Married 5 months and now wife wants a divorce

[LT83]

I have been a reader on this forum for about a month now and a few days ago I had to vent to someone. I didnt find anyone around who could give me a fresh perspective on things.

I wrote all this down in another thread (Sorry Dave for hijacking) but I'll copy it in here.

I'm just really confused and can't beleive this could happen to me.

[LT83]

im new here so some support is much needed please.

Im going through a pretty similar situation. I pretty much worshipped my wife, i loved her and cared for her and was a rock for her.

She left without even discussing the issues with me. I dont even know what i did wrong.

there is a lot of detail to this but i just spent an hour on the phone with my father in law, not a successful conversation, so im in a bit of a state.

I'll have to fill in all the details tomorrow or later tonight. This one is a real heartbreaker.

[LT83]

I'm a 25yr old trainee solicitor and the W is 22. Yes we are both relatively young but we thought we were ready. This situation is further clouded by cultural and religious issues which have some relevance in the matter (both of us being of Moroccan ethnicity and of Muslim faith)

We've been together for about 3 1/2 years and for that time I dedicated my life to her. Everything I did I would have her in mind. She was studying and I would go and see her every weekend. She was always excited to see me. I could always tell because she had this beautiful beaming smile across her face. I knew that money was gonna be an issue for her at uni so I tried to support her financially, giving her 30/40 pounds a week. I'd take the money out of my pocket even when I didnt have anything for myself. I didnt see it as a problem, I just wasnt gonna let her go without. Academically I supported her helping her with everyone of her dissetations and projects. And ofcourse the emotional stress that she couldnt deal with of being so close to the finish line and not having finished yet. I encouraged her and motivated her and did everything I could do to help.

Our families generally had a good relationship, there were one or two fallouts but to the end they were still sitting with each other and chatting and even doing business together.

Our wedding was huge. It was the most extravagant thing i'd seen (thats how we moroccans do it) But from the moment we got married, it seemed like things started slowly and gradually going down hill and I was the only one pushing for it to be right.

For me this whole situation began about 3 months ago (After being married for 3 months). the W was working hard as she always does in the school but unfortunately struggling with life in london (her being from the midlands). I think that ultimately the move away from family, the new situation, the stress of her first job and a whole host of issues made her depressed.

She started to become less active and more focussed on her paperwork. I was always there to give her assistance with papers and sticking and cutting out stuff. If only to help her finish sooner and relax more. At some point it felt like she was showing no interest in me as she would often come in from work and sit on the pc on face book or msn and chat away to friends and family. We spoke about this a few times but nothing really changed. Even though, i still loved her and wanted to be with her. I even spoke to her parents about it because i was so worried about her health, as she started to get ill.

They said to me give her time and support her, she is just homesick and will get used to it. So i continued to try and make her as comfortable as possible. Making food, cleaning the house, foot massages, back rubs, when she was ill i would wake up at 4 am to be beside her and bring her water or hold her hand, when she woke up to work 6.30 i would get up just to see her off or travel into work some 2 hrs early so i could keep her company. Everything i could do i would do if only to make her 1% more comfortable.

We had a few minor problems along the way but nothing that was raised again. Then i was made redundant out of the blue. It was a big shock as i didnt expect it. I asked the W not to say anything to anyone because i needed to get back on the horse before i could feel confident in myself. I asked her again not to say anything just yet. A few days later as i sat next to her i noticed a message from her mum to her on msn asking if i had found a new job and that i should look outside london. The Wl tried to hide it and i got really angryt because she had betrayed my trust and lied to me. My W is not the kind of person to do that and that is why i was so shocked. Even so, that same day i told her i had forgiven her and i would forget about it.

From then on every night she would end up in tears because she wanted to move out of london. I told her that we would move out of london as soon as i'd qualified. That way we could afford a nice house in a nice area that was big enough for our future family. I even said that we could move halfway between london and the midlands. But she said that she wouldn't be happy unless she lived in near her parents. She wanted to be close to your parents so they could help her with things. I told her that if we were halfway both our families would only be half an hour away by car and that would make life easier. She thought that me suggesting a car as something that would help was an attempt to belittle her concerns. She wanted me to promise her that we would move to the midlands. But for the time being we had a 12month tenancy and I needed to find a training contract with decent pay, unfortunatly i was gonna get that in the midlands any time soon.

She later went on a weekend retreat organised by the headteacher of the school. i had hoped that her weekend away at the health spa would help calm her down. i was worried about her. That weekend she called her parents and told them she wanted to come back home. I told her that i would support her if she wanted to go and spend time with them but we needed to be strong together. I discussed this problem with her mum and dad trying to find a solution and they both agreed that i should just support her and give her time.

At the end of the week she should come up to her parents and spend some time with her family. I was happy for her to do this and was content she was going to be with family. On the friday night i spoke to her parents and informed them i thought it was best that she have space and time to relax. Her mum tried to convince me to come up on the saturday but I said that we agreed that she should have time without any pressure to relax. I think the message she got was a different one, this somehow got translated as "i'm not gonna chase her around like an idiot". I dont know how that occurred but thats what she believes i said. She stayed in wthe midlands and i thought she would come home on the monday night so i went off to an interview and then to prepare a romantic evening for the two of us. While i was out she called me and said she went to the flat and picked up her clothes and was going back to her parents as she needed more time to think about things. She had seen a gp and a counselor and decided she needed to be selfish and think of her own needs. I was gobsmacked! I had to give her time and though i wanted at least to see her to discuss things i accepted her request. I told her that being selfish was not the way forward. No one ever became happy by being selfish. Love and marriage is about selflessness and sacrifice and making the one you love happy, that is where happiness comes from.

