what happens but somewhere along the way God became much more important to me than this man.

I believe he loves God but I also believe he is limiting him. In the long run this could all be a good thing because God sees what's going to happen and sometimes when we're in the valley of despair we can't think beyond our own misery, but I trust God with my whole heart and I want to do what pleases him.

Forever
13th November 2011, 10:14 PM
Hi Baroness,

I would like to clarify one of the points I made. Please, please, please do not sit Gabby down and announce to him that if the door opens that you are leaving. That alone will put pressure on him, and pressure is NOT what you have wanted to do to him...you wanted him to act on his promise to you on his own accord....and honestly, what would you be wanting to do at THIS point even if he did finally give you a ring and started making arrangements? Would you marry him?

If or when the time comes, you could simply tell him that you are now following Christ and want to repent of jumping the gun with having sex and moving in together during a period in your life when your walk was far away from God.

Just wait on that one and see what God puts together for you and see what He wants you to do. You two can be room mates "w/o privledges" for the time being given that you have now commited not to sin against God while being there....that is what God would have you do now...the rest remains to be seen as doors open. Has it ever occured to you that it was God that took away the sexual "opportunities" because He wanted to get your attention and get you following Him again? He is a jealous God and wants us to love and respect Him above our own desires.

You have alot to think about regarding the kind of man Gabby is and whether or not you could have committed the remainder of your life to him exactly as he is now.... I think it fair to say that if he is a true believer, then he wont necessarily be able to see everything as you do (that is why there are over 350 different denominations). We are saved by Faith in Christ, but that does not always mean we can agree perfectly. His life has settled down (improved) considerably since being with you, but you are both at an impass. Truth be told, Gabby, if he really wanted to have married you by now...would have secured a paying job...even a part time one....and yes, even at his age he is healthy and could have bagged one and paid for a sweet wedding. But why bother if he already had you there doing everything he wanted....

No, I do not think you are crazy about annointing your home...years ago, I had to have the Pastor and Deacons come to my house and do that very thing because there WAS something evil there (lots of undeniable evidence). I was too scared to do it myself. It is a long story, but when they left it was as if someone had scrubbed the whole house inside and out and even the air was pure and clean feeling. There was one particular room under the house that I was terrified to go into...after the Pastor left, I went in it and it felt safe and clean.

Hugs,
Forever

chosen
13th November 2011, 11:02 PM
I think that you need to ask God to make it clear what he wants you to do.Pray and wait on him, because you know that He doesnt want you living with a man outside marriage.

Sometimes one spouse saying that they will marry you when they have enough money is an excuse. You dont need a lot of money to marry, we didnt spend much at all. You have both been married before, so dont need all the trimmings. The main thing for us was our married life together after the wedding, and not the wedding itself. We just had our 5 children and very close family and a small number of very close friends. 20 in all.(All my husbands family are in Australia anyway). My brother took the photos. We didnt have an expensive reception, just a nice meal together and it was great, so relaxed and informal and enjoyable. No stress, little expense, just happy memories.

I do think that the two of you need to seriously talk about this subject. As I said with my relative, her man refused to marry her, and so she knew she had to leave. She felt convicted not to stay with him any longer.The trouble is that when you have been living together for some times the need/urgency to marry just isnt there, unless you are a believer, beause to him, nothing will really change so whats the point? If you enable him to understand how very important it is for you to get married rather then live with him, then the ball is in his court.

Let God guide you and lead you the right way.I know you will.

Forever
13th November 2011, 11:08 PM
Hi Chosen,
The problem is that Baroness is not yet in the position to leave. She will have to wait on God for that opportunity....she has no employment, is not physically well, has no family or friends that she can stay with, and you cant get a place to live without proving a qualifying amount of income. God is practical as well as merciful.

I think He would not be offended if she is committed to remain pure while being there....and putting pressure on Gabby should be God's doing at this point...then Baroness will have peace that this is what he wants too.

Baroness
14th November 2011, 01:22 AM
I agree, Forever, and I wasn't going to tell him I would be leaving if the door opened. I'm not going to say anything. He was so nice to me today, telling me dinner was great and now he wants to watch a show together. Anyway, I was just going to wait and see what God reveals to me. Gabby would be very upset if I told him I would be leaving him eventually.

It is not the time to talk to him anyway, he has his mind on the van and paying the cable tomorrow. If I decide to leave him then it would be when I find out about my disability or God opened some other door. And just to clarify, I have not been going around bringing up marriage to him all the time. I talked to him twice and both times he brought it up. I don't nag him about marrying me, that's not my style and I don't even mention it for a long time and neither does he.

I see him smile at me today and wonder how I will ever leave. It will truly crush him and he won't be expecting it although at times I think he is. If he were worried so much about it then why wouldn't he try to please me and do the right thing? It did occur to me that he might be abstaining from sex because God was dealing with him about it but I kind of doubt it. Its in God's hands now.

chosen
14th November 2011, 01:45 PM
Hi Chosen,
The problem is that Baroness is not yet in the position to leave. She will have to wait on God for that opportunity....she has no employment, is not physically well, has no family or friends that she can stay with, and you cant get a place to live without proving a qualifying amount of income. God is practical as well as merciful.

I think He would not be offended if she is committed to remain pure while being there....and putting pressure on Gabby should be God's doing at this point...then Baroness will have peace that this is what he wants too.
The lady I know has had to move in with her dad and step mum for a while until she is in a position to get somewhere of her own. Baroness has a lovely mum that she could live with if she takes that road, but surely getting married asap is the best choice.

chosen
14th November 2011, 01:48 PM
I agree, Forever, and I wasn't going to tell him I would be leaving if the door opened. I'm not going to say anything. He was so nice to me today, telling me dinner was great and now he wants to watch a show together. Anyway, I was just going to wait and see what God reveals to me. Gabby would be very upset if I told him I would be leaving him eventually.

It is not the time to talk to him anyway, he has his mind on the van and paying the cable tomorrow. If I decide to leave him then it would be when I find out about my disability or God opened some other door. And just to clarify, I have not been going around bringing up marriage to him all the time. I talked to him twice and both times he brought it up. I don't nag him about marrying me, that's not my style and I don't even mention it for a long time and neither does he.

I see him smile at me today and wonder how I will ever leave. It will truly crush him and he won't be expecting it although at times I think he is. If he were worried so much about it then why wouldn't he try to please me and do the right thing? It did occur to me that he might be abstaining from sex because God was dealing with him about it but I kind of doubt it. Its in God's hands now.
I think that telling him how important it has become for you to be married isnt nagging, its being honest. How will he know that your views on this have changed unless you tell him?

Baroness
14th November 2011, 04:51 PM
But I have already told him, and recently. He just came in and told me that he just can't do this anymore, paying the bills. He said he doesn't mean to vent at me but he's frustrated and he just can't do this. I don't know what he expects me to do. He says by the time he pays the rent and the cable he has no money to fix the van and he's very upset and frustrated.

He knew how much the cable was and he's saying he has to put his banjo in hock to get the rest of the cable bill. I have told him many times that the cable is so high because of all the movie channels he insists on having. Maybe he shouldn't have spent the money at the bar earlier this month. I don't know what to say to him anymore. Things happen. He just gave me a hundred dollars but that isn't enough.

I don't understand him. If he knew all this, when we got a break on smogging the van, why did he go to the stupid bar and spend money? Now he's in there watching tv and I have to pay this bill today or tomorrow at the very latest. I already pay the electric. I have to be very careful now on what I say to him because it seems as if he's about to blow a fuse.

I don't know what to do or say anymore. I realize this is frustrating for him and it makes me feel bad because I can't help him. I already pay for the groceries. Maybe I should just take the movie channels off. He only watches them once in awhile anyway. He's keeping everything inside instead of giving it to God and trusting him.

He always sees the glass empty, not even half empty and how do you deal with someone like that? I know its hard with the van being down. All I can do is pray and trust God to help me deal with him and this situation.

Baroness
14th November 2011, 06:17 PM
Sorry about ending my last entry so abruptly. I went and told him I didn't know what to say but that I was sorry things were happening like this. He seemed a little calmer so in a calm voice I said the best thing to do is to get rid of the movie channel and then when things are better we can get them back.

I also offered to get rid of my dvr which is through cable and that is twenty a month and tapes movies that I can't watch cause he's in there watching something else and this is really a sacrifice for me but I felt it necessary. He agreed and it is already done; this will save about thirty or more a month. Usually when he comes in all frustrated like that I snap at him because he's taking it out on me but I was very calm.

When trouble happens in relationships it very easy to start an argument and for some reason I was just calm and handled it in a calm manner. Poor guy has to go hock his banjo. He's done it before when things got slim but now he has to either walk to the pawn shop or take a bus. I feel bad that he's so frustrated but he really shouldn't have been spending money at the bar.

Of course at that time he didn't know the van was going to go out but it was still a waste of money. He doesn't deal with sudden problems too well but today was an improvement over how he usually would act. He must have meditated this morning. Anyway, its a day to day process and I talked to God this morning and all I can do is trust in him.

Chamomile
14th November 2011, 06:53 PM
But I have already told him, and recently. He just came in and told me that he just can't do this anymore, paying the bills. He said he doesn't mean to vent at me but he's frustrated and he just can't do this. I don't know what he expects me to do.


I have to be very careful now on what I say to him because it seems as if he's about to blow a fuse.


He always sees the glass empty, not even half empty and how do you deal with someone like that?

Hi

Yes.

I often get the impression that your guy is begrudgingly continuing this relationship almost as if he's doing you some huge favour. You have been together over 7-9 years (?), not that I remember it correctly. Perhaps you are in a relationship which has seen better days?

He sounds like he doesn't particularly want this relationship to continue, does he? He seems to be "married" to his TV & canceling Cable probably, won't go down very well, I should think. Does he want to downsize and move somewhere smaller for himself alone? I wonder if that's what he means by "he can't do this anymore" but he's unable to tell you precisely what it is he cannot continue?

Plus, you don't have any physical intimacy at all with him anymore and you are virtually two roommates or brother and sister living under the same roof and it's not like two people loving each other as a couple and that may something to do with his statement of "he cannot do this anymore"? You have been living together so many years and it is probably a difficult situation for him as well.

Baroness
15th November 2011, 03:05 AM
No, that isn't what he meant. He meant he can't continue to pay everything out and not get enough in when something happens. There is nothing begrudging about his attitude in this relationship. In fact, he's mentioned several times that he's afraid I'm going to leave him or that I will leave him. If I am gone too long he gets worried and when I come home he says he's been worried about me and he missed me.

There is still some affection between us, we kiss sometimes and hug, there is just no actual sex. He's told me that if he didn't love me he wouldn't be here. He's just really frustrated about finances and its no picnic for me either but he asked me to check out some things for him on line regarding the van and so that's what I've been doing. He isn't thinking about anything but fixing that car.

He agreed to drop some things off cable and so we have and now it will be a little better but rather hard for me because what I gave up I use on a day to day basis to tape things while he's watching his reruns. Sometimes it is like we are roommates and I don't feel any differently after yesterday's thread and my decision to wait for an open door.

Its really what I was doing anyway. I thought it would be hard knowing I might be leaving him but it hasn't made any difference in anything around here because we're usually in separate rooms for most of the time anyway. I have been spending some time in there watching football and other things but he's on one end of the sofa and i'm on the other.

I think he's afraid that I will find someone else, by the comments he makes when i'm on the computer sometimes, and yet he does nothing to make me feel loved and needed. He's polite enough but if we split tomorrow he would go back to hanging out in the bars. Maybe I'm wrong but I doubt it. We are two people right now just dealing with a crisis in our life and it will be better eventually.

I am certainly more affectionate than he is and no one could call me clingy by any standards but I'm certainly more loving than he is. Of course he has put his arms around me and kissed me but what is that? My mother could do that. To tell you the truth, I'm confused by him. I know he loves me and yet he makes no move towards intimacy.

Of course I am no longer asking God to deal with him about making love to me because we aren't married and that's the only change. I don't have to worry about refusing him in that way, I don't think, so you are right in that we are roommates, but we still love each other. He says all the time that we are going to be together.

I hate to burst his bubble on that score but I am still waiting for God's direction. I don't want to hurt him and I don't want to desert him and have him lose this place but I can't just go on living with a man who i'm not married to and who doesn't seem to want sex at all. Even when he's come to bed he either just goes to sleep or holds me tightly and goes to sleep.

I think we are going through a rough patch right now and its been rather hard for quite awhile now and he hasn't helped with his lack of interest either. On some level we are the best of friends, we know each other and are very kind to each other. However; I don't think that he really knows me. He has never asked about my past but of course it has come up from time to time but he says things sometimes and I know that he doesn't really know me at all. He knows little things, like I keep a clean house and I am creative and I am honest with him and that I write novels and he always supports me in that.

I would miss him if I didn't see him all the time. I used to have a way with men where I would find a way to make them open up to me and tell me how they felt. It is just a way of speaking to a man where he doesn't feel pressured and so I would get the answers I was looking for. Not with this one. I know how to talk to him so that he will accept what I'm saying but I don't know how to get him to be more romantic and he won't tell me the truth about why he sleeps out there.

Maybe he's afraid I'm going to attack him in the night or something and I would never do that. And maybe he just spent too much of his life in bars and doesn't know how to deal with life outside of them. A couple of my friends think that is the case. Who knows? I used to read people pretty well but he's so closed up that I have no idea what he's thinking. I only know that he does love me and we still have very special moments but there are certain things that are not allowed to talk about and that is the sex issue and apparently the marriage issue. I don't think he's been honest with me about either one of them.

I have made my wishes known in both things and if he chooses to not care how I feel then there is nothing I can do about it. I'm not going to humiliate myself by asking him about marriage again or why he doesn't want sex. Now I have to concentrate on living the way God wants me to and you may be right; we may have already lived our best days together and from here on it might just be down hill.
I'm trying not to dwell on it too much because this is the way it is and has been for awhile. I know he feels bad that we had to drop some things from the cable and he feels bad about not being able to support us in a better way.

I just tell him everything will be all right and make light of the things I've had to give up, not just the cable situation, but even the sex thing. I don't pressure him in that area and whenever I've spoken to him about it I've done it in a nice way and even in a light manner but still got my point across. I've never had a man act this way while with me but its clear I'm not going to get the answers I seek. Maybe he was just so damaged by the things in his past that I never had a chance to begin with.

beenthere
15th November 2011, 10:19 AM
okay, if you are a christian the bible say you are not to withhold sex from your spouse only in agreement when you are fasting, for a certain amount of time and afterwards you make sure you come together to avoid temptation. So, as christian holding out from your spouse is against the bible. If you are holding out for years, there has to be a deeper issue. that is not normal and it has only become normal because that is what has been accepted. You have to find out why your husband do not want to talk about it and why he is not interested in sex. Try talking about it and finding out what is his fantasy and playing it out.

Raymond
15th November 2011, 06:59 PM
Wow all this has happened so fast. I thought you was married as well Baroness. Also one subconsciously takes in "Husband Doesn't want Sex" and would see that as your married position.

That does change things but you did say that you have changed and now you find yourself in this position. Sex is not an issue for the moment obviously and maybe the full blessing wasn't there on the union because things were not right.

I think the choices are get married or end the common law marriage. He has to realise it's one or the other. This will be a test for the relationship. From your writings he seems to be the one offering marriage so he cannot be such a long way from that. It would help his security as well I would think. I don't know what you would think about that but if you needed a door out as you have been contemplating this is it. You obviously have a lot to decide and need our prayers which I am sure you have.

Baroness
16th November 2011, 01:34 AM
Beenthere, I am engaged to him, not married, just a common law marriage and I have talked to him and it has been established that he either has erectile disfunction or low sex drive and it took many posts to figure that out. Sex is no longer the issue because we aren't having it and we won't be because we are not married and even if he, by some miracle, wants it now I have to refuse until we are married, but it is highly unlikely that we will get married because we've been engaged for five years.

Raymond, I told my mother about how things are and asked her to pray for me and she agrees that I can't remain living with him if he doesn't want to get married. She said I have always treated him really well and he isn't doing right by me. She really thought we would get married and we've been praying about it but to be married to a man who lies about his reasons for not being with me? Is this a christian?

I found out he has been keeping other things from me, financial things in the past and he doesn't think of it as lying if he doesn't say anything. I am not allowed to ask any details about the money his attorney sends him and he says it has nothing to do with me, which hurt me very much since I thought we were a couple at least. I give and give and am patient and do for him, wait on him and he puts forth no effort at all.

I don't want to go on and on about this but I believe that when I get disability or social security or a job then I will move out. Before I do I will tell him that its clear he doesn't want to marry me and its also clear he doesn't want to sleep with me and he also doesn't see the Bible as I do. He will never go to church with me and I want a husband who will serve the Lord with me.

Even if he did say he wanted to marry me, which he does, I don't think I can marry him. Its clear we have nothing in common and he is selfish and in a way using me. I have no desire to hurt him however and he will be surprised but i've talked to him about marriage several times and I always get the same excuses, just like I get excuses why he doesn't sleep with me. So he's lying again and keeping everything inside and he won't admit to me the real reason, whether its low sex drive or whatever.