That evening i spoke to her dad and he advised me that i should speak to my parents as i may need the support. I didnt think the situation warranted it but i did. My parents called her parents to talk and try and resolve the issue (this is customary our religion and culture). It became clear that they didn't know what the problem was either, admittedly other than the things i had already said i didn't know either. Just that it was deeper than i originally thought. My mum offered to drive up the next morning with me and discuss the problem and hopefully bring her home. The W texted me saying to tell my mum not to come as she was not gonna be intimidated into coming back. It was clear that was not the intention of my mum's offer. The W even texted my mum telling her to stay out of it and that this situation was between m and her. This was very impolite and uncalled for (we had always been very respectful to each others parents and family) especially as she'd already asked me to speak to my mum and tell her not to come. I couldn't believe what was unfolding in front of me.

Cont..

[LT83]

Regardless I reluctantly agreed to give her more time. The week passed and I got a phone call from her "please can you transfer the money I put in the savings account, I dont have any money and I need that money to support myself". Again I kept pleading for her to tell me what was wrong and what I had done, but she keept saying she wasnt going into that situation and i know what was wrong.

I was hopeful that she would be back by the weekend but saturday came and I got a phonecall. She said she went to the flat and I wasnt there so she collected the rest of her things and took them back to her parents. She had seen a consellor and a solicitor and decided she didnt want to go back into this situation again. I was in tears and I couldnt believe it. She started citing differences with my parents and family and said that I hadnt prioritised her. I was completely shocked. I only had her as my priority. and my family loved her to pieces and that love was evident through gifts and clothes and just the effort they had gone to to make the wedding happen the way it did. My mum even cried because she couldnt believe that my W, who she treated like a daughter, would say those things about her.

She asked me to be civil about all this and she wanted to talk as friends but being able to talk and not get emotional was too difficult for me. I sat and I cried and I cried. For 10 minutes, it was the longest 10 minutes of my life. I wailed and balled my eyes out. I had not cried in the past 5 years (even when I wanted to). All my friends were in shock when they found out. They saw us and how happy we both were and this was completely out of the blue. I sent her flowers and gifts but she told me to stop wasting my money. She would ask me for favours which I would comply with in the hope that she would see how I felt for her. My friends were very supportive and made me see something that I hadnt seen.

I would recite to them the whole story and the little events and all the little gestures i had done for her. my friend asked me, "what did she do for you?" and I could answer. I couldnt think of anything. In our final two months of being together I didnt even sleep with her, we're newly weds for gods sake! She kept coming up with excuses like im tired, depressed or ill and me being me didnt want to pressure her. I wanted to make her happy but it looked like i was teh only one trying. There wasnt anyone else in the picture, just that she felt my family didnt like her (which was not true) and that I had not prioritised her (again which was not true).

I'd lost all dignity and self respect at this point in trying to get her back, even in speaking to her father to try and help, but he said he couldnt get involved. He said to me that I was the best son in law that a father could wish for but this was her choice.

I went to morocco for a week over new year, it was supposed to be a surprise for her but I never got the chance to tell her. As the weeks past my feelings started to change from sorrow to anger.

When I dont talk about it i get depressed and miss her but when I do talk about it I get angry and annoyed as to how she could treat me like this after all the things I done for her.

I was her first, her first love her first kiss her first experience. I had been there for her every step of her adult life. there wasnt a single night when i didnt speak to her and tell her that i loved her in 3 and 1/2 years. It doesnt sound like long and i've been in a longer relationship but this one was going so well.

She has refused to see me and or sit down with a consellor with me. She has decided she has made her mind up and that is that. Sometimes I feel used and taken advantage of.

I havnt spoken to her since i got back last week but she sent me an email asking me if she could have the deposit for the flat because she needed to pay it back to a family friend. I havnt replied. I get the feeling she has changed her number too, i know she has blocked me on her internet messenger.

The things I have to look forward to starting a new job next week, I passed my theory test (yes long overdue) and I've met a lot of new people who have been very supportive.

Its been a very short time since all this start (4 weeks) and part of me wants to be patient for her to come back. Another part of me thinks that she will come back and I will be stuck doing everything again and there will be no effort from her. and a third part of me just wants to move on and find someone to treat me with the love and affection that she couldnt show me.

I feel only after 4 weeks im getting closer to the crossroads and will have to make a decision soon.

[LT83]

I wanted to say thanks for those of you that posted on Dave123's thread. Hopefully I can show the same progression as he seems to have shown.

[Ageing Grace]

Hi, LT83. Thank you for starting your own thread.

I read your posts in Dave123's thread, and felt hurt on your behalf. Your distress comes through clearly, and you have certainly not done anything to deserve the pain you're feeling.

As Raymond said, it sounds as though your wife is basically too young /immature to have married anybody, even one who loves her as much as you do. You know, from reading these forums, that to "be married" is actually a major choice that each partner needs the other to make.

Getting married, however glorious your wedding, doesn't create a marriage. Choosing to live side by side; to share one another's good times & bad; get to know your partner better than you know anyone else; to do all the boring routines of life together as well as the sex, cuddles and fun stuff .... It's a daunting prospect. Many adults much older and more experienced than your wife find themselves shocked by the reality of marriage. We aren't well prepared for it. Even these days, the happy ending in films is where the couple walk up the aisle together - not where they finally figure out their supermarket routine, 18 months after the wedding!!

Your wife is young. She's very close with her family, so she's always been surrounded by love & support from those she has known all her life: this, she can comfortably take for granted. I'm sure she was in love with you when you wed, but it's quite likely she was living out her 'happy ending' there & then ... with little thought for how life would be when YOU became her closest relation. She would, quite likely, have somehow expected you to know her as well as her Mum does, and to provide the kind of automatic comfort, 24/7, that a cherished child enjoys.

Of course, this kind of love is far from effortless - something your wife will find out when she becomes a mother! But the fact remains that, like a child, she expects unbroken comfort and couldn't cope when something went wrong.

You must have understood this aspect of your wife, because you moved heaven & earth to make life easy for her. You did things for her that, really, only a child should expect - the help with her essays, her class preparation and numerous other favours you mentioned. You tried to protect her from having to take responsibility for her self (or even her career). You did it very thoroughly, by your account, but of course it was never quite enough. How could it be? You are not her entire family rolled into one.

It must have entered your mind, sometimes, to wonder what would happen if you became ill or had an accident. Who would have taken care of your little girl then ... and who would take care of you?

You weren't partners in life, you were big brother & baby sister :(

As to where you go from here: It seems plain that she isn't ready to leave her family yet. I realise how painful this fact must be for you, but she couldn't have made it much clearer. You can try to work with her family, with the aim of moving to a street near her home so she can live with you but see them all the time. It is, after all, a traditional arrangement in every culture. Only you know whether it's a kind of life you could be happy with.

If it is not, I'm afraid you must bravely take your medicine (as if you haven't had enough!). Accept that you married a girl who didn't think like a woman; forget about the weirdness going on in her own head - she has her family to help her; she doesn't need you too much now. Make a decision to become strong and healthy, both physically and emotionally. Dave123 provides a startling example of one man's journey towards 'self-actualisation' - not a whole lot of people do it as thoroughly or as quickly, but I'd say you're right to learn from his experiences.

It's a certainty that you'll have a lot of hard thinking, and difficult feeling, to go through whilst you figure out your answers. Do keep posting here if it helps: there are some fantastic people in these forums, guaranteed to throw a different light on your issues :) Also remember the strength your own family & friends can give you, while you work things out.

All the best, and good luck.

[LT83]

AG I have to say, its astounding that in one post you have summed up the way I feel about her after 3 and half years.

Love can cloud your judgement sometimes, to the extent where i was putting aside the negative aspects of her character because I loved her. Whereas she wasnt willing to do the same for any of my faults. I have spoken to many people recently and I now realise that there are women and men that have put up with so much more, even that go beyond the boundaries of acceptable behaviour and they stick by their partner because they love them. My W on the otherhand had it all, all of my love and my effort and my understanding, so she complained about my family and my parents not liking her (though competely untrue), it shouldnt make a difference either way. People have opened my eyes to the fact I tried to love her enough for the both of us and slowly she got complacent.

A friend recently told me that it seemed that she realised she didnt have to make an effort and i would still love her. She could ignore me and forget about making herself pretty for me, and not pay me any attention and she knew I would still be waiting by the door with flowers in my hand. I guess that was my fault that I always gave her too much even when she didnt deserve it.

I look back and can now think of cirmcumstances that on review I find completely unacceptable. No wonder she stopped trying and in all honesty, if she loved me enough she would have wanted to sit down and talk things through. But she didnt.

Yesterday I sent her an email. I told her that I have decided to move on with my life. because I dont want her to think that I am waiting for her to change her mind. We shared so good times and I dont have any regrets but if things were gonna be worked out she would have given the impression that it was a matter of time and not closed the door flatly.

I deserve more than she gave me and maybe I need to be stronger for myself and not give so much all the time.

[Ageing Grace]

Thanks for your comment, LT83. I didn't do anything - it was all in your posts :)

Congratulations on reaching your conclusion. It must have taken quite a bit of courage.

Please don't think you were wrong to love so much - you have a precious gift to bring to your relationships. When you find someone who loves you equally generously in return, you'll be so happy!

Best wishes for your future,
AG

[dave123]

Hey there, no worries for posting in "my" thread it's an open forum and i'm happy to be able to share thoughts and problems with anyone on here.

Glad you're still posting and moving on a bit. It is not a nice time in anyone's life but it's how we deal with these problems that shapes our future. Allowing ourselves to love someone even though they are un-loving in return is really hard to pull away from. I can recognise that i was miserable with my W, as was she, but i still love her. She has none of those feelings left.

I hope you find peace with the situation, and can continue to move on.

Dave

[LT83]

hi guys, thanks for the support.

Started my first day in the new job today and it seemed ok, the firm is quite demanding in terms of work rate so I guess its a perfect opportunity to immerse myself in my work and helpfully do well for the next six months.