He thinks I will stay with him because I have no income or a place to go but God will provide for me, I am a very capable woman and will continue to try and find a part time job. I sold one of my vintage hats! I did a list of the positive and negative aspects of being with him and there were ten more negative than positive.

I don't want to hurt him and if I leave I will miss him very much because we've been together for a lot of years but I can't keep going on like this with a man who is bothered by polite conversation from me, much less lengthy conversation. We have never got out to dinner since we've moved here, 4 years ago and we don't do anything else. He doesn't tell me when I look nice or say much of anything when I make a nice dinner.

The van is down so I will have to spend christmas here and it is going to be so boring. Long ago I spent christmas with just him and he just sat there watching tv. He doesn't buy me christmas presents and have them wrapped. He just hands me something before christmas and so I will have nothing under the tree from him. We usually go to my moms where my brother and son and grandson come over and have a nice time.

Its things like this that matter to a woman. Why can't I have christmas with a man who buys me a present and makes the holiday nice instead of treating it like every other day? Why can't I have a husband who appreciates me and pays attention to me instead of acting like I'm bothering him. I ask him if he liked dinner and he said it was ok. I made a stew in the crockpot and it was great.

Somehow, since the threads with forever and chosen and chamomile I have felt like this relationship is all over. I was upset at forever at first but then realized that they were right. I am still praying about it and my mother asked God to give me direction on what to do. But I kind of feel like a heavy burden has been lifted when I think I might be free of all this negative energy.

I have treated him very well and he puts no effort into this relationship. If I do wind up leaving it will be his fault. I've given him every opportunity to be truthful with me and I have always felt like he's keeping things from me. Once someone keeps something from you and you find out later, you then are always wondering what else he's keeping from you.

I won't be having such long entries about this anymore. I've said everything I can think to say about it and talking about it isn't helping. I will keep posting however to let everyone know how I'm doing. You have all been a great help to me and hopefully, one day, I really will be married!!!

Forever
16th November 2011, 03:14 AM
Please keep us posted Baroness! Perhaps your brother will move out of your mom's house and you will be able to move in...

Blessings to you,
Forever

Baroness
16th November 2011, 11:25 PM
I did think about me and my brother getting a place together since we are close and are kind of in the same predicument and are alot alike in personality. I just called my ex husband who is dying of cancer. I hardly recognized his voice, he sounded like he was 80 and he's my age. My mom gave me his number. His mother told her that he always loved me and never married anyone else and if I wanted him back he would have done it.

This is the first man I ever slept with on our honeymoon and I found out that he was taking drugs. I met him in church and I was so naive at that time I didn't know anything about it. When my newborn son was in jeapordy from him I moved out right away. It is very sad. What do you say to someone who knows he won't be getting out of a hospice and is just waiting to die? He has 3 months to live at the most.

I just told him i'd been thinking about him and would pray for him. He is not a christian but I felt it was the right thing to do. I never held any grudges against him and we have talked before and been friendly enough, he just had a problem so we were only married for 2 years, I had a baby to think about. That baby is now 35 and he went to Florida to see his father who never reached out to him, but it was a decent thing for him to do.

I am very proud of my son, his job is in the scientific field. He never wanted me to marry gabby cause he said we were too different. I guess I should have listened. However; things are going as well as expected here. We are on friendly terms and he seems to be reaching out to me, trying to draw me into conversation.

I see no reason to be unfriendly or anything. God still could move in this relationship but I am just trusting in God and waiting for direction. In the meantime I will still be nice and considerate, like I have always been. Reading the bible and praying this morning helped. As long as I stay close to God I can handle this and any other thing that comes along. I would prefer that we work out our differences but I just think he isn't interested in marrying me and I don't know why he keeps asking.

At this point I am leaving it all to God because I can't figure it out anyway and so I will just trust in him.

beenthere
17th November 2011, 09:28 AM
Baroness,
I did not realize you two were not married. All I can say if things are like this now you know in your heart marrying him will not change the situation. It makes things worst most of the time. You deserve better and by being in a relationship with him you could be missing out on the man/husband that God has for you. Yes, we as women never want to hurt the man and especially when we have invested so much time, but it seems that you have a Christian background and you know it will never work. First of all we are not to be unequally yolked and like I said if its not working now, It is hard to believe it will work as a marriage. You seem to have a good head on your shoulder and you seem to know the Lord. Remember, what God has for you is for you, however I think that sometimes we can prolong things by giving in to our flesh. Yes, God can still move in your relationship, and He has probably given you the direction to go. God wants whats best for his children and if your bad out weighed your good, is this the best? Don't ignore the signs. Pray for strength to do what you know you should do.

beenthere
17th November 2011, 10:24 AM
Barones,
I hear what you are saying, but I understand what Chosen was saying. i too thought you were married and the problem with most of us Christians is that we find scriptures that will justify our situation we are in. Yes, you may love this man, but, all those that know the God of the bible knows that God works out His perfect will. God is against shacking up and that is not His plan for us no matter how we try to twist His word. It is a big difference from being married to a man and not being married. A marriage is honored by God and you are not to just give up on a marriage. You work alot harder to keep that union together and there are many direction in the bible to do so. There are not any directions in the bible to keep an unmarried couple together. So, it is what it is, dont be frustrated with Chosen, Sin is sin and it is your life but just make sure you are being true to yourself and God since you have brought God into this. Have you thought about maybe your relationship is so hard because it is not of God and you are living in sin. Whether you had sex before and you said it was not dirty and he asked you to marry you, it was still a sin. So, I agree with chosen, you have to build your foundation on the word so it would be wise to move out and if He is the one for you then moving out will not stop that. But it is important to build your foundation on God word, because marriage will already have it ups and downs and if your foundation is shaky and starting off against the word of God, dont expect nothing different if were to marry him. And this is not judging, the word of God has done that by itself. Oh and in my opinion I would rather go through a bunch of bull for my husband rather than someone that will not make me his wife. Good luck

beenthere
17th November 2011, 12:07 PM
Okay, i am confused, one minute Barones is told she is living in sin(which she is) then after her explanation she is told, just hang in there and live as roommates. Barones, i understand you love this man but your relationship with Christ should be the focus. Regardless of what your reasons are, and you being a child of God is going to have to trust God. Sometimes I think we pray and pray and ask God what to do when in all actuality, shacking up has nothing to do with Him. God is not the author of confusion the devil is. How can you be a roommate now with this man that you have deep feelings with and history with. That is a trick of the enemy to make you believe that can happen. Praying and asking God what to do, you already know what to do. His word tell you what to do, TRUST HIM. You having no place to go, no money and so on is not a reason to continue in sin. God wants you to step out on faith. You can pray and continue to pray, but we have a part to do also. God cant help us if we dont help ourselves. I am not saying it is easy by any means, but what your prayer should be is God give me to trust you and show me how to trust you. Believe you me, if you are sincere and really want to do the right thing, God will meet you where you are and he will not let you fail. Will it be easy, maybe not, but he will not fail and the good thing about it is you will be out of that sinful situation so you can reap his blessings. So, I thank you for your postings, because it has shown me that yes, prayer changes things, but I can not please God witouth faith and faith without works is dead, so therefore I have a part to do, and you do also. You have prayed, now step out on faith. And also, you should not have to beg a man to marry you, the bible said He that findeth a wife findeth a good thing, and you are a good thing and your man is just not the one (at this time). Barones, this love thing is something else, but you getting your life back on track with Christ is even better and God will reward you. Lest not make excuses for the lack of trust we have in God. Your Father (God) is rich and own the cattle on a thousand hilsl. He will not spoil his record on you. Meaning He cant fail and he will not start with you. So, if you really want God to bless you, you have to remove yourself from the sinful situation. A dope addict cant keep saying lord help me and continuing to light the pipe and hanging out at the dope house, he/she has to remove themselves from the situation. I hope all work out and Gob bless.

Forever
17th November 2011, 03:04 PM
Beenthere,

Baroness has no job, is suffering from a back problem, has no friends or family that she can live with at the moment, and cant rent a place without qualifying financially for it...which she has no money to do, and no running vehicle.

So it is easy for us to just tell her to walk out of that situation in faith, but realize that maybe God does not want her to just sleep on the dirt under some tree somewhere.

They have not had sex for a year now, and Baroness has committed not to do so if he does approach her. They do not even sleep in the same bed. So "room mates" is what they are going to have to be for the time being until God provides an "open door" for her to leave otherwise.

Chamomile
17th November 2011, 03:12 PM
Hi

I agree, Forever.. There's a saying "Don't beat a dead horse".

B has enough trouble already. Persecuting someone by bringing up a moral standard isn't going to help her already difficult situation.

Raymond
17th November 2011, 07:49 PM
Nevertheless we are hoping that the opportunity to move out will come rather than just walking out with no arrangements.

The main question I would think you would be struggling with Baroness is do you want to marry this man or not. If you don't there is more urgency to depart I would have thought. I believe you will find that God will honour your faith in this. I know it is very difficult for you.

beenthere
18th November 2011, 12:13 AM
Forever,
We really dont know the whole story and the God of the bible do want us to trust Him and walk out on faith. If the God you serve will leave you laying in the dirt then, I dont know what to say. But, as a woman with deep feelings, it would be hard to not give in to temptation and Baroness know that is true. i am not persecuting her, every ones post that I have read have spoke about the Lord, the bible. So, I was taught the bible stands alone, we can say what God would not like and so on, but the truth is no matter how we fix it god is against sin and He always give us an escape. There are many programs and so forth that can help. i am just saying to Barones, and yes it is hard, but if you are truly sincere in your heart and do not want to continue to live in sin, God will promise. Why i say that, because I had a situation that it looked as if there was nothing that can be done and I was told nothing can be done, well when I started praising God for what I knew He could do, and a door was open. So when it looks like you are at your end and dont have anyone else, always remember God will always give you an escape (if you are sincere) I believe Forever once you found out she was not married you told her to move also. So lets just be careful on these forums. For one, its not about us but trying to give good advise to a woman who is in a bad situation and has now given herself to Christ. We should encourage her to trust God, and try to make moves (her mom, friends, church family) something. Encouraging someone to stay in sin is not something my Christianity will allow me to do. I know I serve an awesome God and He has always delivered for me especially when in bad situations. SO Boraness, was it easy, no, but because of God I got the victory and you can to. I say talk to your pastor and I can guarantee that no matter what they will not encourage you to stay in sin and anyone who does is against the word. You are either for God or against God. We are not perfect but when we know we are living in sin it is up to us to change the situation. And Baroness, have a plan and ask God to direct you where to go for resources. You can do, My sister did when she was in a state with no family and friends and you can to. I'm praying for you.

Forever
18th November 2011, 02:22 AM
Beenthere,

Some of us have been through the whole story with Baroness from the beginning.

She expressly said she cannot go to her mom's and there is no one else she can move in with at the moment. She will either have to pack a bag and hit the streets or wait on God for an open door (which is what I suggested). Meanwhile she has repented and is not going to be living in fornication.

If she moved in with her brother, that would not be considered sin...because no one would assume that they would be having sex, and if she stayed with Gabby that is not "continuing" the sexual sin...she was already living there years before coming to this forum... and there are practical necessities that have to happen first before she can leave at this point. It was the sexual component that made the sin...not so much the living arrangement ...although that should have never happened, but it did...The Scriptures tell us to avoid even the appearance of evil, but it is too late to do anything about that now. So she is not "staying in sin"...she is just staying "in the apartment" for now until she can find a way to get out. She will just have to handle the temptation if it presents itself like any of us would have to.


I'd prefer to address Baroness rather than yourself from here on out on this particular thread if you dont mind. Sometimes it is best to keep comments directly to the original poster to avoid contention. The OP can decide for themselves what is the right thing to do...the rest of us just give our advice or personal opinion.

Baroness
18th November 2011, 02:29 AM
First of all, beenthere, since you haven't been posting on this thread for too long I will fill you in with a few things. I got the feeling from your post that you thought I just came to God and I have actually been a christian since I was ten years old, but strayed and in that period I met my fiance and moved in with him.I know about all of the scripture you quoted and in fact, am a ministers daughter, although my father is dead now.

I came on this post because he started sleeping on the sofa and we stopped having sex and this was close to 2 years ago. On this thread I got advice and in the process came back to God full force even though I had been praying but I gave over my whole life to God and started thinking differently, as it should be. I am not upset with Forever in the least because while she was very direct I thought about it and realized she was right and so was Chosen, Chamomile, and Raymond.

I know about how God wants us to be and I know that living with a man, even though I love him is wrong and a sin, I have no problem in admitting that and yet it was my understanding that we were going to get married and so we moved in. If I had been close to God then I wouldn't have moved in with him without being married. The people on here helped me very much because I was getting pretty frustrated and desperate before I came on here.

I believe God led me to this website and I didn't know everyone was a christian but when I found out all I wanted to do was to hear from christian women going through the same problem. However, and its my fault entirely, they were giving me advice as a married woman. I feel married but of course I am not so I find myself in this predicament. Yes, I still love him and the sex thing was a big issue for me and I can't believe I asked God to fix it when it would mean sinning. How stupid was that?

This has all just occurred to me when I told everyone I wasn't married, just a common law marriage which really has nothing to do with the bible. I used to have a healing ministry when I was young but a series of events caused me to grow impatient and go out and do my own thing. Now I am close to God again and getting closer every day and I am now taking a look at my life.

I have asked God for direction but to just pack a bag, leave everything here, and walk out the door in hopes of having a place to stay tonight is not going to happen. First of all, its important for me to stay in God's will. That would be a foolish thing to do because even though I trust God to take care of me, he also wants me to wait until he opens the door, if he opens the door. He also expects me to use a little wisdom.

We are not sleeping together and so we are not sinning and God knows that I have no means to leave right now and the last thing I need to do is be hasty and not wait for God to show me what to do.I must wait on the lord for an answer. Its true that I have osteoarthritis and my back hurts and I have no means of support at this time. I am not going to go to some shelter like a homeless person.

How can that be of God? I am not sinning, he sleeps on the sofa every night and its been over a year since we had sex and this was the basis of me coming on here. Now I realize that God couldn't answer my prayer about fixing his problem. He has asked me to marry him about 3 times and he says we don't have the money to do so and he's right because right now we can hardly pay the bills.

I sometimes think he doesn't want to get married but I've given him every out and he always says he does. He was a catholic so he doesn't believe as I do. He meditates and that's it and if it bothers him that we aren't married, its news to me. He said we'd be together forever and part of me does believe he wants to marry me but for him there is no urgency while for me there is.

Raymond and others asked me if I even want to marry a man who doesn't have sex with me and doesn't believe like I do. The answer is not really, but if God wants us to be married and stay together then he would give me the grace to accept this and perhaps we would have a normal life as a married couple. I don't know. Part of me wants to stay with him because I still care for him and I don't really want anyone else.

The other part of me is afraid that as long as I remain here God can't show me another life that he has planned for me, another man who is a true christian and more like me and does want to be with me in every way. His hands are tied as long as I'm here. It all amounts to me wanting whatever God wants for me because that is his perfect will and I don't want to be in his permissive will or out of his will. I have given my life over to him and I am a strong person and determined.

If I say on here that no matter what, if he suddenly got down on his knees and set a wedding date and wanted to sleep with me then and there, I would not do it. I spent most of my young life doing whatever God wanted me to do. I did not make a move until I asked myself if this is what God wanted. Of course I strayed but I have not forgotten anything I was taught regarding God and if I say I am not going to sin with him, then I won't.

I know the tricks of the enemy very well since he has been fighting against me so much lately and that is because I am getting closer to God daily and he wants to destroy that. We are in a battle of wills. This is a fight to the finish and I have my sword and shield and know how to use them, and I am speaking spiritually here.

I have come to far to go back now. I overcame vodka, a sometimes wild life, losing a job and going through menopause and now this and believe me nothing is going to keep me from God anymore. Satan has held me back long enough and I will conquer this problem and Gods will will be revealed to me and it could go either way. Sure, I'd like to find some good looking christian man who was romantic and wanted to marry me and make love to me at least 3 times a week.

But if for some reason God wants me to stay with Gabby and marry him then that's what I shall do. I asked God to take away my love for him if it was not his will. He did that for my mother and I know he can do it if that's what he wants to do. Sure, God is magnificent and he can do anything but I also know we are allowed to go through things and I believe he has a calling on Gabby's life and he has come so far.

He isn't a catholic anymore and repeated the sinners prayer a couple of years after we met but he believes that all he needs in his life is meditation and I know he feels the holy spirit but he just can't discern that certain things are wrong because he is very stubborn and catholics are very hard to sway. Of course I've asked God to show him the way because I can do no more.

No, I must wait for God's direction and his direction will come perfectly in time and everything will go smoothly and there will be no confusion because that's what happens when God has planned something for us. And yes, I have thought that things might not be going so well for us because we are not married. Just marrying him doesn't mean that is God's will. He could have somebody else for me. Or not.