I left work and I dont know if it was the weather or the fact that every single happy couple was walking past me, as if to rub more salt in the wound.
The email i sent a few days ago asked her not to reply as I wasnt sure i could cope with another email rejecting me again. But how i wish i could read something from her, or hear her voice.

I know she doesnt deserve me or the way i treated her. I know I can find someone to love me more. But I love her and I cant help feeling like this. I hate it

[dave123]

hi guys, thanks for the support.

Started my first day in the new job today and it seemed ok, the firm is quite demanding in terms of work rate so I guess its a perfect opportunity to immerse myself in my work and helpfully do well for the next six months.

I left work and I dont know if it was the weather or the fact that every single happy couple was walking past me, as if to rub more salt in the wound.
The email i sent a few days ago asked her not to reply as I wasnt sure i could cope with another email rejecting me again. But how i wish i could read something from her, or hear her voice.

I know she doesnt deserve me or the way i treated her. I know I can find someone to love me more. But I love her and I cant help feeling like this. I hate it

Hello mate, really sorry for how you're feeling here. Congratulations on the new job and the positive outlook you have regarding that. Long term you will be a successful man and if you can get through this difficult period of your life with pride and hope then you can use the life experience to make the future so much better.

The way you are feeling about her echoes exactly with where i have been recently. As i push on on my own with life and MY future i do start to feel like that less and less. It feels very gradual though and seeing her still brings it all back to me. So many things right now are reminders of what i could have had and what i won't have now, seeing pregnant women, knowing 2 couples who are due in August is a real kick in the stomach for me, random music on my ipod, cheesy films. I'm trying to avoid these wherever possible and face up to the rest as well as i can, building all the while better friendships and some semblance of a new future so that i have new memories to fall back on instead of rehashing all the things to do with her.

Keep on talking things out on here or with a counselor. The best thing you can do is just let go and be good to yourself.

Good luck,

Dave

[LT83]

I wanted to hear from her and i got my wish. She emailed me asking for the deposit to our flat as she had borrowed that money from a family friend. So i did a stupid thing and i called her. Our phone call ended in a row and she got very abusive. I then reeled off a very long email about how ungrateful she was

[LT83]

I was so angry with the way she treated me and how she thought this was all my doing. I said to her that we never spoke about our problems and she insisted that we did. When I quizzed her about when we spoke about these problems she said "I told you that there were problems I needed to resovle and they were deep inside". I thought, what the hell am I?? A mind reader?!?!

It was an absolute joke. Im so angry and the only good thing about being angry is that im not depressed for the time being.

I had to go to my old flat today to collect so more clothes and the estate agents called saying they have someone to view. Everything seems to me happening now and its all happening so quick.

i also had someone log into my email account and messenger and start speaking to one of my friends asking them who they were and how they knew me.

Life beats better by the minute.


I've never been the negative type, i've always been a very motivated individual and love life and the experiences. But I poured my heart and soul into this relationship and I naively thought that it would last forever, even though I was prepared for the ups and downs. Now it feels like I didnt leave anything for myself. On top of all this I feel so pathetic, i dont even think that its the W i cant get over, I think its the shock and the situation that has put me on the back foot because it was so sudden and unexpected and we never even spoke about it.

[LT83]

the past few days have been quite enlightening. I dont feel so depressed and I feel a bit more resilient. I know the mistakes I made and they dont relate to the W. They relate to myself and the way i was for myself. I concentrated on her and didnt value myself high enough. I think if I had stuck to my guns and put her straight sooner then she wouldnt have pushed her luck so much and acted like she'd just come out of bubble wrap.

To a certain extent I think the W was right. I wasnt a man. I didnt have a backbone, in fact during our argument on monday she called me a p***y. Which was very harsh, especially from her but I have been a bit spineless over the last few years. She is right but not in the way she thinks. I am not all of these things through not standing up for her or prioritising her or allowing my family to control me. I have been weak because I didnt put her in her place sooner and more clearer. Now I dont mean that in a male macho, testosterone fuelled way, but I should have stopped her from taken advantage to the situation and me. I gave into her too much because I thought it would make her happy.

I remember back when we started going out. There was a situation where a male friend came to see her at her uni house. She told me on the phone, very innocently, "oh yeah x came round and i showed him the house because he wants to buy in the area and i showed him around...". For me innocent or not I didnt appreciate that, some may but I didnt. I really went off on one at her. And I told that had the shoe been on the other foot and I invited a girl into my house alone and showed her around the house im sure she wouldnt feel comfortable about it. For weeks she was trying to make it up to me, I never held it against her or made her suffer. But i think just the thought of her losing me put her on her toes and alerted her to the fact that she had to make effort to keep her man.

The sheer fact that I was always available to her and there to support her night and day later on in our relationship made her comfortable. To most it would sound like heaven to think that whatever happens that person is always there for you, it sounds like a perfect husband. In actual fact it makes us complacent and puts in a frame of mind where we take things for granted and then we dont make the effort we should.

She took me for granted because I made things too easy for her. Had I not made things so easy in making me happy maybe she would have realised that she had to work a bit harde to keep me.

Thats where my weakness came into it. I let her have what she wanted, all the time and told her I was happy just to make her happy even though some things bugged me. I should have made my point clear and maybe she would have paid attention.

I may be wrong about this and Im sure someone will call me on this, but they say marriage is hard work because you have to learn to close your eyes to all the faults of your partner. I think they have it wrong! Marriage is hard because you have to ensure that you keep your partner on their toes. Not by making them jealous or flirting with others but by making clear what it is that you want and what makes you happy. And saying when something makes you unhappy not keeping your mouth shut.

This weeks learning experience has been something. I hopefully will learn more and become stronger. I hope that I can transfer the backbone and steel I have in everyday life and not let it vanish when it comes to relationships

[Hilary]

I think you have had a huge insight into the way you have been functioning with your wife. it is not a matter of one person being right and one being wrong. But it is about you being true to yourself and you did let her walk over you a bit.

It will take practice to act in a different way in relationships but if at first you don't succeed, then don't give up.

Marriage can be hard work and it isn't about closing your eyes to faults - if you do that they will come and hit you in the face as yours and hers have just done to you.
It is about acknowledging and accepting our limitations (rather than faults) and working around them so that we minimise their negative aspects and work to expand the good bits of our strengths to the betterment of both of you.

[dave123]

Hi LT,

Looking back with 20/20 hindsight is pretty hard and can help but can also cause a lot of heartache. I have been doing it a lot, as has my W (i think). Her take on it is thinking of past events and blaming me. My take is trying to work out how they happened, learning from it and trying to never do it again.

In the long run i am taking the healthier option, and will continue to do so. Hopefully you can do the same. There's no need to feel guilt or beat yourself up over past events, especially as now it seems like we're both in the situation where it wouldn't change anything anyway! :-(

Hope you're doing OK,

Dave

[LT83]

Its been a few days since I last posted. I think in the last few days im starting to deal with things a lot better. My friends have been really supportive and Im not sure I could have managed it without them.

One of my closest friends, who incidently was there all the way, from when she was my girlfriend, he was at the wedding and he even stayed with my family and saw us when we were married, said; "The surprise that i feel for you is that she made so little effort to fix the problem, whilst you went beyond the boundaries of sanity". I think the penny dropped with that comment. Not only did she left me after 5 months, not only did she not tell me of the problems she "may" have been experiencing (I say may because Im even starting to doubt whether they were an issue and she didnt just use them as an excuse because she didnt get what she wanted by moving closer to her parents), not only did she use divorce as the first option and go to see all these professionals without even me knowing and in the space of a week (that includes clearing out her stuff without me knowing.), since she has gone she has not tried to come to a reconciliation, compromise, agreement or even allow me to sit down with her face to face and discuss it.

Another thing which I cant make out for the life of me is that she keeps unblocking me and blocking me on her msn messenger. That denotes to me that she doesnt have a clue what she's doing. Its strange because I dont even know whether I would take her back knowing that she has put me through this and not thought about my feelings for one second.

well, today is the litmus test. Today is my birthday, 26 years old. I think im too young to be going through this. This is not the way i thought i'd be spending it but hey ho. I dont think she will contact me today but at least it will clarify things for me if she doesnt. and right now i need clarity.

[dave123]

I know it's not going to ring all that true but Happy Birthday!

26 is young to be going through this, but another way of looking at it is compare yourself to me. I'm 31. So in 5 years you could be an excellent professional, have a nice house, and a new beautiful loving respectful, caring, compassionate partner to share your life and your time with.

The situation now will seem like ancient history. I think i'm lucky to be here now at 31 instead of trying to start again at 35, 40 or 50. No disrespect to the older people on here, but starting again at that age and after a much longer relationship must be so much harder.

Enjoy your friends, on the good days have as much fun as you possibly can, and on the awful one's think future and think positive.

Take care,

Dave

p.s. i wish i was 26!

[LT83]

Well, its been alsmost 6 months since i've been here. I really used the time to evaluate myself and what i want out of life.

Before my wife left me I used to think that as long as I was the best and honest husband to my W then she would appreciate it and show me her love too. Oh how wrong I was. I used to make myself happy in the knowledge that I was doing my all to make her happy. She was my main focus in life and giving her everything that I could. She took it for granted.

Even in separation she said that she wasnt in love with me anymore but she would be happy to ask me for money even though I didnt have a job. Savings, deposits and any extra money she could get out of me she did by pulling on my heart strings. She left all our joint debts for me to deal with. I realised that being a perfect gentleman means you get taken advantage of by some people very easily.

The irony is that I thought by being kind and helpful to her she would come back to me, but then I realised that I was still supporting her at my own detriment even though she didnt want to be my wife anymore.

The one time I asked her for something, the first time in our entire relationship, a bit of the money that I had just given her, she said she wished she could but she had it earmarked for something and she could afford to give it back. Can you imagine the disbelief, its like it still hadnt sunk in that she was just using me like that.

She said she wanted to be friends and I tried but I kept thinking how would I deal with it if she met someone else, so I decided it was best for me not to try and be friends.

I stopped all contact with her and since then my life has gradually improved. I got myself a very good well-paid job, I am starting to put my business plans into motion, (business plans that I had to put on hold because I spent an astronomical amount of money on the mother of all weddings for "her special day"). I've met a lot of new and interesting people. Most importantly, I realised that I dont need a woman who is going to bring me down with her demands and expectations for herself. I need a woman who is going to lift me up in the world and in life. For us to lift each other and support each other.