Whatever I have to do; whether it be to marry him and stay in a relationship that is unfulfilling for me, or breaking up with him and going my own way, it will be very hard. I love my home and have put a lot of work and money into it. I was never rich or anything but I am very proud of my home and we both like it here. We decorated it together and as I've said, we get along well together because neither one of us is demanding or clingy and we just support each other. It isn't perfect but what relationship is?

Perhaps the enemy is trying to destroy the two of us as well, if God has a plan for us as a married couple, that is. I do not know. Only God knows what he wants for me and he isn't going to tell me to pack a bag and take my chances. I am expecting to have a decision about my disability and ssi by January. I have an attorney who is working on it, who thinks I will win and so does Gabby.

By that time I expect God to have shown me what to do because I will be owed back disability since last March and it will be the perfect time to find a place of my own. Our 10th year anniversary will be next May but when I hear the decision about the money, I will tell gabby that I have to move out because its clear he doesn't want to marry me and I cannot live with a man I am not married to, whether we don't sleep together or not.

He already knows I feel this way because a couple of months ago I told him so, I told him I wasn't going to hell over any man. If he chooses to offer more excuses then I will not argue with him but I will leave. By that time, if God has shown me what to do, I will have already looked into places and when I get one I will then have this talk with him.

Of course we would still have the problem of the no sex after we were married but living the way God wants me to is more important than his low sex drive. He used to be the most important thing to me, now God is and I have to do what's right but I can't just run out in a haste and hope God has my back even though he hasn't shown me what to do or opened any doors.

I will not step out of Gods will again. When I was very young I got tired of waiting for him to bring me someone so I married my first husband and we all saw how that turned out. He was on drugs and I found out and there went my first divorce. No, I'm done with making hasty decisions about men. I can no longer act alone for God and I are together and so I must wait for him to show me what I should do.

I trust him and I believe in him and I know he will show me what to do. I worry sometimes about if i'll ever find the right christian man who I am attracted to and yet I know that worry in itself is also a sin because we are supposed to trust in God and have faith.

Chosen, Forever, thank you for your support in this and Raymond and Chamomile too but I think I've had the longest dealings with Chosen and Forever on a continual basis. This morning when I was praying I told God that I was just going to thank him for the answer and not worry about anything today and just be happy and not dwell on any negative thoughts.

What a difference that made. At one point I even kissed gabby on the forehead, I forget why, but it was good to be happy and positive again and when I caught myself starting to think negatively I brushed it asked and just talked to God again. I am putting everything into trusting him and while I only see what's in front of me, and what a mess it is, God sees what's ahead and has worked out everything already even though I don't see it yet.

Baroness
18th November 2011, 03:10 AM
Forever, you just don't know how much I appreciate all of your efforts and the others as well. It matters very much to me that 'christian women' are giving to advice and sometimes I don't take it so well, but in the end I do accept it because I know that you are doing your best to council me. I now what is wrong and right of course, but it helps to talk to another christian woman.

I would never be at this point if I hadn't come on this site and we've had our ups and downs and people have left but through it all I have discovered very much about myself and I have actually changed, I got back to God and read his word every day and he helps me so much. 1aokgal helped me see my creative side and I do enjoy making the hats but there are other things at stake and keeping yourself busy is good but it can't be a substitute for taking a look at yourself and facing things head on.

I often wonder how come god just didn't let me get a job but then I might not have been in the place I am now spiritually so I feel that's what God has been waiting for. These are all individual steps in my life that will lead me to what God has for me. Sometimes they are hard steps but I have learned from each and every one.

It feels so wonderful to be back with God where I belong. While I was doing my own thing something seemed like it was always missing and so I looked to a man to fix it. But it wasn't a man who could fix it, it was that I had walked away from my God, the one who was with me since I was a little girl and now I am back and the missing puzzle piece has been found.

I thank God for bringing me here and I thank all of you for your patience and understanding. I feel like this is just the beginning of a wonderful life and I am not afraid. No matter what I have to do, I am not afraid because I know God is holding my hand through each and every step.

God bless all of you.

Forever
18th November 2011, 03:57 AM
Baroness,
It has been very rewarding to help another sister in Christ...you are so very welcome! We often take twists and turns in our lives and make choices that we ought not to...but thanks be to God He is not going to abandon us...lets us suffer, yes, but not abandon us. Please keep us informed to what God leads...

Big big cyber hug,
Forever

1aokgal
18th November 2011, 05:24 AM
Baroness..

I read your posts from time to time. I'm glad I was able to spark the creative side of you and share the hatmaking.

Baroness, I'm sorry to see your struggle. I had some really hard times in my own life so my heart goes out to any woman trying to find a path to happiness. It is hard to make decisions when we lack the means and have fear of the future. I hope things will go well for you.

Baroness
18th November 2011, 06:24 AM
1aokgal, its very nice to hear from you again. I was thinking of you because I sold my first hat on etsy and I wanted to tell you about it but I couldn't. It was a very nice feeling but she wanted me to take the feathers off! They matched the hat perfectly but she wanted it plain so I did as she asked. I finally sell a hat and I had to take off my decorations. Oh well.

I hope you are doing well. I am doing much better. Life is kind of strange sometimes. You never think you are going to be in a situation and then you find yourself in one and wonder how you got there. Its very hard to have a way of life and then know that it might change. But who is to say the change might not be the best thing that could have happened?

I don't know, i'm just doing the best I can under the circumstances. I think i've gone through more in the past 2 years than I ever have in years past. However; I do think I'm in a better place mentally and spiritually than I have been in about 8 years.

1aokgal
18th November 2011, 07:45 PM
Baroness..

I can only tell you that other women have been in your position and it seems impossible at the time. You are a smart lady and just think out your moves ahead.

Congratulations on the hat sold. Remember authentic pattern hats sell to specific customers who pay more to match those pricey period outfits. That is a better market than someone who buys a vintage hat.

A woman I knew years ago created beautiful Civil War bonnets sold on her website. She used the same easy base pattern, with tastefull flower trim and pretty ribbon ties. Her bonnets sold for about $200 and she always had back. I bought two of her bonnets and they are with a buckram interling, a firm base, and so pretty. She was on the list for Civil war societies, re-enactor and theatrical costume lists and sold through several websites. No wonder she did so well.

The bonnets with all made the same but in velvet, silk, taffetta and it always looked different with fine touches and trim. She knew how to do them efficiently as she cut a number at once. She made a fine business. I was sad to learn she died of a stroke in her 50's. I know others with similar success with these items. So don't get discouraged. Good luck.

Baroness
19th November 2011, 01:38 AM
There's a lady like that on etsy called civilwarlady and I did a bonnet per her instructions. I will include a picture for you. I also did a wide brimmed hat in purple silk with a ruffle around the edges and I sewed this myself, it was fun to do. I ordered some beautiful hat pins on etsy too and were very pleased with them. I haven't made a mat in a few months cause I wanted to sell the ones I do have on etsy right now.

We are actually having a pretty good day around here. He suddenly got back his personality and sense of humor. Figures.

1aokgal
19th November 2011, 03:03 AM
Good work. I am familiar with the lady on etsy. The bonnets I describe are more in Civil War period and authentic for that period.

Baroness
19th November 2011, 05:51 PM
Yes, she has a black one on there that is the same shape as my blue one. She has step by step instructions on there which were very helpful. I kind of expected to sell a hat sooner but I guess it depends on what people are looking for at the time. I was wearing the one I sold one day and went in to the managers office here and you should have heard her! She loved it and went on and on about it.

She said she was looking for a vintage hat a week ago. I told her about my business and gave her one of my business cards and she was so excited and said this was so neat. It really pumped up my confidence and there is another black lady here who is a good friend who loves the hats also. As with any business, it probably takes some time to get going and I realize that but its nice that I have this in my life now, it makes me feel happy and I have a sense of accomplishment.

Right now I am painting christmas houses for my christimas village. Things are fine here. I'm leaving to day to spend the night with my friend and dogsit for her. Is everything okay with you?

1aokgal
20th November 2011, 01:20 AM
Your painting Christmas houses for a village sounds like fun. I love to do such creative things.
My husband is home after four months gone. He got home one days after our 31st anniversary. He will have until January here, then is gone again. Today we shopped for a lovely new Xmas tree with a stand that turns the tree. So it seems we will get some decorating done in the next days.

My daugher was able to get off Thanksgiving, so she will be here for the day. She will bring her best Pumpkin cheese cake over and she is a fabulous baker. So I look forward to that.
Things always go well with us. Perhaps what needs to change with women is our expectations, as changing another never works. I work more on oil painting as that is a happy place for me. You are a creative person and you will find that you get in touch with yourself in making something beautiful.

Baroness
20th November 2011, 01:39 AM
Yes, a while back I realized that my expectations were too high and that's what was causing me so much trouble. I write romance novels so maybe that has something to do with it. Then I was upset because of him stopping making love to me and now I don't really know what the future will hold for me. I am waiting on God's direction and seeing how things go. The truth of the matter is, its hard to find a man you can trust and who will be faithful to you and who you respect.

He doesn't believe the way I do about the bible and he's quiet and he's not really romantic. These are not reasons to leave someone. God can show him things but even if that doesn't happen at least he believes in God and prays. He's quiet but then so am I, and he's not romantic the way I would like but he is the one who brings me the beautiful flowers when no other man really had.

We are used to each other and know each other and have built a nice home together and I feel safe with him, like no harm would come to me because I know he would stick up for me and protect me in a dangerous situation. I could find someone with those qualities but maybe there would be something else I wouldn't like about him. Maybe he'd be jealous or demanding, you just don't know until you've known someone for awhile.

I have posted on here that it would be better if I left and found someone else more like me, but I'm just not feeling that I should go at this time. Regardless of not having an income, if it was meant that I should go then surely I wouldn't still love him. It gets kind of confusing for me so I have to leave it in God's hands at this point.

I do better when I don't think about this constantly and when I start to, to think of something else because worrying about my future isn't helping. So I have decided to just be myself and enjoy my life as it is and if the time comes where I am to go, then I will say that I did my best. And if the door opens for me to go then it will be because I can support myself. When God does something there isn't alot of confusion, it just works out.

I don't think any of us knows what's going to happen in future, all we can do is live our life the best we can and handle whatever happens in life.

chosen
20th November 2011, 03:37 AM
baronness, I think that I said ages ago that your partner seems to have many good qualities and we will never find the perfect mate because we arent perfect ourselves, so how can we expect them to be?
He does have faith and just because it doesnt seem to be the same way as yours doesnt matter, and the fact that he doesnt read the Bible like you do isnt an issue. He is where he is with God, and to be honest, some ladies who I am friends with would be thrilled to have a man who believes in God and prays! Their husbands do neither! God relates to us all as unique individuals, and I learnt many years ago that what is right for one believer isnt right for another.

We will never get anywere by comparing our partners to other people. It do not good at all and will always bring discontentment and unhappiness.I do agree with you that writing(or reading) romance novels is a bad idea, because you get unrealistic expectations of marriage and romance and of what a man 'should' be like.YOu are making the men in your novels to be the so called 'ideal man' but did you know that many romance writers make their men to be effeminate and more 'women' like because that makes them seem more caring and romantic?Men and women are different and we need to respect the differences.

We all need to be accepted unconditionally, and as we are, and not as others think we should be. If you want to stay with this man, you two need to have a serious talk about marriage. The fact that you have lived with him all this time probably makes him think that you arent in a hurry to marry, and unless you tell him otherwise that things have changed for you and that now marriage is very important, how will he know? Men(or women) cant read minds.

As for finding someone who is more like you, you make it sound so easy. I have to say that at our age(50's) available goldy Christian men are like gold dust, and are extreemly rare. Christian women of middle age and older far far outnumber the men, so the chances are that you would be alone for the rest of your life. I consider myself to have been very blessed to have met my husband in my late 40's. He had literally just come out of a marriage, and if I hadnt come along I am sure he would have been snapped up very quickly. I know several ladies in their 50's and 60's who have been alone for a very long time and their prospects of finding a man are slim.

1aokgal
20th November 2011, 06:34 AM
Men of that age are an "exotic species" by eager women of 45+ who realize their best days lookwise, might be behind, and their selections are less. The problem is many of these men prefer 20 something women who seek a man of property who is already trained. That cuts the number even more. So, that is true that it is not as easy to find a decent man as it is when younger.

I married a younger man and he had not been married before, but that is not the usual. Maybe that realtionship still has hope and i agree the discussion about marriage is a must. You should know where you stand and what is in his plan. If the romance is past, you should know that too. Don't confront, just ask.

chosen
20th November 2011, 10:37 AM
I am not sure that non Christian men are quite so hard to find, but Christian men certainly are. I do know non believing women who have met men well into middle age and older, but when it comes to the church and Christian men, in all ages there are more females than males, from the teens upwards. It seems to get worse the older you get, and most churches that I have been to have quite a few single or divorced ladies, bit few, if any, single or divorced men. Its a sad fact of life it seems.In the world its about 50/50 males to females, but in the church when you get to middle age it seems to be about 80/20 or even 90/10 from what I have seen, and going by numbers on the internet sites I used to go on.
Godly men wont be after very young women(my husband is slightly younger than me), and in the circles that I move in most women arent after money or position, but I am sure that is the case in some places.

Its very tempting for ladies in this position to look outside their faith but that is a bad idea,and God does forbid it anyway. My 3 close female Christian friends will tell you this themselves. They all have non believing husbands and it causes so much unhappiness for them even thought they love them.

When my son came back to God about 5 years ago, in his late 20's, he joined a Christian dating site in the Uk. All of his friends up till then werent believers obviously. Within a very short time he had 30 or so girls wanting to get to know him.(he is good looking lol). Thats just shows that even in the late 20's and early 30's there arent enough men. He is now very happily married to a beautiful lady, the first one who had contacted him!!!A match made in heaven, literally.

Baroness
21st November 2011, 01:55 AM
Chosen, I actually write romance/suspense mystery books and I always have except now there is no sex in them, just romance and I never said it was a bad idea. Its what I do and have always wanted to do. I've changed the way I write and make the men more realistic.

Chosen and 1aokgal, thank you for your input and I have been praying about God showing me what to do and about doors opening and I just don't feel like he wants me to leave gabby. I had an open mind when I prayed but you are right, in that it might be hard to find a christian man. I believe that god could find me someone but at least gabby believes in God and does pray, and you are also right that we don't have to believe the same, but it would be nice.

We have been getting along better and I feel that I can't say goodbye to him. Of course, if God has something else in mind then he will show me but when I pray I feel that he wants me to stay put. I have talked to him about marriage and he agreed that we will get married and he understands that it bothers me that we aren't and it bothers him also. This is quite a breakthrough.

Of course once we're married we still have the problem of sex but he also assured me that its because he gets tired after working up at the canyon and now he is walking quite a bit. He said he is of course still attracted to me. But we still have the problem of sleeping apart and no sex and it could be that there never will be.

If God wants me to marry him, well, I know he does, he will have to give me the strength and grace to live without sex. However; gabby does hold me and still show affection so it isn't a lost cause yet. This used to be a really big problem for me but not so much anymore. I don't know if God is helping me or i'm just getting used to it but it is no longer a deal breaker.

It isn't right that married people should live like that but he is quite a bit older than me and so I am still praying about it but no longer focusing on it. I am not focusing on our differences either. I had to train my mind to think differently and be thankful for the good things about him. I always had accepted him the way he was until the sex issue.

I was talking it over with my best friend last night and realized that he and I have a relationship that mostly works. I like time alone to do my own thing and he is agreeable and don't pressure me to spend every waking moment with him. We spend more time together than before and it looks like we aren't going to my mom's for christmas.

It will be our first christmas here and I will make christmas dinner. My daughter is coming from Seattle and she will spend christmas day with us. I hate it that I won't see my mother and brother but the van is going to cost too much money at this time to fix. It's been a long while since I haven't been with my whole family and I won't see my son or grandson either.

I will have to make the best of it and he apologized and I told him he didn't have to, we would just make the best of it, and it wasn't his fault the van broke down. He isn't a real holiday person but I am. However; he says the way I decorate the place reminds him of his mother when she was alive. At least I will get to see my daughter who I miss very much. My thinking process has definitely changed.

I asked God to help me with it and he has, I don't entertain negative thoughts about this relationship or anything else, I just thank God for what I do have because there are people in worse shape than us. Homeless people out in the rain with no where to spend the holiday. Couples where the husband is abusive and the wife lives in fear.

I have none of that and I do have a good man who will do the right thing by me and so I have come to the conclusion that I really don't want another man with other problems. At least I know gabby is faithful and has a kind heart and I don't think he's so much selfish for not trying to be with me physically as it is he's afraid of failing. Anyway, that's something that will be addressed after we're married, not now.

In a strange way its kind of good that we aren't having sex, that he isn't instigating it because I have decided to wait until after we're married. Of course I'm not absolutely sure this is what God wants but I'm going by the way I feel when I pray and I realize that I still love him and as he has come a long way since we got together, God can take him and I further still.

chosen
21st November 2011, 06:39 AM
Baroness
yes God can and will take him further. God changing us is a process for all of us, and we are all at different stages in our journey.

Just my thoughts on the romace novel thing.
It often isnt sex in romance novels that make them so attractive to women, but the romance and fantasy and being wanted by this wonderful 'knight in shining armor'. Some say it is the female equivalent of men looking at porn, because men are in the main more visually stimulated and women are more turned on by what the man says and does and how he treats her.
My husbands ex used to watch loads of historical romance films and made him watch them with her(he hated them)presumably in the hope that he would suddenly be like one of those effiminate fictional men in them. Well it didnt help their marriage did it and I keep well away from such films and books because I dont want anything to make me in anyway discontent. Also I prefer a real normal man, and not a made up one who is just acting and is nothing like that in real life. These film makers know how to get women to watch.

yes I am sure that God could find you another man, but the facts are that if there are 4 or 5 or 6 women to every man of our sort of age, then the sad fact is that most Christian ladies wont meet anyone. However I think that God has found you a man, and things in your relationship do sound as of they are definately moving in the right direction. Did you even think that the fact that the sex stopped may even be God ensuring that you no longer disobeyed him? He cant bless a relationship where there is sin like that, and you may even find that if you marry and both repent and appologise for having sex outside marriage, things may improve a lot on that area. At least then you will have Gods full blessing. How could God answer your prayers to heal your sex life when it was sinful to have it anyway? It was never going to happen, but after marriage, who knows!!You can then pray wth assurance that you are in Gods will and blessing.

Baroness
22nd November 2011, 01:41 AM
Yes, I think you or someone expressed your views on romance novels before but that is what I do and is my vocation. Your opinion is noted but I still like to write mystery novels and will continue to do so. Yes, I realize that God may have had a hand in the no sex thing and I will make it right and I agree with you that god has already given me a good man.

But this good man just told me to go my mom's for christmas without him. The van is down and my daughter in law offered to come and get us because we all meet at my mom's and I told him and he said he didn't want to go without his own car but that I could go since he was just going to be watching tv anyway. At first I said no because I didn't want to spend christmas apart from him but it clearly doesn't matter to him.

He's still trying to fix the van in time but its doubtful so I didn't think it was right to not be with my whole family just because he doesn't want to depend on anyone else and he's right; he would just sit here and watch tv. It kind of hurt my feelings because he just changed the subject like it didn't matter at all and I don't think it does matter to him.

The praying and reading the bible is working for me as far as not having negative thoughts all the time, but if I miss a day they all come back so I have to keep doing this. We've been getting along pretty well and he said he would try to fix the van in time but it looks doubtful. I told him this isn't what couples do and we haven't spent a christmas apart since before we moved in together but his attitude is that its just another day.

At first I didn't know what to do because I didn't want to leave him here but he said I needed to be with my mother because I only see her once or sometimes twice a year and also I wouldn't see my son and my daughter would probably go up there too instead of spending it with me. She lives in seattle and we haven't seen her in a long time.

Is this a sign? That our relationship is so distant that he doesn't care if we spend christmas together or not? Does he truly not care or is he being unselfish by telling me to go be with my family. He loved my brother and mother and my kids too so why would he be so stubborn about not accepting a ride? Of course I knew he wouldn't.

I thought that perhaps this would be a good time to go and think about this relationship away from here. I would have time. I did this earlier in the year, remember? Thats when I rededicated my life to God and discovered that I really missed gabby and that I still loved him. Anyway, that's what's happening.

He just came in here and asked me to look for another vehicle on line. So much for him thinking about being here on christmas. I guess I won't take it personally since I know him and I don't think he meant it as an insult or anything.

I'm doing okay, you don't have to worry about me and reading romance novels. I don't read them, I just write them and as I say; I write mysteries. I think that topic is over but I appreciate you speaking your mind but it has nothing to do with me and him. I have no romantic expectations. He has his romantic moments and I wouldn't want a man who gushed all over me with poetry and sonnets and words of love.

I know he loves me and this is just the way he is. One thing about gabby is that I know I can trust him. I know he wouldn't even talk to another woman if she started flirting with him.

Everyone have a nice Thanksgiving!

1aokgal
22nd November 2011, 02:41 AM
Dear Baroness..

Write on, Sweetie, and maybe you catch the spirit of Catherine Cookson from 1900s' Edwardian England, a VERY poor lady who wrote about her trials and tribulations in extraordinary romance novels. These were translated into many languages. She wrote hundreds of great novels in her lifetime. She went from utter poverty, who actually labored in the "pits" , the coal mines of UK, and became extremely wealthy. She was a great philanthropist, who understood the problems of others and gave generously of her fortune to causes for others.

Her novels have been made into movies and show on the BBC "Masterpiece Theatre." I adore Catherine Cookson and the movies are wonderful romantic stories, usually with a moral lesson. She was a quite amazing lady with heart, who lacked means, and frankly did not have great education. Anyone who would discourage a creative spirit lacks vision. This spark to create comes from God who intended us to use our talents to enrich our culture. Romance novels are not sex novels, as that is a different genre.

Read the biography on that romance novelist, Margaret Mitchell, who spent 10 yrs to write ONE novel, her first novel. It is one of the greatest of all time romance stories..yes, hardships, war, sex, bad marriages, and bad decision making from the heroine who capitivated the world in the novel made into film, "Gone with the Wind." What woman hasn't loved that story! Imagine the creator wispering in that novice writers' head and what she wrote for all to enjoy!

I love the movies made of Cookson novels from the story value, and the fabulous costume elements as that goes along with MY creativity to design Victorian costumes and accessories for ladies in the theatre and Victorian Societies. My outfits have been shipped all over the world.
The poster with this view didn't think figure painting was good in the arts either! Somebody who sees that narrowly would have banned the Sistine Chapel and many works of fabulous art. The poster who disapproves of romance novels must be thinking of hard core "bodice grabber" novels and that is a different thing. There is no evil or wrong in such interesting, imaginative stories. Remember the book burners some years ago who thought the novels, by philosophers and thinking men, weren't good to read either!

Rock on, Baroness!

1aokgal
22nd November 2011, 03:13 AM
PS...Baroness, while you have history with him and it would be terribly hard for you to stay with him. I think he has no idea of marriage at this point. Why would you want to marry this man? Frankly, this man appeals to me not at all. I think there is an extended history of his own selfishness. That romance died long ago. You did not get the message because you are loyal.

I WOULD go to your mothers' for Xmas. You should have a great time and begin to detach from the guy. I think he has another agenda. He seems dishonest in how he is dealing with your relationship. While I can say it is true that it is tougher out there for women over 50 to meet a decent man, I also know a couple women who married later. One set her mind to meet a military officer. She joined an organization active on the military base here. She rented a room from me for a time while she looked for a place. She is not gorgeous and could stand to lose some weight, but is attractive and well spoken. She sent out her wedding invitations recently to a very nice 50 yr old Navy commander. I learned from my best friend who knows about him, he is quite a catch. She joined a church with single and divorced bible group and met him at a function. She told me she would find a good man and she did.

You are too young to give up your sexuality and be with someone who treats you like wallpaper. Think about changing your life. I think he is biding time to hear about your disability by January. I would be on my guard that he may drop it on you in January he doesn't have to provide for you. Lets' be honest, he has shown you repeatedly, he is not in it for you. That might hurt, but I would take that as gospel, it is over. Put the future in your own hands and think carefully.

chosen
22nd November 2011, 09:40 AM
No you are right baroness, most men arent naturally romantic anyway, but I still think you have a good man who loves you so dont do anything drastic till God clearly leads you. God can change things and you said yourself how he has already changed so much.
You have a best friend and companion and you love each other, why risk that for a life alone? Once you marry, if you decide to, God can begin to bless your relationship and I think you will see big changes. All this time, your relationship has been out of Gods real blessing.
The more that you get discontent the more he will feel it, and who wants their partner to be discontent with them? It is soul destroying. My husband had that for years.When we met he was like a shell.
Treasure what you have, thank God for the good things and pray about the rest. Many ladies would be very happy to have a man like him, who believes in God, works hard in giving to others, is faithful, and prays. No man or women is perfect, and even if you did meet someone else(which statistically isnt likely), he too will have faults and weaknesses, maybe even worse ones.Just dont waste time or energy thinking that there is a perfect 'knight in shining armor' around, because he doest exist.

I do really think that this whole thing of being double minded is harming you. You need to either get married and put 100% committment into the marriage, or leave and move on. You cant carry on going back and forth in your mind forever.
Its not doing you any good and he will be sensing that as well.
God Bless

Chamomile
22nd November 2011, 11:26 AM
PS...Baroness, while you have history with him and it would be terribly hard for you to stay with him. I think he has no idea of marriage at this point. Why would you want to marry this man? Frankly, this man appeals to me not at all. I think there is an extended history of his own selfiishness. That romance died long ago. You did not get the maessage because you are loyal.

I WOULD go to your mothers' for Xmas. You should have a great time and begin to detach from the guy. I think he has another agenda. He seems dishonest in how he is dealing with your relationship. While I can say it is true that it is tougher out there for women over 50 to meet a decent man, I also know a couple women who married later. One set her mind to meet a military officer. She joined an organization active on the military base here. She rented a room from me for a time while she looked for a place. She is not gorgeous and could stand to lose some weight, but is attractive and well spoken. She sent out her wedding invitations recently to a very nice 50 yr old Navy commander. I learned from my best friend who knows about him, he is quite a catch. She joined a church with single and divorced bible group and met him at a function. She told me she would find a good man and she did.

You are too young to give up your sexuality and be with someone who treats you like wallpaper. Think about changing your life. I think he is biding time to hear about your disability by January. I would be on my guard that he may drop it on you in January he doesn't have to provide for you. Lets' be honest, he has shown you repeatedly, he is not in it for you. That might hurt, but I would take that as gospel, it is over. Put the future in your own hands and think carefully.

Dear 1aokgal xx

Your post often sums up how much you care about others and B in this particular case and you speak the truth from your heart. You're a straight-laced person who cannot tell lies, which is an exceptional talent. You are committed to educate ppl, instead. It's a hardest thing to do to so many of us. My hat's off to you. After all, that's what public forums are for.

B has lived so many years with this ungodly man. She's clearly so attached to him whilst the relationship has gone past its sell by date as her descriptions often suggest this. All he seems to care about her is when she's getting her disability money and his cable. Not much else.

It is probably, a case of "it's better than nothing". It's better to have this man than no one to care, perhaps. B is a passionate and caring woman who has a lot to give. Hope she will do what's right for her according to what Bible says when she's realistically able to. It would be good for her to be able to leave what happened in the past behind eventually and move on. You cannot change a man who doesn't have any Christian faith.

chosen
22nd November 2011, 12:52 PM
I think that we are all judging this man who we really know little about. We are also making serious assumptions about him as well. I see things and him very differently from others here. I see a lot of good. I cant see many of the things that he is being accused of. They are purely assumptions with no proof.
If they get married they may well have a very blessed marriage. We cant always just run when things dont go 100% the way we want.
The main thing Baroness, is to ask for Gods clear leading, because He is the only one who knows the future. If you jump without His guidance you may regret it for the rest of your life. Sometimes we dont appreciate what we have until we loose it. Yes the grass can look greener, but when you get to it, it still has weeds and brambles and rough patches just like the old grass.....
So dont go by what any of us here say, but by what GOD says. He alone has true wisdom.

1aokgal
22nd November 2011, 05:41 PM
Chamomile..

Thanks for your nice post. Xoxoo. Yes, we do care about the women here who try so hard.

We might think the safest thing we can say for B is to stay where she is. The problem there is this...Gabby has no responsibility to provide for her, health problems or her senior years. If he wanted to marry, he would have done that years ago, when things were good. While she paints Xmas houses, he avoids her company and goes to the canyon, where he expends efforts free. Meantime he yowls about the money for his cable service. Who does that? That is a nightmare! The income is so poor he is grounded by his truck problem.

So, her staying is not assured at all. It would be foolhardy to put all her effort to bake and carry on, when that situation is extremely unstable. I see that where she lives is killing her soul.

They don't own a home together and likely her name may not even be on the lease. When this is over she has ZERO. He doesn't put out, he keeps her no companionship and has a sharp tongue bordering on verbal abuse. He shares nothing, least of all her faith. The problem is her lack of confidence and her need to hang on with her fingertips to marry someone totally unredeemable as a nice guy. No this is no dream story.

They were good together when lit, she on vodka, and he into his choice. He still spends what money he gets his hands on for a barroom blast. If she hadn't sobered up, she would be there with him, but because she saw where that was leading her, she realized that was soul destroying. THAT is what they had in common. While the booze flowed there was fun and sex. Truth is, he is not a fun guy without liquid help. She has gotten all homey/crafy as women will do, and they don't share that.

Yes, It would be so hard for B to leave and try it with relatives help. I did it years ago, and it was terrible....but I made a better life. It is hard to tell someone the truth about their situation. We want to honey down the words. Meantime we wish that reality would crack through to someone before it is too late. This life she is living is quite terrible. I say this respectfully...she is not young and she is no cover girl, but she can find a better life than what she has today.

Life now means at least age 76 for women, according to actuarial statistics. Does anyone here think this guy is going to keep a roof over her head and continue to sleep on the couch the next 20 years? No, he won't. So he has tried to make it so she would leave. She holds on for the fact she is not able to see her way to leave financially. He doesn't owe her a roof overhead. So I think the clock is running here. She needs to pull out all the stops for income. She needs to clean houses, babysit, find an anything job to enable her moving soon. That is the real truth.

There are a few of us who had all doors shut and managed to make things work, and get a better life. I think she can do it. She has to have faith she can do that, but it has to be when she feels she can. I think her time there is running.

Baroness
23rd November 2011, 02:21 AM
Wow. I am getting different advice from each of you. First of all, I don't think he is ever going to dump me. He tells me all the time how we will be together forever and he loves me and believes this. Chosen, you are right about him in your assessment, he isn't a bad man and doesn't constantly complain but is just frustrated because money is tight.

However, 1aogal and Chamomile have a point too. Things will probably get worse but of course I have faith in God so I can't pronounce doom on him. All the advice has a point and I am waiting on God, not just running out and stepping out of his will again. I have given everything to God and am not worrying about this.

Men have always liked me and been drawn to me and that's why i'm not worried about finding another man and I believe God would bring me one. I have a positive attitude and like to laugh and men find me appealing to look at, as well, but that's no guarantee I know. I have no worries on that score and I am not here just because I am afraid of being alone. I have no fear of anything.

The reason I seem to straddle both sides of the fence is because of what all of you just said; the different aspects of this relationship. I am waiting on God and am going to see what happens. By the time I get the disability I will know what to do. You see, its very hard not knowing what you should do, if what you do will be a mistake or the best move.

That's why I am leaving it to God because unless he opens the door I am not moving but sometimes its good to step out on faith too. I still care for him but we are more like roomates now. If he cares deeply for me he is doing a good job of hiding it and yet he will tell me he loves me and I know he means it. He does not want me to leave and if and when that time comes he will be very shocked and hurt.

However; if God has another plan for me i'm not going to stay in a relationship where the man won't marry me or treat me right. I have no illusions about him or any man but I do believe this relationship should be different. He has too many issues he won't let go of and I'm tired of being hurt by what he does and doesn't do. Maybe he's happier in a bar, but I know there is much more to life than that.

I am a christian and I love God and I have made the decision to do what God wants me to do and I know he will show me what that is. There are good and bad things about staying and the same for leaving. I have to trust in God and in my own intelligence to show me what to do. Do I want to live like this the rest of my life? No.

If he wanted to marry me tomorrow, could I just accept this kind of life? I don't think so. Do I still love him? Yes, but its horrible to want someone and be attracted to them when they don't seem to feel the same. That's worse than being alone.

1aokgal, thanks for your words about writing; you get it. Try not to be concerned about me, ladies. I am a strong woman and I will get through this. I know you don't know him but it isn't that he's such a horrible person. Its that he has no passion for anything. Yes, I can get along with him, but I don't want to just live life getting along and accepting all the bad stuff in this relationship?

I know him better than anyone and I know he doesn't have bad intentions at all and he's the one who is paying for everything, not me. It has just been lately that he has been getting frustrated and its quite normal for him to do so. God is changing me and the last thing I want is to settle for this or that when he has another plan for me, where I can find happiness.

At this point I am just waiting for direction as well as for the disability. I will no longer put anything before God. I spent years pleasing myself with sex and booze and now its time to put God first.

Chamomile
23rd November 2011, 12:59 PM
I think that we are all judging this man who we really know little about. We are also making serious assumptions about him as well. I see things and him very differently from others here. I see a lot of good. I cant see many of the things that he is being accused of. They are purely assumptions with no proof.
If they get married they may well have a very blessed marriage. We cant always just run when things dont go 100% the way we want.
The main thing Baroness, is to ask for Gods clear leading, because He is the only one who knows the future. If you jump without His guidance you may regret it for the rest of your life. Sometimes we dont appreciate what we have until we loose it. Yes the grass can look greener, but when you get to it, it still has weeds and brambles and rough patches just like the old grass.....
So dont go by what any of us here say, but by what GOD says. He alone has true wisdom.