I dont hate my ex W, I dont even dislike her, I pity her. She has made the biggest mistake of her life and one she will never be able to make right. She said to my friend recently that she regretted how she treated me, she regretted that she didnt show me the affection a husband needs and she feels she was wrong to just walk out without trying to solve our problems. She has also been asking a lot of questions to a mutual friend about what im up to and what Im doing with myself. Part of me think she regrets her choice and the other part thinks she is just trying to get more out of me (depends on my mood really). Especially considering she emailed me recently asking me whether I would be willing to put up half the costs of the solicitors fees. I didnt reply. This was her choice and she could pay the consequences.

Ultimately,writing this makes me feel better after a bit of a moody morning. I used to be the kind of person that found the idea of divorce abhorrent and I'd rather live miserable for 40 years than be divorced. but since this is not my choice or my doing my conscience is clear!!

[LT83]

Im a few days away from expecting papers, i havent spoken to the exW in little over 2 months, i think, and I havnt seen her since the day she just walked out.

I started getting anxious but then I realised that this was going to be another page turned in my life, one door closes and another one opens. Im not sure how long everythig will take from when the papers are signed but i guess i'm doing my thing.

I also went to an investment seminar yesterday night and it got my business mind back in gear, reminded me of the dynamo I was before i had to drown myself in debt to give her "her day". If i had saved all that money instead of spending it on a marriage and wedding that would only last 5 months then I could have myself a very nice house right now. Still good opportunities to make up for lost time.

I guess what worries me, is in the back of my mind, i think I dont want to make the same mistake of meeting "a taker" and I still dont know how I didnt see it. It worries me that I may do the same?

[MSC71]

This could of been a lot worse, trust me. She could of done this 5 years into your marriage (or longer), ..........then it would be much worse. You are still young and you will find someone that will appreciate how you are and treat you back the same way. You will look back on this and be glad it happened.

[LT83]

You are completely right and i know i did everything I could do.

its strange, for a person (exW) who feels so strongly about something and not even have the guts to stand in front of the person they are accusing/blaming (me), when given opportunity after opportunity, to even say you did this or that or this is why i want a divorce only shows me one thing. In actual fact she has nothing of any value to say and that her argument is not reasonable and is completely without base.

The fact she kept changing the reasons confirms that opinion too and leads me to believe that she didnt act with reason and like an adult. But more like a child who stomps her feet when she doesnt get the chocolate bar she wants, she she says "you're not my friend!!" and runs off.


I guess the thing that worries me, as i said before, is taht i dont want to make the same mistake. I want to be able to see the signs and think, oh shes a taker and not right for me.

[LT83]

Life is simple.

People are complex and very strange.

My mind finds itself in constant civil war, a constant battle to understand the logic behind the decisions people make and to really understand the reason behind their actions. The answr is always the same. "It just doesn't make sense".

I ask why can these people not act with maturity, calmness and the understanding that would surely resolve most, if not all, disputes.
I try to understand how people can give up so easily in a marriage. How they can betray the person who loves them the most and for what? To gain absolutely nothing but to lose everything. To cause the breakdown in honesty and trust, only to put themselves and their wants above the importance and happiness of the union. To take a sledgehammer to the stable foundations that have taken two people years to build and in one fall swoop bring the whole things tumbling down.

Or even how they can allow outsiders to influence their decisions and bring about the beginning of the end for two people who were at one point very much in love. What do those people gain by interfering? Is it jealousy? spite? ignorance? or good ole fashioned evil in their heart? When a man is so good to his wife and he practically worships her why would a mother in law want her daughter to divorce him? To live through such pain and the obvious regret when she later realises what she actually had.

I just can't comprehend it. It clouds my mind and leaves me in a state of confusion akin to waking up with a hangover and not knowing where you are. Little memories and flashbacks give you a brief reminder of what you had and only serve to deepen the wounds of knowing now what is missing.

On the other side of this everlasting mental conflict is the simple statement: "Why apply logic to this situation?". Its not logical at all, these are decisions made are not made on sense, thought and calm analysis, theyre based on raw emotion and reaction. Rage, anger, pride, stubborness, spite. They're based on insecurities, immaturity and selfishness. Immaturity that sees the exit door as the first solution and the easy option as the best one. A reaction that chooses 'flight' instead of 'fight' when what's at stake hasn't fully dawned upon them. "No, its too hard to actually fight my own flaws to try and save a marriage worth saving, i'd rather get away from it all and run! Run and hide in a place where the pain is cushioned. Where not dealing with my own demons is satisfactory, where I dont have to try. I'll run to people who give me what I want all the time and forget that this ever happened."

Finally when the blood slows down and the cogs start turning again, the moment is lost. So they muse "Oh dear, I ran. What can I do to salvage this mess? I'll make up some excuses to blame the one who swore an oath to love me. The one who built a castle for me and shielded me with his heart. The one who stood in front of me countless times if only to take a blow that life had dealt me. He made me the envy of all my friends as he was so committed to me that nobody could ever shake him from his devotion. Yes he's the easy target, I'll blame him"

Where is the logic? I guess there is none

Whilst I'm expecting divorce papers any day now, i'll admit it still stings a fair bit.

Even though i havent seen her since that day she kissed me goodbye and told me "I love you" before she went off to work. I still dream of her, sometimes they are nice, most times they are not nice.

After that kiss, she was gone, just a vacuum of confusion, miscomprehension and sorrow left behind in her place. Those empty feelings that would change into self-doubt, guilt, blame for myself, the feeling that I could have done more and that it was never too late, never giving up hope that love would bring the two of us back together. The hope that her friends would help for the betterment of our marriage. I'd think "i always did my best to make her happy and i loved her with all my heart so why shouldnt her friends help". The pleas for assistance and advice that fall on deaf ears, not even a "sorry I cant help" just silence, as if the message didnt get through to them or the email was left unopened.

Then comes the hopelessness, the acceptance of rejection, feeling worthless. Wanting to end things in your own pathetic way. The traits of a man that has an honest heart. You ask yourself "Why? How? What is she feeling? Does she still love me?" Questions that you're probably better off not knowing the answer to. Will the answers make a difference or will they feed your confusion more when you dont hear what you expect?

I try not to ask these questions any more. But they will linger in my mind for a while.

I'm not sure if it was my pride, the fact that I did everything I could possibly do (reasonable and unreasonable) and it still wasnt enough. To feel that my best efforts weren't enough and maybe I wasnt good enough.

Or maybe it was the fact that in the time we were together I didnt notice these signs. The signs of a woman that wasnt the wife I wanted. A wife that would show me affection and love. One that would appreciate my gestures and respond to me with similar affection. A wife that understood that a difference of opinion doesnt have to necessarily evolve into an argument. A partner in life and not a child that would have to be appeased.

I worry that I didnt see those signs. Will I see them in the future? Will the fear of making the same mistake ward me off something good? Should I take a clean slate to life or try and learn from my mistakes because surely one cannot do both? And still there lurking in my mind, does she feel remorse? does she regret her decision? Is she with someone else? Will she try and come back to me or will she try and fleece me for everything else that is left of me?

Questions that I still dont know if I want to know the answer to.


Sorry for the long post, but I guess I just wanted to sit in front of the PC and write something without knowing what exactly.

[LT83]

Went back to see my parents this weekend. Was good to see everyone. Everyone is doing there thing.

Something concerned me though, my mum told me in private that she keeps having dreams about my W trying to come back to me and then fleecing me for everything I have. Not a nice sentiment and im sure its obvious as to what my family would think of her. Not that it would change my opinion anyway, my mind is set.

But the reason it concerns me is that a few days ago I had my own dream where she tried to come back to me and tell me she was pregnant with my child. But it wasnt my child, it was someone else's. The strange thing about this dream is that I was devastated by the idea of her being with someone else. Even though when im awake I think about it and I couldnt give a monkey's what she does in her life. Like I said, she doesnt deserve me and has to suffer the consequences of her mistakes.

but i cant understand why i was so upset in the dream and what it means that my mum had a dream as well.

Still, i hope I wont be having many dreams in the near future, they make me moody and tired.

[LT83]

Another night another dream.

This time I awoke thinking that she is trying to contact me. They leave so confused and in such a state.

Today was supposed to be my 1 year of marriage. Feeling very low

[Raymond]

I'd reject that dream LT8 it obviously leads to confusion.

Raymond

[LT83]

How do i reject something that wont go away.

I think this is the lowest i've been since i starting improving.

My emotions are all over the place.

[Raymond]

What I am saying is that you do not have to attach an importance that isn't there. Dreams can come from various sources. Most are just our minds being allowed to get out of gear. Occasionally God can speak or even a dark source when someone is involved in occult or something.

You have been through a lot and are vulnerable. It is plain your wife has not behaved correctly so don't attach any credence or hope to these dreams. She had free choice and is not a prisoner so try not to torture yourself.

Raymond

[LT83]

I believe what you say raymond, ultimately if she is not capable of being an adult now, then she will never be and if people (family or otherwise) have an influence over here now, a greater influence than i had, then they will always have that influence because she's not adult enough to deal with it and make up her own mind.

I had a conversation with the friend who spoke to her a few weeks ago and I dont really know how to take it.

This is what she said, and I paraphase:

"Hi LT83,

i'm well thank you, and of course you are invited to the our wedding. You can bring your date!Mr X (a Male friend) hehe.

i was planning to call you but I didnt know whether it was appropriate or whether you wanted to keep going backwards and forwards over this, so I decided at the time not to.

After our engagement party I was thinking of you and xxx (W) after seeing you there (as you would have been there together!) So a few days later i sent her a message to find out how she was etc...and she called me back.

We were just having small talk really about general stuff, she said she wasnt in a very good place at the moment, she was still looking for a job and most of her friends had let her down. She asked about you, I told her you came to our engagement and you looked really healthy (getting back to the gym etc), and she asked if you were working and i said as far as i know, yes he is. At the end of the conversation she said to me "look after him."

The reason why i wanted to tell you was because I sensed no anger from her towards you anymore, she just wanted to know how you were and it seemed all the hostility she had towards you had gone. We spoke about you for a while (I can't remember what else was said) but i do remember it being positive. I said to her that should she ever want to come to down to have a meal with you or something but felt awkward, me and fiance would be happy to come along too (to kind of facilitate things!) and she said she would let me know.

i said to fiance that maybe all you both needed was some time apart, it felt to me like she clearly still loved you, but i believe the families are keeping you both from being together again as she probably feels like she has put them through so much just to get back with you now after all this. But that is only my opinion, i could be totally wrong.

i just wish you could both get back together and if there was anything i could do to help i would, without causing any family problems.

i hope you are keeping well, take care

xxx

My friend also later admitted that her mother had too much influence over her and that she didnt say a bad word against her. I never wanted her to say a bad word against her mother. I wanted her to respect our marriage by giving me the love care and respect that a marriage requires. And to respect that we are out to make it on our own without any cushions of family around us.