Hi

I don't know but you do have a deeply negative opinions of certain ppl and you are not afraid of condemning them. Shall I say, you have a double standard. One minute, you accuse ppl of our harsh opinions over one thread and you're even harsher and even more cruel on other people whenever it suits you.

This is a Baroness's thread, let's not start a petty argument leading to Christmas.

Sorry Baroness. xx

1aokgal
23rd November 2011, 11:50 PM
Baroness...

Have a nice Thanksgiving! I hope it is a good day for you. I will send you a couple gorgeous hat photos I saw that you might like to see these after holiday to your email, if that is OK. I must get busy working on my stuff for Xmas. I am far behind. How are the Xmas houses going?
Take each day as it comes and don't let your day be spoiled by crankiness from another. :-)

Baroness
24th November 2011, 03:42 AM
Hello, I am taking a break from cleaning the oven because its hard work. I don't think anyone on here means to be cruel or to put down anyone. I realize you all are saying what you feel and I appreciate you taking the time to do so. I realize that you are only hearing from me about gabby. I have said he is a nice man and he does love God. He prays and tries to do the right thing but for the things he doesn't want to change, I think he doesn't pray about them.

I think he meditates more than prays but that's okay, its a long way from going into a confessional. We have been getting along today except for one incident when I finished the christmas houses and he said the colors didn't match and when I tried to explain he said I was getting mad. I did say he didn't know about christmas villages but he didn't want to hear what I said. It seems like such a silly thing but I just asked him if he liked them.

I tried to tell him that my other houses that I painted over the years are different and that's the way I wanted it. Who ever heard of a christmas village with all the same colors? I tried to tell him that a village has all kinds of houses but he wouldn't let me talk, just said I was getting upset. I wasn't upset, I was trying to explain the concept. I let it go and then a few minutes later told him all I wanted to know is if he thought they were cute and he said yes.

We moved on from there but why couldn't he have just said yes, they are very nice. I painted these tall little towers that are the library, a train station, etc. Someone was giving them away and I redid them and it has been alot of intricate work, which is what I like. I have a large table out just for this village because it has grown and I want it all in the same place and lights go inside them and I even bought the white cotton for the snow.

When I get it all set up he will see what I mean. I found two log cabins also which had christmas wreaths on them and they are also going in my village. I will know more how it goes together once I have it all set up but I was only asking for his approval,I have to ask someone and no one else is here, I just didn't expect all that.

Of course, if it was reversed I would have offered my opinion but not before I had set it all up.Its been a lot of work and I just got finished with everything a few hours ago. He and I are a lot alike in certain things. We both have this sense of decorating and we usually agree on everything. Being a painter for many years, he knows about colors but this is a christmas village not an actual house.

I am learning to let things like this go. I talked to my old friend today, who was a pastors wife, and she agrees that I am doing the right thing in going to my moms alone because just because he doesn't want to socialize or whatever his reasons, doesn't mean I shouldn't, especially when it comes to family. She also agreed that God can change him and if not then God has another plan.

I trust this woman and other than you guys, I don't really have anyone I trust to talk to about this. My other best friend who I have mentioned is not a christian so Patty is the one I trust because she's been in the ministry a long time and knows me better than anyone, even Mickey, my best friend. I like it because she has a christian perspective and that's what I need. She doesn't tell me what to do but only offers advice if I ask for it and is a good friend.

I thank God that we came back into each others life and I met her when I was about 23 or something and then we lost track of each other and I found her again several months ago and I can't tell you how thankful I am that she's back in my life. I do talk to my mother but Patty understands many things, has been around and has been with God since we first met. We laugh a lot together and I respect her.

You see, God has provided for me. Even though I might not like it that gabby is staying here for christmas day, God did provide a way for me to be with my family. He also brought Patty back in my life so I would have a good christian friend to talk to. The world sees a couple living together as no big thing, but Patty is married and she understands how I wasn't concerned with that when away from God but now I am.

I have to tell you that I can't believe the person I am today. I can't believe how much i've changed, even down to the way I think and have always thought. I feel the first step in this journey was coming on here and hearing from you ladies, from there on important things happened to me. Instead of God changing gabby, it was I who changed. My whole world is no longer what this man does or doesn't do.

I am much happier in many ways because I have my focus back on God and doing the right thing as far as my life is concerned. I'm no longer walking around frustrated and angry and stressed out. I actually smile at him when he comes in the door and am very pleasant to be around, just like I used to be but this time its God that is helping me be a better person. Gabby has changed to in the past week.

He seems more talkative and some of his sense of humor has come back and he has always been very grateful for things I do for him such as cooking and making him deserts and looking up things on line for him. He is a nice man and I never meant to imply that he wasn't. He just doesn't make an effort to be with me sexually, but now that isn't an issue because I have decided to wait until after we're married.

Still, I am open to Gods direction but I'm not feeling him directing me to leave, at least right now. I have kind of a calm and peace about things so no matter what happens I will be okay. There is no need to panic about my life. So let's just say it doesn't work out. I move out and take my stuff with me and then see what happens. That isn't so terrible. It would be a shame if we did part ways because we've been together for so long.

I just don't think God expects me to leave someone I still love. He could take the love away instead and I've asked him to do that if that's what he wants. This has been a long road but I think God's purpose in all that's happened, and most of it isn't good, is that he wanted me to pay attention to my relationship with him and not with gabby. Once you are right with God everything else will fall into place.

Maybe not right away, on my time table, but that's what trusting God is all about. I started thinking that I feel comfortable with gabby because we both give each other space and then we both spend time together but there is no demands or anything. Yes, he irritates me sometimes and I don't understand the physical aspect, but this isn't a fairy tale where everything is perfect in our happily ever after.

Relationships take work and there are good and not so good times, but I think to find true love is very special and doesn't happen all the time.

I want to wish you a happy thanksgiving.

I met a lady today who lives in the building and she says she has no one to spend thanksgiving with because she has no family anymore. She's pretty old but I thought how sad it would be to have no one to spend the holidays with and that I should be grateful that I have several people to spend the holidays with, my family, and yes, gabby.

1aokgal
24th November 2011, 04:27 AM
Hi Baroness..

Sounds like the oven cleaning is not on your favorite tasks...me either. I finally have a house with an oven that cleans itself. It is on a timer, with door lock and quite a wonder since only a wipeout is needed after. Sure beats the days of brillo pads and spray cleaners with the old ovens. I have to admit there are functions I 've never used. I should learn more about "convection cooking." I haven't a clue and should sit down with the book.

The Christmas houses sound like fun. There was a lady years back who had hundreds of these set up on a special ledge her husband built in several rooms near the ceiling and all lit up little village. I think they spent a week getting it all set up. So pretty.

You will enjoy to visit with your mother and family. Go, and don't let that dampen your joy at seeing them that he isn't going. I baked a Pumpkin pie and we had a tiny tester piece tonight. It was great. My daughter will bring her fab Pumpkin Cheese cake w/gingersnap crumb crust which is amazing..but I still love the pies. We will have the traditional turkey dinner and the best part other than good dresssing is the sandwich later. A billion calorie day? Who cares!

Remember, no one walks in your shoes except what you wrote here. It is just that we see things weighing out all the factors and from what we, ourselves, experienced. Let's say we may see clearer than a close friend, because we don't tell friends everything, do we? I only have one friend who knows most things accurately. She has fine common sense but she also has always been wealthy, independent and never married. So she doesn't see things from the view of having been through loss, hardships, divorce and raising kids. So it is good when there is someone we trust and we can confide when we feel overwhelmed. Sometime we just want FB that we do the right thing.

Have a nice holiday.

chosen
24th November 2011, 10:34 AM
Hi

I don't know but you do have a deeply negative opinions of certain ppl and you are not afraid of condemning them. Shall I say, you have a double standard. One minute, you accuse ppl of our harsh opinions over one thread and you're even harsher and even more cruel on other people whenever it suits you.

This is a Baroness's thread, let's not start a petty argument leading to Christmas.

Sorry Baroness. xx

My suggestion of Baroness leaving all of this to God because only he really knows her and him and the future was what I would do in the circumstances. Only God knows the right thing to do and for people to push baroness into leaving him for good for little reason seems drastic to me.Now if he was playing round with other women then yes.

Chamomile, I know that you are iaokgals little supporter and that you always stand up for her no matter what she does or says, but you need to see things more in balance.

chosen
24th November 2011, 10:41 AM
baroness you are wise to wait on God. Only he knows what the right thing is in this situation, and He WILL show you what to do. All I hope is that you dont jump inot something that you will seriously regret in the future.
I do so understand why he gets frustrated by lack of money. Anyone who hasnt been in that situation has no understanding of what it is like, especially for a man. I have a feeling that if you married, Gods blessing would increase.
I just cant understand why anyone would try to turn you against him, who is doing his best and is a decent hardworking guy. Keep praying for him. Its clear God is working in His life as well as yours.

Baroness
25th November 2011, 02:50 AM
The Thanksgiving meal went very well. He came to the table and said everything looked wonderful and tasted great. He kept going on and on about it. He had been watching tv but didn't get right back to it. He sat with me at the table for awhile and was telling me that he used to have Thanksgiving at home with his family and there were 25 people there. He was in no hurry to leave the table.

He sat and talked about thanksgiving and how the table looked so nice and that everything was really great. I can't remember the last time when he talked so much at the table. He said too bad we couldn't spend thanksgivings with my family and I said I like to cook thanksgiving because during my 2 marriages and as long as I can remember, my mom always made the meal and I like doing it.

My brother called him today and I heard him tell him that we would be there for christmas no matter what. That was different than what he's been telling me. Maybe he had a change of heart or he didn't want to tell my brother why he wouldn't be coming if the van wasn't fixed. I have to say we've had a lovely day together. I'm still putting away food. I had a couple of recipes i'd never done before and he liked them.

Its so much more pleasant when we sit at the table and talk for awhile instead of him rushing back to the tv. He's been in a really good mood since he came in, smiling at me and saying 'Hi, honey.' We never hugged or anything but said happy thanksgiving to one another. Usually I would go and hug him but i'm kind of tired being the only one to instigate things. It occurs to me that if I leave him then I will be taking away my brothers friendship from him and the rest of the family.

I asked him to pray before we ate and he asked me to. Its almost like he's afraid to pray because he never wants my mother to pray with him either but will relent. I think last year he did say a few words but I don't understand why he would have a problem talking to God. Doesn't he talk to him when he meditates and prays? Maybe not.

When things go good like today it confuses me because of the decision I have to make but I did tell God this morning that I would do whatever he wanted but he had to be clear in relating this to me. Also this morning I could just see myself living out in the desert near my mom in a place of my own with a dog and being happy. Even if I didn't find a man I think I would be more happy around family.

We discussed moving out there and he said next year but I can tell he doesn't really want to go. In the desert you can get a 2 bedroom house for $550-625 and we pay $810 here and this is an apartment. I'm thinking that I want to be near my mother as she is getting older. Things still stand the same as i've said before. After I get my disability and even if I don't i'm going to ask him if he plans on marrying me next year and setting a date.

If he still makes excuses then I will have to tell him that I can't go on the way things are, even if we don't sleep together. I'm also going to tell him that obviously he has a problem with making love and the excuses he gives me are just that; excuses and that since he has been sleeping on the sofa for a couple of years now it is obvious that he isn't interested in sleeping with me so its time for me to move on.

Even if I don't get disability I'm going to have to find work and then move out and that's if he won't marry me. I still have to decide if I want to stay with a man who doesn't make love to me and sleeps on the sofa like he's an overnight guest. I hope it doesn't come to that because we still have good times together sometimes and I don't really want to start over with someone else.

It depends on what doors God opens for me and what he wants. I don't know what he wants, I haven't a clue, so all I can do is my best because I can't make plans since I can't support myself right now and God hasn't shown me what to do. Gabby is not going to like it when I corner him about marriage, but i've been waiting for him and now I can wait no longer.

I hope I haven't made a mistake in trusting this man and loving him. If he wasn't interested in marriage then he shouldn't have asked me, twice.

chosen
25th November 2011, 10:53 AM
It sounds as if you had a good day together, and do remember that many people find it very hard to pray out loud in front of others, That is very common actually,
Have the two of you had a serious talk about.getting married, because otherwise how will he know what you want?He cant read your mind can he, and also rememebr that it is you that has changed and not Him. You were happy to live with him not being married and have now changed. He hasnt changed in the same way, and may have no idea how important this is to you now.

You seem to keep expecting him to be like you and want to do what you want, but everyone is different. Sometimes as wives, we need to be where our spouse wants to be.Many men may well not want to go and live so close to the wives family, and why would they?

I remeber Joyce Meyer saying that she always used to feel that her husband Dave wasnt praying 'properly' because he didnt close his eyes and how that used to annoy her!!!!

Chamomile
25th November 2011, 11:27 AM
Chamomile, I know that you are iaokgals little supporter and that you always stand up for her no matter what she does or says, but you need to see things more in balance.

It seems you have now fallen to the level of a troll? You use this site for your childish 5th grade game. :) 1AOKGAL is correct. You have a very "basic" education (your childish post reinforced this belief) and you turn into a very angry woman when other posters don't agree with you at all.

I'm saying this out of my goodwill. It did cross my mind if you have hormonal imbalance. You said before you are on a hormone therapy for your menopause. I wonder if your hormone is giving you these side effects. You can be a very mean woman. Hope you work on that particular personality problem you have. You need to stop attacking other people when people don't agree with you and what you say. It's just a nature of these boards.

I won't bother replying to your troll post anymore. Waste of time.

God bless.

Again, sorry to Baroness xx

chosen
25th November 2011, 02:45 PM
Oh Chamomile you are so funny. No I dont have a hormone imbalance. I am on HRT due to a hysterectomy 9 years ago which would have bought on an early menopause, and it keeps my hormones very stable and has done for years. Its great. One of the best inventions of modern medecine. The whole point of it is that is stabilisises the hormones!!

What is this thing with my education????
As I said before, I had a very good education in a very good girls grammar school, and also got very good qualifications:-)I passed a hard exam to get into this school, as it was a good school.
I also come from a very well educated family. My father had a highly qualified job, my husband has a phd. Most of my cousins got degrees, one actually in Oxford and one in Cambridge. My older brother went to uni, and my much younger half brother will go to uni next year and will study to be a teacher.
.
However despite all this, I have learnt in life that many things are far more important than such things, such as character, integrity, moral values, respect, fairness, honesty, faithfullness, committment, inner strength, faith etc etc. Look at Richard Branson, a man who I do admire, he left school at 16 with no qualifications at all, and now he is one of the most successful men of our time.(If by success you mean money and position and fame)

I would never attack or attempt to degrade another person because of their education (or lack of it)It is incredibly offensive and rude.Whether a person has a degree, or a phd, or left school at 16 with nothing, doesnt matter to me one bit, and never will. Its the person inside that matters and not what bits of paper they have or letters they have after their name. My husband has lots of letters after his name, but intellectually we are very much on a par. This is what the world values, and the worlds values are very different from Gods.

1aokgal
25th November 2011, 06:51 PM
Hi Baroness...

Thanksgiving day was great here. I can hardly believe the news stories of diehard shoppers out there at 10PM Thanksgiving day to begin shopping all night. Who does that? Not me, for sure. I think it unfair for the employees who should be able to enjoy that holiday. It seems that many will buy items now, as the econemy has been so poor the last 3 years. Maybe that shows people have confidence things are on the upswing.

I love to see the early return of many of the troops on TV coverage. That is heartbreaking these men have been away from family often up to a year. We will have so many of these young men who will need support for emotional and physical problems like no other war. They suffer such grievous injuries and emotional issues. I took in some strangers in the past years for this holiday. If my daughter and granddaughter had been unable to be here, I would have arranged to do that again. It is rewarding to provide a home environment for someone away from their family.

Glad to hear things went so well for you there for yesterday holiday. Nothing so great as a turkey dinner with family. Today my husband and I will do a mini repeat of that meal, before turkey sandwich time. I packed up a take home for my daughters' lunch today as she will take it to work. It is great to be able to have a nice day with our loved ones. My husband leaves to work for months at a time so we missed a lot of holidays. Sometimes he leaves before Xmas for 3/4 month trips, so that we live on a rough schedule. He is due to leave again in January.

I hope you things work out on your disability and that will be a help for you. It sounds as if you could live cheaper to be closer to your mothers' home but Gabby is attached to the canyon and that crew there, so that would be an adjustment for him. He might not want to give that up. So whatever way things go, I hope things will work out for you. Women make a lot of adjustments whether we have a man or not.

In my marriage, it is easier when he is here for me, but then there is a lot to be said for the alone time as I can do more creative things with a quiet house and time. It is the ebb and flow of life and we choose to be happy in however things go. I love the creative time and plan to go up in the studio and paint awhile. I get behind on the sewing projects, so it is helpful to me he will shop and he likes to cook, so I can get other things done.

I wish you a nice day. It sounds as if you might yet to spend Xmas with your family and he goes with you.

1aokgal
26th November 2011, 12:14 AM
Chosen..

You said that the posts "should be more in balance" and waxed critical of my posts? What's new? One is then" in balance" if everyone here will all agree with you!

Most will question another to discover why they feel as they do. We know why you feel as you do. I think you might believe yourself to be the end authority and always right. While I respect your views, and often feel personally in accord to how you see things, I don't think you own the right to be that right about that many subjects.

I will rest on my years of education, career experience, and life outlooks to think my views are often absolutely correct. The only area where I see improvement needed has to do with tact. I have the honesty, but need to temper that with presenting things better. I also recognize the OP has the right to deny what they hear or live it as they see. It is true most people will at some time hear great advice and make our own decisions and later pay the price in regret. Many don't listen to caution and act on impulse.

It seems that is most true in the area of personal relations that women will lead with their heart and not with the brain. That is how many arrived at this site. They ignored common sense and blew off good advice to find themselves in a life crisis. "Been there, done
that" most would say.

It certainly is disrespectful, Chosen, to insinuate that Chamomile or anyone here needs to agree with you. You fault her that she sees things clearly as she can be concise about a discussion. That doesn't mean she either agrees or disagrees with me. It means she has a way to make a summation of the viewpoints expressed. You are a strong woman and you have fine sense in many things, but you treat others with rude comments at your option. I often gloss over this, but it is annoying. This is also unkind. Maybe we can agree we all may have a different viewpoint in some areas. It is really up to the poster to get the best advice from different viewpoints.

Baroness
26th November 2011, 03:23 AM
I agree with you, 1aokgal about taking someone into your home for the holidays and have done so in the past. I also agree about the military coming home, it is wonderful to see and I have the upmost respect for what they do. I don't think i've ever mentioned it but when Gabby was younger he was a marine for a few years and was in battle and this is something he never likes to talk about but will watch all the military movies.

I don't pressure him to talk about this and all he would ever say that is was horrible and I can only imagine how horrible it must be to go to war and not know if you will make it out alive and it take a courageous person to do this.

I also agree that education is a fine thing, I only went to a trade school but since I write novels i've always had good grammar and the intelligence I have is something i've just always had, more so later on in years. I don't think that intelligence necessarily makes a brilliant person however. As you say, Chosen, its whats in your heart. I don't think any one is better because of education but knowledge is always a good thing.

I have a inquisitive nature where I like to know everything about anything. I was like that while working which is why I had three different jobs, I like to know the ins and outs of everything. Not all people are like that but I have always been that way. I like to know about all kinds of topics. I have certainly never looked down on anyone because of their education.

It all boils down to if you are talking to intelligent people or stupid people. Some people are stupid to me because they don't think before they speak. I am not referring to anyone here but my experience in general. If a person doesn't have ethics and integrity they are not worth talking to. I like to surround myself with people who like themselves and have ethics.

Gabby went to Boston University and was a history teacher at a young age but didn't care for it so he and his band traveling around playing in nightclubs and so forth. Even though he's had a college education he doesn't understand sometimes when i'm trying to explain something to him so I don't think his education makes him overly intelligent in some things. In a lot of ways I am more intelligent than he is but he does know history and math very well.

I have never looked down on him when he doesn't understand what i'm trying to explain to him, in fact he has said he's sorry he doesn't get it but that he is stupid and I always tell him to never think that about himself. He is not stupid, we just come from very different backgrounds and I happen to know a lot of technical things with vcrs, computers, etc.

He came from a well off family in upstate New York while my family was not well off but we made ends meet with God's help.I've never owned a home or had a lot of money and money does not impress me, the way a person treats other people does impress me. I've always wanted to be rich so I could travel but it seems I am always working very hard for what I have.

It makes me appreciate things more. I am still striving to make a lot of money through my writing and the hats but it isn't like it would devastate me if I was never rich. Gabby has owned two homes but he knows nothing about the way I grew up, it wasn't really good most of the time but I had a mother who loved me and worked hard to provide for me when my alcoholic father would leave.

I don't know what it would be like to have a nice big home but I do love architecture and I write about mansions and nice places in my novels. Just because I haven't had them or the money doesn't mean I can't write about them. I don't know why some people struggle so much and others don't but we all have to deal with our lot in life.

I hope we can all get along on this post. I do value all of your advice and while it is sometimes very different I listen to all of it and it does matter to me what you say to me. It has helped me form correct opinions on things and when I first posted I know I got very indignant when someone said something to me that I thought was insulting but I don't feel that way anymore.

That is another area that has changed since i've gotten closer to God. Any yes, we did discuss marriage and he said as soon as things settle down and we are doing better financially we will get married. He insists on having a nice wedding in a church because he didn't have one the first time and I respect that. The good news is that he is continually paying more attention to me and this relationship.

Today he came home and we sat and talked for awhile. He met this actor up at the canyon. He drove up to the kiosk where gabby takes parking money and directs people and he looked at this man and said he looked a lot like John C. Riley with his sunglasses on. The man took off his glasses and said, 'Now I really look like him, huh?' They laughed over it because it really was the actor. I've heard of hm but don't remember the movies he was in.

Gabby mentioned them but I didn't recognize them. There is definitely a change in Gabby. He is always in a good mood now and is talking more to me than he ever has. Its a beginning and I can't tell you what a nice change it is. I'm actually quite shocked. Apparently God has been dealing with him and that's what i've been praying for. All I ever wanted was for him to make the effort and not treat me like I wasn't even here.

Of course he hasn't been affectionate in a physical sense but perhaps thats for the best since I have decided not to sleep with him until we are married. I can't believe i'm saying this, but I do think that perhaps we could have a very good physical relationship after we're married. If he has changed this much then he can improve in other areas.

If God has been dealing with him on this issue then certainly he's been dealing with him on the marriage issue too and as I say we did talk about it. Anyway, I don't know what happened but the sexual issue doesn't seem to be such a big thing to me now. I don't know if its because I intend to wait until its right and God is helping me or if I just don't think its reason to leave him over.

All I know is that I have happy days now and it has nothing to do with him. I am happy because I'm where i'm supposed to be with God. That may sound ridiculous to some of you but this is the way I feel. God has always been a part of my life since I was a girl and it felt like something was missing so I tried to fill it in with drinking and partying but it never worked.

Now I have turned my life over to God and my daughter can hardly believe the things I am saying now, how i'm happy and put God first. My daughter is a very good christian and a wonderful person and highly intelligent and so is my son. He works in the science field and kira just works 3 jobs but apparently likes it in Seattle. So for once I don't have anything to complain about or to stress out over.

I started decorating today and had a lovely time. He was gone so I turned on music and even danced a little as I was decorating the house. I haven't even started the christmas village yet because I was busy decorating with the lights and the vintage decorations I have. I will have to finish tomorrow. He was gone and so I could have the music on.

Usually when he gets home and I have something else on or i'm listening to music he will just sit down (remember, he walks 6 miles a day now)and tell me he's going to watch tv now. Today he came in and sat down and listened to the music with me and after awhile asked me if it was okay that he watch college football or did I want to continue listening to music.

This never happens! To actually ask me? I'm floored! I don't know what to think. This is such a change in him. I don't know what brought it on, nothing has changed with the van, but the change is there and it makes me happy and its certainly more pleasant around here now. This is very good, girls, and I never thought it would happen. I guess I shouldn't be surprised because I know God answers prayer but I thought Gabby was so stubborn he's never listen.

Of course I know it can't always be 'up' in life and sometimes we struggle but the main thing is that we go through things together, stand by each other and the other good news is that I got the cable bill today and instead of it being $145 it was $80. That's a big difference. He doesn't miss the movie channels I got rid of and I kind of miss the dvr but I can watch my shown on the computer for free.

I thanked God yesterday at dinner for our blessings in life and that he is always there. Little did I know that he was dealing with Gabby or maybe gabby just felt like he should pay more attention to our relationship since I have been understanding and I think this is his way of telling me he appreciates it.

chosen
26th November 2011, 03:26 PM
baroness it all sounds very positive. It seems that God is really working in both of you.
I do agree with you that we need to be with people who have integrity and ethics. They are so important and of real value.
True worth isnt measured by a qualification or degree or an exam or training but on the character of a person.God really isnt impressed by letters after our names.
I know some very well qualified people who really havent a clue about real life and have very little commom sense. I have also known some people who never had the opportunity of futher eduaction,or choose not to go that way, and were/are the most wise and intelligent and sensible people ever. Almost anyone can get a degree these days if that have the opportunity and can afford it, it doesnt even mean you will get a job with things the way they are today.

I can see a lot of progress in what is happening baroness. Keep hoping and praying.

1aokgal
27th November 2011, 05:01 AM
Hi Baroness..

You do sound happier, as he seems to have more communication to spend time with you. That shows improvement and let's face it, your attitude is better, as you concentrate on many other things. That may release some of the pressure for a time. Getting money issues in better condition makes a big difference to release stress.

I removed those pricey cable stations two years ago. We bought a Samsong Blu-Ray player. These are under $200 at most Best stores. Our Netflix service is accessed through the player, as it goes online like cable to access endless movies and DVD in the mail. We can order our choice in films as Netflix is $18 month. So instead of about $120 worth of cable, we have the basic cable stations. The movies/TV shows are through Netflix and limitless. Great budget idea!

I am a penny pincher, grocery coupon clipper and shop no where I can't save money. We buy our eyeglasses through costco and shop only at TJMAAX, Walmarts, Steinmarts or internet sites. I saved $3,000 while my husband was gone in last four months by that and selling my crafts. So setting a budget and sticking to it does pay off. You items well made and properly marketed will sell. Don't get discouraged. You have time to invest in making items that will pay off.

Baroness
28th November 2011, 01:36 AM
1aokgal, I agree with you totally about bargains and sales. If I can't find something on sale then I won't buy it. I also use coupons at the grocery store and coupons from department stores, when I can get them. I'm putting 3 more hats on etsy, the only way to sell is to put it out there.

I am happier but it has little to do with him. I had to readjust the way I was thinking and with Gods help I was able to do that. The village looks so cute and I will include a picture of it. I painted everything in it and am very proud of it. Even though Thanksgiving went very well and he has made an effort, I realize that our problems remain. I still have the initial problem for which I came on here months ago and that isn't changing.

I got up early yesterday morning and gave him a hug and it occurred to me that I am the one who usually initiates any kind of physical contant. My friend suggested that I was trying to control the situation around here but she said it in a loving way. I don't want to control him but I would like a more loving relationship.

Even though he has made an effort to have conversations with me more I still don't know what my decision should be. After all, once we get married I will still have the same problem and even though I don't think about it all the time like I used to, it still bothers me. I will just have to see how it goes.

It isn't that he has changed so much, its that I have. Yes, I appreciate him trying to pay attention to me but this is still not a normal relationship, by any means. Sometimes I think I just have too much time on my hands to dwell on these things. When I was busy with the hats and the christmas village I was happier because I was doing something creative. I was busy and now that's done so I decided to work on one of my novels.

I have to have something creative to do in my life, whether or not I am with a man or not, its always been that way for me and it always will be. I have to have a sense of purpose in my life besides a relationship. It is a constant battle I have with myself not to think negatively about this situation. Of course I think any woman wouldn't be thrilled with the way things are right now.

I'm dealing with a lot, my back, unemployment, being older and now a man with such odd ways sometimes. I believe its important to count your blessings but not to the point when you ignore problems because people tell you that you should be happy with what you have and other people are worse off. I think both people in a relationship should work at it and not just one of them.

I also realize that no relationship can be the way it was when you first met and everything was exciting and new. People change and sometimes drift apart and they can either fight to keep what they have or they can give up. I guess it depends on how hard they fight and if the other person is fighting for the relationship too.

I always think of his feelings in things, always reassure him that everything will be all right and that I love him and I do things for him to show him that I care. All I want is for him to do the same. For a very long time he wasn't doing that at all so I was the only one. Being a strong person, that wasn't difficult for me but after awhile you get tired of being the only one showing consideration.

Now I feel as though I have to look out for myself as well. I can't base all of my decisions on the fact that he could be hurt. I have to think what's best for me in the long run. I have always been very unselfish in this regard but its my life and I have to do what I think is best for me.

If this sounds selfish to anyone I have to tell you that i'm not being selfish but when you are always thinking of someone else, what about your needs? Is someone thinking about you and what you need? So i've backed off a bit from rushing to do things for him, for going out of my way just so he's happy. I still do things but I don't just drop what I'm doing to please him.

He doesn't do this so why should I? It makes me feel foolish sometimes. I will always show him love and support but I'm not bending over backwards anymore because he needs to understand that this should be an equal partnership. I think I have actually been afraid to bring up things to him. Me! Afraid! I've never been afraid of anything in my life but that's what I was.

Afraid of his reaction to something I would say. Now I just say whats on my mind instead of keeping it in and if I find that he really doesn't intend on marrying me or working on his physical problems, I will not hesitate to speak my mind. There is a way of speaking where you don't come off as harsh or demanding but still get your point across.

So that's where I'm at. I was on the internet doing a little christmas shopping and I decided to get myself a christmas present because I deserve it! Why shouldn't I have things that I want? For the right price of course. It isn't selfishness to do things for yourself to make you happy. What is life if you can't be happy?

Baroness
28th November 2011, 01:47 AM
Sorry, I forgot the picture of my village. I promise I won't go on and on about this anymore. him and I, I'm even tired of hearing it from myself or thinking it. It does help to have you all to talk to though. But I have no desire to keep saying similar things and keep going round and round and up and down. I'm going to be positive and draw even closer to God.

1aokgal
28th November 2011, 05:22 AM
Hi Baroness..

I love your Xmas village. What a good job you did on these! I had the molds for the xmsas creche figurines years ago. I made them in porcelain as well as ceramic and gave all the family members a set. I have a kiln and created the porcelain vases and ceramic items w/liquid poured clay. It is very messy, but fun. I always enjoyed the china painting lovely items and displayed/sold these vases through gallery sales. I still have porcelain molds for dolls as I created and sold all but a few of the dolls. I kept a few of the French Fashion dolls in my small collection.

I wish my daughter liked the stuff but she doesn't do the crafty things. I find now my grandaughter, 12, enjoys to learn oil painting, creating and sewing..all the things I can teach her and enjoy to share. I wasn't lucky to find another pal to work with me on this stuff. We used to have several shops in this area that one could buy greenware for these Xmas villages and get them fired there. Where did you get the pieces?

There are things I prefer not to share on this forum. If you care to email, that is fine. Your situation is difficult. If one has never experienced that kind of scenario, they can't know how it effects. Let's just say that is all I will say here. You have a pretty good grasp of the issues and there is only so much you can do with all the other issues affecting your life. It is not reasonable to consider marriage as the sole option, when that is a lock-in to many years you will make the sacrifices and be held hostage by another. I'd say you need to consider if you can see the years ahead with that issue unchanged. That is all I care to say here.

chosen
28th November 2011, 10:17 PM
baroness
I know that you mentioned that he wants to wait a bit for marriage because he wants a proper wedding. One idea is to get married legally now, and then in a few months or so have a larger celebration with families and friends. If you both wait till you have more money that time may never come. Sometimes it can just delay a marriage indefinately. Until you are 100% committed to each other in marriage you will always be wavering.

Baroness
29th November 2011, 04:02 AM
Sorry, Chosen, but I don't think marrying him is a good idea right now. This morning when I got up we were joking around a little and I always make him ground coffee the night before so the loud grinder doesn't wake him up. When I get up and that coffee is gone I always use the grinder and he doesn't like it so he goes into the other room. This morning when I said I was turning it on he jumped up and said 'F__k! And was all mad.

I asked him what was wrong with him and he went on and on and was cussing and I said that I didn't always like to hear his tv blaring either. I was kind of calm, which isn't like me when someone is yelling like that. He came back in and said I knew that sound was offensive and I said offensive to who? I told him he was being ridiculous and we've had the coffee pot for 2 years now.

There was a time if he started cussing at me like that I would have cussed right back and been very angry but I did not do that. He came back in and was still angry and said I should wait until he leaves to turn it on.I told him he is not the boss of me and I'm not waiting until he decides to leave before I have coffee. I also said he was acting like a child.

He told me I had to have the last word and I said I wasn't just going to sit there while he was cussing and carrying on and so he made for the door and said he'd had enough of this blah blah sh__! I told him again he was acting like a child. The thing is, usually I would be very upset, so upset I would be shaking and I was not.

I just said to God; you see what I have to deal with? While he was gone I just went on with what I was doing and its almost as if it didn't matter, I felt detached. He came home with a bag of the chocolate I like and I didn't say anything. The day has gone on as usual but I haven't tried to talk to him. He has no class and what he did and said was uncalled for. Its only the coffee pot!

I prayed and read this morning as if nothing had happened and this is not something I would normally do if we had gotten into an argument. I have no feeling towards him whatsoever. I made dinner and even gave him an ice cream sundy because I was making myself one but I haven't watched tv with him or said much of anything to him and neither has he although he acts like it didn't happen.

The hold he had on me is gone. He used to upset me and hurt me and now I don't feel that at all.He was acting like a child and I don't want to sit her and analyze why he was acting that way, like I would normally do. I don't care why he acted that way; just that he did and I don't have to put up with it. I'm not some frightened miss who is going to walk on eggshells around him.

I'm not angry with him, I just don't want to think about him and what happened. He was acting childish and it feels good to not be upset about this and get angry. I simply don't care. Marriage is pointless to me right now because I won't live with a man who cusses like that for no reason and expects me to just sit there. He told me I should have just let it go. I told him I wasn't going to sit there while he cussed and carried on.

Sometimes I don't think he knows me at all. Anyway, thought I'd tell you about what happened because I cannot deal with this kind of behavior and over something so small. He'd gone for a walk and I know he thought about it and came home with the candy but I'm weary with this. We've been getting alone and now this?

It no longer matters.I have things to do and I can't stop and make this petulant child feel better. I'm not his mother.

1aokgal, I forgot your email. Mine is janlestat@gmail if you wish to talk to me off this post. Thank you for the compliment on the village. My friend Mickey bought me about 4 of them at Michael's craft shop. I used to paint statuary all the time and I'd go to statuary shops but I can't find them anymore so I go to this craft shop which is just around the corner. I used to paint all kinds of statuary and had been doing it since I was 19.

Now I just do the houses and the little decorations because the craft store doesn't have a big collection of statuary.I found one on line but haven't ordered any. I used to have this goal that I wanted to open my own statuary shop and teach classes to show people how to paint things, but I could never find the people who actually made the molds and I didn't even know what they were called so I gave up that dream.

I am especially good at intricate work and enjoy it very much and I realized how much I missed doing it.

chosen
29th November 2011, 04:53 AM
Well if you arent going to marry him then why keep him in hope?Maybe you just need to leave and get it over with and allow both of you to make a new life as single people. At the moment its a sort of half life in limbo and neither of you can move on. Does he even know that you are thinking of ending this relationship?

1aokgal
29th November 2011, 05:59 AM
Does it seem to you like "he is kept in hope?" It seems to me he is a selfish man who knows he has the power in the household with some income which he doles out for needed items there, when he is in a mood or dosen't spend it in the bar. He meets his own sexual needs (one way or the other) and leaves her to think, what she will, about that. When she confronts him about it, he gets nasty.

The man he is doesn't care about marriage or he would have made that move long ago. It seems to me the romance is dead on both ends. Move? She would, if she could. She has some news on her disability in January.

Her funds pay for the groceries since he couldn't bear to give up his cable TV stations for so long. It seems he needed her funds. It would never be a marriage made in heaven. It also lacks what a marriage should have ...intimacy. She is still young enough to appreciate a good sexual afternoon. Should she kiss that goodbye for him?
Would you?

Something has to change as......his behavior, his lack of intimacy and brutish bad temper in the morning.

Baroness
29th November 2011, 06:05 PM
I have to agree with 1aokgal, Chosen. Have you forgotten my financial status? And keeping him hoping? For what? He treats me like a roomate and nothing more. I am the one who goes to hug him or kiss him and now there isn't even that. He has always been rather secretive about things, mainly money.

The other day I found his 'stash' in the closet. $300 and I already know he spent a hundred dollars last week on the van for things it didn't even need. That's a total of $400. He gave me thirteen dollars the other day and its getting to the end of the month so I don't have very much in the freezer and just doing the best I can and yet he can't help out?

I know he's saving that money for fixing the van and the reason he isn't using it to fix the van right now is because he couldn't explain it to me. He's been taking his drill and other tools out of the house and I haven't asked him what he's doing like I usually do and he has not told me either. If I don't ask then he will offer no explanation.

I heard him tell my brother about the parts for the van he bought and I think I said he looked at me kind of expectantly like he was expecting me to say I didn't know he did those things but I didn't say anything so now he's having a field day. He doesn't have to explain anything because I'm not asking. Great.

I know he gets almost $300 from his attorney, which I am also not allowed to ask about, but that doesn't account for the extra money. I don't know where it is coming from because 2 weeks ago he was upset about the cable bill and had to pawn his banjo and now he's been in a good mood and isn't stressed at all and I think its because he got money from somewhere.

Perhaps the attorney settled the whole account and we're talking about a lot of money from his settlement, which we've been waiting for for a long time and I wouldn't put it past him to keep this from me. He's been looking at new car ads on the tv and asked me to find out how much a brand new ranger costs. When he paid attention to me on Thanksgiving I thought it was because He was trying in this relationship.

Now I realize it could be nothing more than he got money and was in a good mood. How can anyone do this to their mate? He knows i'm worried about money and going to my moms for christmas. Yet he is willing to let me think that he might not be able to fix the van. Not letting me know about the money is a cruel thing and this isn't the first time he's done this.

A few days ago I commented on running out of this and that and he makes no comments. He gave me the $13 and that was it. He came home just now with another tool box and went into the closet. He looked at me and smiled and asked how I was doing today. I said fine and he said good and now he's watching tv again. I never watch tv anymore.

Usually he will buy a few things at the end of the money to get us thru because $200 for food doesn't last the whole month but he isn't doing that this time and I'm almost out of everything. I don't understand how someone could get money and not want to tell their partner that they got it and now they don't have to worry about finances.

So I was sitting in the front room this morning talking to God and I feel nothing for this man I loved before. Of course I'm not positive that all the love is gone but when I think of him I just don't want to be around him because of all the secrets and all the childish tantrums and the lack of trying in this relationship. I don't know how he can say he is with God.

Somehow he justifies this in his mind and someone he thinks God is okay with it. He tells himself and he's told me before that these things concerning his attorney have nothing to do with me and so he doesn't say anything. Before, when we didn't live together he would keep me updated on the attorney and now all of a sudden it has nothing to do with me?

But more than any of that; what really gets me is that he thinks I will stay with him because if I love him I will put up with anything and so he doens't have to marry me and doesn't have to make love to me and doesn't have to try at all and if I dare say anything then he plays the victim and accuses me of wanting the last word.

Boy, does he have the wrong woman. I am so thankful that I am not married to him. Then I would have to deal with a divorce. This is no way for any woman to live and to marry a man who continues to keep things from me and does whatever he wants and doesn't care what I think? And yet he has no problem questioning me about how much money I have and where i've been.

Having said that, I still think he is a nice man but I think he has deep rooted issues that make him like this. He has shared more with me that he used to but now I believe it will always be like this. I am very loving and understanding, but i'm not a complete idiot!

Baroness
29th November 2011, 06:24 PM
I can't believe this! I just told him I have to go get some milk so I can make scalloped potatoes tonight and he said we also need bread and maybe some butter and he gives me five dollars and then goes into the closet and gets out all the change he has and puts it on my desk, quarters, dimes and nickels.

What is this? He went back in the closet and I thought he was going to give me more but he didn't. Why couldn't he have given me ten dollars or twenty? He has it. But of course he doesn't know that I know he has it. Please tell me if i'm wrong about this. Should I just be grateful he gives me what he does? Or should I be outraged cause he doles money out to me like this.

And for those of you who would stick up for him at this point, I don't want to hear it.

Forever
29th November 2011, 07:51 PM
Tell him..."this is not enough money for the things we need...Is this all the money you have?"

See what he says...then say, "you do not have any other money anywhere else"?

See what he says...if he admits to having more, ask him why he does not contribute when it is obvious that there are immediate needs.

If he lies and says that is all he has, then you call him on it, he can accuse you of violating his privacy ect...


I would be outraged...if he were just hoarding if for himself or for something he wants to do....trouble is, once you reveal that you know about it...he can come up with a story about saving it for a "nobel purpose" or a "surprize" for you. Damned if you say something, damned if you dont.

chosen
30th November 2011, 12:21 AM
Baroness if you are really so unhappy and wont marry him, then maybe you need to make arrangements to move back to your mothers. Whats the point of carrying this on if you wont marry him? If you dont want him them set him free to make a new life. Set him free to maybe meet someone else who does want him. You can also then make a new life for yourself if that is what you really want.

If you had got married at the beginning, I do feel that you would have been under Gods blessing, and things may have been very different for you both. I know 2 couples who live/lived together where one is a believer and one isnt. They go from one disaster to another and cant understand why. I know why, its because they are out of Gods will. One has just left their partner because their other half refused to marry them, and she knows that God doesnt want her there any more.She has taken a very brave decision to leave because she still loves him.
Youre situation is different because your partner hasnt refused to marry you and is a believer, but if you know that you arent going to get married then leave. Why prolong the indecision any more?

1aokgal
30th November 2011, 12:37 AM
How about he keeps his money secret because he is CHEAP person?
He can use her resources for grocery money, and not his funds, so he has money to spend at the bar!

He was more interested to hold onto all the cable channels than whether she had enough for grocery money. Yes, that would be a marriage made in heaven, wouldn't it? Maybe she has to see the situation as it really is, not as she wishes it would be.

This is very sad for Baroness, and we just wish she could have happiness and security. It is easy to say "move on" here when we are secure, roof overhead, and don't sweat food money!

Baroness
30th November 2011, 06:47 AM
Chosen, we've already been over all this before. You are the one who told me to stay until God showed me what to do and do nothing and now you're saying to just move in with my mother whom already has my brother living with her and I don't appreciate you telling me different things all the time. Its very confusing.

I am not the one who doesn't want to marry. And I also never said I didn't want him and I don't think there's another woman who would put up with what I've had to. Its his secrecy that is the problem and believe me; marriage is the furthest thing from his mind. I was going to talk to him about it next year when I found out about my disability but now i'm wondering if God isn't showing me a different direction.

After all, if the van hadn't broken down then I would never have seen his stash of money cause he keeps all his paperwork in the van, but because it was here I happened to see it. I don't believe in coincidences, especially when you are asking God for a sign. Gabby does not want to marry me and I will have to tell him I can't stay with him.

I've done everything for him and yet he still feels he needs to hide things from me. I doubt very much you would like it if your husband hid things from you because then you would be wondering what else he was hiding from you? Its easy for you to tell me to just go to my mothers because you don't have to worry about a place to live or finances.

But not everyone has a husband who pays for everything, most of the time a couple works together to make ends meet. You have already stated on here that because of my finances, and back problems the best thing to do would be to remain here. I am not the bad guy here and I wish you would stop acting like he's a saint and i'm the one with the problem.

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth and its very confusing for someone who is trying to make a decision about her life. For you to suggest to me to just leave here and go to my mothers is a ridiculous thing to do. YOu may think its okay to go to your mothers even though she already has someone living there and doesn't really have the room, but I do not make it a habit of being a burden to people because I have always taken care of myself.

I know you wish everyone could get married and live happily ever after but that isn't always the way life is. There is no happily ever after and you should know that we have to put up with these men's problems. Whether we just accept it and pretend it isn't happening or not, is up to the person involved.

I'm not going to put up with lying and hiding things when I have been open and honest. Because he hasn't been I now suspect him of things that might not even be true but when someone hides and lies it gets to the point where you don't know what to believe anymore. I was always so trusting and if I had my suspicions about his behavior I didn't let it affect me because I loved him so much.

Can't you see that he is destroying anything we had? I loved him through years of neglect and years of him going to the bar after I had quit and years of being hurt and scenes like I told you about. I put up with it all because I loved him. Now I am tired of all this stress.

There is something wrong with him. He's had a woman for ten years who has treated him right and yet he treats me like i'm a stranger by the way he keeps things from me.No wonder I suspected him of cheating on me with another woman when this sex issue started. It was a natural conclusion and even now I don't think he is just because he told me he hasn't been with another woman since we met.

What makes you think that is the truth? If he can lie and have these secrets, what makes you think he can't cheat on me? It doesn't make sense because I've been good to him and I don't think he could find someone better than me or more understanding. When women live in denial they won't think about thier man cheating.

I don't live in denial but knowing him, I dont' think he's cheating on me but why does he not make an effort with me when he knows how much it means to me? And what will change if I do marry him? Then I'm stuck with a husband who shows no affection and then if I decide to leave later on, I have to get another divorce.

I asked God to show me what to do and he has shown me that I can't trust gabby. The signs have been there for years but I chose not to see them. I trusted God to deal with him but since this happened with the money and he doles out dollar bills and change to me, I came to the conclusion that this guy has no class or morals at all.

Why make a woman walk down to the store to put the coins in a machine so she can have money to but some stupid milk and bread? Even when the van was running and I had to go to the store, he would sit here and let me walk down to the store, knowing my back hurt and he could drive me, but made no offer to do so. I can't tell you how many times he's done that.

And yet a neighbor would come up and ask him to take him to get smokes and he would do it immediatley, but for me he bought a cart so I could go grocery shopping and put the groceries in the cart and push it home knowing full well it hurt my back but that is what I'm still doing. Because I don't want to be dependent on any man I do this even though it hurts my back.

The last time I did this I brought the cart full of groceries to the bottom of the stairs and he usually comes down and carries it up to our apartment but last time I had to carry them up myself because he said he didn't feel good and remained on the sofa. It would have only taken him a few minutes and unless he was having a heart attack at that precise moment, there is no excuse for that.

My back had already hurt from pushing the stupid thing and by the time I was done carrying the groceries up and then putting them away my back was in such bad shape I had to lie down. When I tell him my back hurts he has no comment to make and yet when he was flat on his back and I hardly knew him, I took care of him and waited on him hand and foot!

Even though he's treated me like this, I never held it against him because I have always fended for myself. But should I have to? Should I have to be shackled to a man who thinks of himself first? He knows how I felt about the no sex thing and he knows how I feel about marriage and he doesn't care how I feel.

He's selfish and maybe I shouldn't have moved in with him but perhaps it was a good idea because God forbid I was married to him and all this happened. Just because you're married doesn't mean your happy and it doesn't mean you are with the right person. It also doesn't mean you have to put up with anything the man dishes out because you are married to him.

Even after all I've said and all i've endured I still care for him and I don't hate him or anything. But if I'd treated him the way he's treated me he would have already walked out the door. I kind of just wonder; do you always stick up for the husband no matter what he does?

chosen
30th November 2011, 03:28 PM
baroness its you who keeps saying that you arent happy with him and that you arent going to put up with things he does and says. If that is the case then why stay?You do complain a lot about him, and he is just a human being and none of us are perfect. I do feel sad that he hasnt a clue that you feel this way or are thinking of leaving him.
I am not sure that you realise how powerful words are, and that the Bible says that we can tear down or build up with our words. If you want to see changes in him, then my advise is to speak only positive things about him and pray about the rest. Speak words from the Bible over him and his life every day.
A close friend of mine used to always be complaining about her husband to other people(and he IS a difficult man) and God really told her off one day and said "how dare you judge and not forgive your husband when I have forgiven you and dont judge you. You extend to your husband the same forgiveness and mercy that I have extended to you" She was suitably chastened, stopped complaining, and she has seen big changes not only in her attitiude to him, but in him as well. She is VERY careful what she says about him now.

As I said before, God cant bless the relationship as it is. If you get married He can. but if you wont marry him then what alternative is there but to seperate? At the moment you seem to only be staying because you cant go back to your mothers. I do think you need to tell him all of this so that it isnt such a terrible shock one day when you leave. He is living with you thinking that you will always be together. Is that fair?

I can just see this blowing to and fro continuing indefinately unless you either make that decision to leave or get married.

Yes I do think that we should always stick up for our husbands no matter what, unless he is seriously abusive or cheating or similar, but the thing is that he isnt your husband. If he were I would never be advising you to even consider seperating. If everyone left their spouse just because they did things that the other didnt like, practically no one would be married. It is for better and for worse when you make those promises.

Divorce should always be a last resort for really serious issues, not for those who are a bit fed up with what their spouse is doing or how they are acting.

Forever
30th November 2011, 05:00 PM
Hi Chosen,
She stays because she has no way to leave...NO MONEY...NO FAMILY OR FRIENDS HOUSE TO GO TO...NO JOB...NOT EVEN A CAR TO SLEEP IN....NOTHNG.

Shall she pack a bag and walk through the streets aimlessly in circles?

She is waiting on God to open a door for her so she CAN leave. God has not done that yet....so she is STUCK right where she is.

It is probably a good thing...because while she is waiting for God to arrange for a way for her to get out of there, her decision will become solidified in what she wants. By the time she can leave, she will be more certain about whether or not she would even want to marry him if he suddenly asks her to.

Chosen...she cant leave yet...unless she walks to a homeless shelter. Do you think God would want her to do that?

1aokgal
30th November 2011, 05:56 PM
What I hate to see here is that there seems a lack of support for Baroness in the position she finds herself at this time! It is
SO easy to say.."Leave, go to your mothers." We don't know if her mother can carry another person living in her house, since she lives on social security herself. What happens to post 50 women who can't work? If she CAN work, can she find a job now? Probably not.

Chosen, you have a paycheck (from your husband), and a secure place to live. When you need groceries you have more than loose change and $13 to shop, because your husband is a man who sees that need is met. I guess you were never homeless? I was homeless for a time and at least, had a car to get to a place to sleep for the night. Baroness finds herself in a terrible situation and invested 10 years of her life with a man who has rejected her as a woman and she is dependent on him now until her disability is determined or she can find a job and make her way with a health problem. She needs some encouragement and not criticism. She needs lots of love right here from those who can help her think out the options. She needs Gods' help and help here.

I was once married to a man I had to chase down to the bar. He was there to play pool with friends. I asked him (begged him) for grocery money because there were two little kids. I had no transportation or job at that time. He threw $20 on the pool table in front of his friends to make himself look good. He told me not to spend it all in one place! We were then separated, and he left because I asked him to leave so he moved in with the barmaid where he spent much of his time. I had to go through the courts to assure basic child support. That is history, and behind..but it is a similar time to what is happening with this lady. Such things leave indelible scars for the moments we survive failed relationships and get to the better moments. It was those memories that made me the survivor who would never depend on another again.

This lady will likely leave this relationship behind, as she is able to do. Gabby morally owes her help for the 10 years she invested in him. He sold her a bill of goods. She believed they were partners in life. She moved in with him with that expectation of marriage and happy life. Right now, life is ashes. There is sadness that she has been rejected as a woman. There is personal shame she did the wrong thing to live with him without marriage. It is not for nothing our mothers told us, "Why buy the cow if you can get the milk free?" Such living arrangements seldom end in marriage and are always a mistake for the woman involved. It is true neither of them are happy in the limbo of a relationship gone sour.

Let's not be superior people who tell her how wrong she was or tell her to put herself in a worse situation or move into the street! She should have the best holiday she can with this man. B should let him know her feelings (which he doesn't care anyway how she feels) and see if January brings her help on that disability. She should continue to get as many job apps out there, as possible. She needs a job where she doesn't have to stand on her feet as customer service or computer data entry. She is computer savvy so that helps for a job that pays better than a clerk. She also lacks transportation so that means she is locked into finding something on a bus route or to manage to find a way to get to work. I was in that same situation with children many years ago.

Certainly, it is not easy to find a job in December or in this economic climate. Regardless of what we claim, there IS problem with women over 50 out there.

I once owned a personnel agency so I secured job seekers and scheduled the interviews based on hiring criteria set by the employer. Many times I heard FB they preferred a more youthful or fashionable applicant for an opening. My job was to help the applicant get the job. It could mean a suggestion she change her hair color or attire to get it. We both scored on a job for her if I could market her skills to fit the opening. I once loaned a fashionable suit to a lady so she would get the job.

There are reasons companies prefer younger, as health insurance claims and the ability to physically perform a demanding job. So women with good job experience still find it difficult to score over younger applicants. The employer knows he has to pay an experienced worker more than a trainee. Right now, at the end of the year, most companies have a freeze on hiring for the new year budget. These are hard times. So if she can sell her hats or get out the applications, that is best to do until January. Then, she needs to perhaps move to the mothers' or relatives home if that can be worked out with them. Some move needs to happen soon.

Baroness can't stay where she is now. She knows that. Marriage is off the blackboard.
Personally, I think she stands at a step that is difficult but where she may find a better life in time. I wish her the best and hope she has the courage to make good decisions. Gabby might realize he lost a good thing and try to mend the relationship. I think she is better to write finish on this chapter but it is a difficult position to be in when one has to start over.

1aokgal
30th November 2011, 06:16 PM
There are no places in homeless shelters in the US but on "reserved ahead " 3 day stay. That is reserved for women with children. There are women out there sleeping in doorways. Welcome to the real world to those of us who are secure!

Some churches offer a cot for a night and a meal at a soup kitchen. That is the world out there. Lets' try to help her with options better than that.

Baroness
30th November 2011, 08:11 PM
Chosen, you totally ignored what I said about how he treats me.I don't have to go to any homeless shelter, of all things. I have friends and family who would never let that happen and neither would God.I am choosing to stay here because I still have an open mind about God dealing with the situation and also opening a door.

I want you to stop telling me to leave and stop ignoring the facts and continually saying the same things. You do not know gabby and you don't know me and so I am asking you nicely to quit trying to 'fix' me and the situation. All you are doing is upsetting me and I don't feel that you have my best interests at heart.

I feel that 1aokgal does; she has shown me that she cares. She overlooked my harsh words in the past and came back to this post and she says positive things to me and doesn't tell me to just walk out on the street. What made you think I would ever do such a thing? I am not alone in this world but it isn't up to you to tell me when to go to my mothers or anywhere else.I am a grown woman and don't need to be told what to do.

Frankly,I find you very closed minded in regards to men in general and I poured out my heart in my last post and told you how he made me carry the groceries. You never address the things I tell you about him and just say I complain about him. Maybe you think its okay for your man to lie and hide things from you and not sleep with you or even bring up marriage to you; but I don't.

I am making the best of the situation and I am still waiting for God to show me what to do. And if he is shocked when I tell him I'm leaving then he only has himself to blame for not trying in this relationship and continually keeping things from me and letting me think one thing when its really another thing. We are getting along today and had a conversation this morning but I am not going to tell him any of the things you told me.

I'm trying to figure out where you get the nerve to tell me what to do. Yes,I do talk about him a lot because I came on here for that purpose; to see if anyone else was going through the same thing. I notice that you never talk about your husband or your own life very much. We don't really know all that much about you, just that you like to tell other people what to do and how to live.

How are we supposed to trust you when you never share your own experiences and I think that is kind of one sided. I want you to stop trying to manage my life, it is my life and God will show me what to do and when you said the part about words can damage, that's exactly what I'm trying to tell you.Your words are upsetting me, you are not helping me or this situation.

I decided to just do the best I can here with gabby, and if God wants to do a miracle then fine, if not then he will show me a better life. You say its up to God and not to make a move but you are constantly telling me what to do. I am not angry at him and it is just the same as before.Perhaps God wants him to address these things in his life and perhaps gabby will always be like this.

If God opens the door and I leave I will not leave angrily and gabby and I will remain friends. That's what we are now. No, he does not think I am going to leave him because he thinks he has me right where he wants me, helpless and unable to support myself so I have to stay here. However; he is not an unkind man and if anyone thinks so, that is not the case. Just selfish but is capable of great kindness.

I will still try in this relationship until God tells me otherwise but I do not intend to take any more unfair treatment.

Forever, thank you for what you have been saying. I do appreciate it and you do help me with your postings. I have always thought that a man will do whatever you let him get away with.I have not drawn specific lines in this relationship and just let him do whatever he wanted with no complaints at all and perhaps I shouldn't have done that.

Of course it is not all his fault. He's had a hard time in his life, haven't we all, and I make allowances for that but some things are not right to do and he knows that. He will either shape up and deal with his issues or God will take me out of this home. I have a good family and they would never let me go out on the street; we would make it somehow.

Thank you and God bless you.

Also thanks to 1aokgal, you are a great comfort to me and I appreciate you still being my friend. Its hard not to complain when things go wrong, isn't it? I know you can probably understand what I mean because you have been through a lot of the things I am now going through but you have never told me what to do, but offered advice and respected me as a woman who is just going through a hard time.

It is not my intention to argue on here you all of you might have noticed that I am not jumping into defensiveness or being angry or saying, 'How dare you speak to me like that'. No, I am calmer and think before I speak now but that doesn't mean I should just accept negative advice from anyone and just say nothing.

I have come a long way with God's help and I'm not going to let one poster discourage me or make me feel bad. God has everything under control and I think that if someone isn't helping people with what she says, then she shouldn't offer any advice at all. Christians do not act that way and talk like that, and I should know, I've been a christian since I was ten years old.

What does the Bible say? 'Judge not, lest ye be judged'.

Chamomile
30th November 2011, 08:35 PM
It is not my intention to argue on here you all of you might have noticed that I am not jumping into defensiveness or being angry or saying, 'How dare you speak to me like that'. No, I am calmer and think before I speak now but that doesn't mean I should just accept negative advice from anyone and just say nothing.

I think that if someone isn't helping people with what she says, then she shouldn't offer any advice at all. Christians do not act that way and talk like that, and I should know, I've been a christian since I was ten years old.

What does the Bible say? 'Judge not, lest ye be judged'.

Hi Baroness

I don't think you're the first receiving end of Chosen's "Judegment" on other ppl. Sometimes, it does make me wonder if she enjoys creating an argument to entertain herself. I wonder if she thinks she's God herself :confused:

If you're upset about her post, you should speak to Dave, the site owner.
You shouldn't put up with any nonsense from other posters!!

xx

Baroness
1st December 2011, 01:47 AM
Thanks, Chamomile. I don't mind getting advice but not if its going to upset me and certainly not when the same thing is repeated over and over again. I have done my best to explain the situation and the last thing I need to to feel even more worse than I do. I am ready to just deal with things here and move on.

He is finding that I'm not such an easy target anymore. Its all about respect and if you give it, you should receive it and he is discovering that he isn't going to get it if he doesn't respect me. He has always been very respectful but every once in awhile he tries to get away with stuff and so then we go through this. Of course I don't have to put up with it but have decided to stay here until I can get a place or my own or he makes an effort to change.

I do believe God can change a person but not if they refuse, he can't make anyone change and overall he isn't that bad, he just has deep rooted issues about keeping things to himself but I have brushed it aside and decided not to dwell on it and concentrate on my life and what makes me happy. If he wants to be part of my life then he's going to have to change the way he thinks and responds.

I am not an un-understanding person. I realize people have issues but I think i've been pretty understand in all these years but I am not perfect of course. In the end I have to do what I feel is right for me. God weighs into that decision but sometimes he wants us to figure out things for ourselves through common sense.

It would be nice if God could call me or email me but that isn't going to happen so we have to make decisions on what we believe is right. I haven't been unkind to this man and I could have just left him hanging and that's something I would have done before. He can't afford to live here without my help, I don't think.

I think that 1aokgal is pretty terrific considering everything she's told us about what she's gone through in her life and I take courage from that. It helps to know that other women have gone through similar things that I have.

1aokgal, I have great news. I stopped in and told the manager of our apts. that I sold that hat she saw me wearing the other day and she was so happy and said she loved vintage hats and clothes and sometimes she has vintage clothes but not the hat to go with it. Then she said they were going to have a craft sale Dec. 6th in the community room and wants me to bring my hats down there and sell them.

She's very excited and when I do this I can take my business cards down and offer to be available to make hats to their specifications, like taking orders for hats. Custom made, is what I'm trying to say. I'm kind of excited about it myself.

1aokgal
1st December 2011, 03:09 AM
Dear Baroness..

Oh, I am delighted to hear you struck a positive note with someone on your hats. Good work!

You realize that hats are in full vogue now, especially with black women who wear the most beautiful and expensive custom hats. They call them, "church hats"now. Then there are the re-inactor victorian/civil war community of dressed women who have events and clubs. They will pay $200-400 for a great authentic designed hat in lavish fabrics as silk, velvet with real plumes. One milliner from Calif. has back orders for months for these creations. Everyone in this industry knows her great hats. I have one of hers and it is a beauty.

These ladies have great sales and are so successful they go to the "Somewhere in Time" week in Michigan. They plan their Titanic era costumes all year. That event is where the hats are so fabulous they look straight out of the Titanic movie. A wealthy customer/penpal of mine goes each year and her wardrobe costs her thousands for this event. She is always in the market for a great hat.

That craft show is a great beginning for you to reach those interested in your hats. The more you craft, the better the product result. The joy is in the creation and the reward is to realize you hit on something you like to do, and others value your creations. You found your market. Good work! I have some great photos to send in a day or so, as I try now to ready packages to ship for Xmas.

I talked some about my background and it is one where I had little opportunity and no resources after a too young failed marriage. Sometimes I can't stand to recall those painful memories of being in a situation where I felt trapped and alone. The options seemed few. My family members did well, but were not ones I could ask for help. I felt they judged me for the poverty and my helplessness with little education or skills. I was ashamed of having nothing. I hated to ask anyone for help. I expose this history here, so others can see these tough times pass. These times are an opportunity to learn how we overcome hardships and obstacles.

Sometimes we feel no one cares. We sometimes consider it might be better just to give up. It is hard to even care about ourselves, when a box of laundry detergent is a luxery. We wonder how we can make it day to day.

Years ago, I used the social system to support myself and the kids for awhile. Then I discovered there were programs to obtain a university degree combined with work programs through outreach services. There were possibilities to change my life, but it meant a lot of work and innovation to trade childcare and transportation to make it work. It took a great belief to put that into motion. It was hard to see ahead when one can lose belief they have value or even the ability to succeed. There are many who tell you that you can't do it. They will ask why would you want to do it. Some people may even hope you fail.

This past means I will never feel absolutely secure in anything I achieve. I will always be afraid I could be homeless or hungry again. No amount of "safe" washes away "unsafe" feelings. Maybe that is why I think as I do. It is why I save so carefully, and cut coupons and plan everything ahead. It is why I luxuriate in the time I have to be creative, when all my life was to work two jobs or worry. It was funny to hear someone here describe me as "materialistic." Yes, that same lady who knows so much about so many things.

My daughter brought me over several things she bought for me today. One, a soup ladle, and another, was a bag of plastic clothespins to pin bag tops. I spend on nothing non-essential. She laughed at me the other day. I said I had no soup ladle for 20 years, so wouldn't buy one now. I just use a cup for sauces. I push down fold bag tops. She pins all her open bag tops with plastic clothes pins. She has the latest in kitchen tools. She has an electric chopper. I just chop my onions the way I always have. It is a generational thing. Young people today think they must have it all!

Yesterday, I gave her $100 bill so she could buy a great new lighted xmas tree...that was half the price she needed to pay for a really nice one. She sent me a photo of her new tree on facebook.
Today she brought me over a new soup ladle and then plastic pins for my bags of chips, noodles, etc. Does she realize I will always think "deprived?" Perhaps, as she sees me "make do" but give to her instead, she does.

Yes, baroness, I AM you in some ways! I understand your fear of the future. I feel your pain, that all you put in there seems lost. I live your trials as you go through the days when you wonder how you move ahead. The world seems quite hostile, doesn't it?

I hope you understand my relating this personal stuff is not just about you. It is so others can see themselves when they wonder how they pick up and move on when things are so tough. Sometimes it is hard to visualize a road ahead. As women, we know we are somewhat captive to the love we have given to another.

I'm glad to offer you some help with the creations. The suggestion with the hatmaking seemed a natural. Since you have creative interest and talent..there are many things you can do to earn income while you wait for a regular job. When all you have is some time and some good ideas, you can do a lot with little in materials with these hats. The market out there is incredible. Good luck!

1aokgal
1st December 2011, 05:28 PM
It sounds as if Chosen is frustrated that her directives aren't being acted upon? Thats' life. We can advise others what we think they might do in a situation. We can suggest workable options. It is not our place to dictate how they should live or how they might choose to accept the opinions that well wishers put out there.

We are coming from our own life experiences. Some here had some career training to assist others with social issues. The last I heard, there are no trained social workers here. I did internship with clients in a mental health setting or counselling and observed some human nature up close. It can be extremely frustrating for a helper to internalize that all people have the right to self determination. We can't live it for them. Many will choose to go another direction, and that is their right to do it. We don't have all the information and we don't live in their space. All we can do is give them encouragement and support to assist the decisions. It is a complement that we have been asked what we think and for our advice.

We can hope they don't get hurt when they choose to go in another direction. When one says "Baroness needs to decide what to do, or she will still be here in 10 years time still undecided and still blown back and forth" sounds quite pompous to me . It seems uncharitable and shows little respect to suggest this lady is not an intelligent person with free choice. She will make the best decision...for her. It is not about us, and our need to be right.

Helen_uk
1st December 2011, 05:45 PM
To be honest, I read it that Baroness is hoping for some direction from God and I don't think God works to a timetable .

I think Baroness is doing her best under very difficult circumstances and trying to make sense of it all.

It's always easy to sit on the outside of a situation and say " you should do this , or that " . Being in that situation is a whole different ball game.

Chamomile
2nd December 2011, 12:41 PM
I hope she returns as well. beenthere should share her other ideas as to how her marriage has lasted so many years. We all want to be a community here, though we sometimes differ sharply.

You are such a neat person, Chamomile. How I would love a trip to London with you to go to tea! I bought some beautiful dishes last month that I admired for about five years. That wonderful Ebay had a good buy on service for four.

If you were here in US, you would always have an invite to test them out with goodies and tea! Have a great day. :-)

(((((1AOKGAL)))))xoxoxox You're such a Delightful lady!! :) Your presence on here makes a huge difference to so many ppl. Thank you for your kind words. Hugs :):):)

1aokgal
2nd December 2011, 05:23 PM
Chamomile, Sweetie, you are always gracious and I love your level headed response to those in trouble here on this forum! xoxoxoxo Thanks for your kind response!

We all value the posters and want to believe that the input we give here helps another gain clarity in some difficult situation. Sometimes I have been guilty to lack tact in getting across a point. Live and learn!

Hope you are well!