I dont know how much credence to put to this conversation. Given the fact that I'm expecting divorce papers any time now, if she doesnt make a move because of her family then theres not much i can do about that.

[Raymond]

That friend of your could be very useful. Your wife should be allowed all the freedom she needs to follow her own heart. It sounds possibly that it could be hopeful but don't get your hopes up too much. This will take time. She has been given the opportunity to see you with your friend and her man and she didn't reject it. Sounds like she may be regretting her move.

One dangerous thing is the control spirit the mother seems to be operating over her. This should always be resisted as it tends to control ones free will. It isn't a loving thing but a control thing. In these cases the mother has never cut the apron strings and allowed the child to grow up. This is the fight she may have on her hands. It is also possible that she may have poisoned her mind against you to keep her as her child.

Even if she comes back to you she will need to break that control if she is to mature. She can still love her mother but not be controlled. Trouble is it will not only be in her mother it will be in her, a kind of submissive thing but in the wrong way. She will have to fight against this thing in her. You need to be aware of these things and be ready for a fight. She may well want to come back but feels controlled.

Raymond

[LT83]

Raymond,

You seem to know a bit about this type of thing. Its strange that she accused me of being a mummy's boy and said that my parents have too great an influence over me when its obvious that the opposite is actually true.

How can I help someone who doesnt know or want to hear that they are being controlled by their parents without alienating them. She is also very protective of her mother, i think this is after so many years of her mums "word in the ear". Her mum is still relatively young. I think she is 42 with a 23 yr old daughter.

This may be pretty academic because she hasnt accepted the invitation and actually give me reason to believe that she wants to come back. But how can i cope/deal with this control from the mother over my wife in the short term and in the long term?

The worse thing for me would be to have a child with her and then for her to go running back to her parents with the child. How could I stand my ground then?

[Raymond]

One should always honour their parents but not be controlled by them. Deep down your wife will know that this control is not right. She needs to gradually learn that she does not need it, but this takes experience. Her best chance is with you and that is where she belongs, if you can put up with waiting for her to mature. She needs to be able to make her own decisions or at least come under your covering and not her mothers.

Theres nothing you can do just now except to hope that she takes up your friends offer to have a meal with you to see how things stand.

I think your friend is the key here. I would ask her to maintain her relationship and keep the door open with her. Sooner or later the chance will come but she has to take it. Can she be invited to something by your friend? I don't know a wedding or something?

Raymond

[Johnee S]

LT83 stop begging and pleading, if you want to get her back the only way to do it is let her dig herself into a hole, agree to a speration then focus completely on yourself, don't support her in any way, make her do it on her own, make her beg her parents. Distance yourelf and don't be all oh I miss you, I love you, don't look desperate.

If she calls you don't let her see your pain or hurt, just be casual and prented your talking to a buddy. This will cause her to start thinking if she really is making the rifght choice for herlf.

Next focus on you, get into a gym and work the pain out that way, eat better, read books on self improvment. Read the Secret and watch the DVD. Believe me when I tell you by focusing in on you will leave her feeling exposed and vulnerable, She needs to go through this in order to really get the guts of her choices.

She has lost attraction for you, this is why rebuilding yourslf is so important right now. You need to rebuild your self confidence, and self esteem, you need to feel good about you again. You need to take better care of you since you gave yourself up for her over the years she was in school. No more supporting her support you! It may sound mean but trust me man, when your confidence is higher and your self esteem is built on you for you, and you understand you can live a life with out her; she will sense this and think twice.

it will NOT happen over night, it will take a lot of consistant commitment on your part to follow through on this, it may even stand the chance of backfiring. However, in the end you will nto be no worse off then you are now. Rather then dwelling on this simply accept it as it is at the moment not what it was or what you hoped it would be.

Focus on you for the moment and start the self improvement track, trust me you will feel much stronger, more confident, taking care of yourself. Remember all your best qualities are what she was attracted to when you first got into dating then went seriousl If you cannot take care of yourself how can you take care fo someone else? If you cannot love yourself for who you are, how can you love another person?

Give her as much space as she wants and focus all your attention on yourself and your needs and wants. Don't give into dwelling, don't beg, don't be all needy. never show yourself as the weaker between the both of you, believe you are able to cope and get over this, know you can live with out her in your life; but also remember you want to be with her out of choice not out of need.

[Johnee S]

One should always honour their parents but not be controlled by them. Deep down your wife will know that this control is not right. She needs to gradually learn that she does not need it, but this takes experience. Her best chance is with you and that is where she belongs, if you can put up with waiting for her to mature. She needs to be able to make her own decisions or at least come under your covering and not her mothers.

Raymond

I bet the counsellor she's seeing is filling her head with focusing on all the negatives of the relationship and her own personal self esteem in order to soak her for more money for counselling. Counsellors can only do so much and from what I've read in your thread it seems she is opposite of who you know LT83; I wonder what has changed in your relationship over the last year or so that has caused this to happen? Is she possibly seeing or saw someone else?

[LT83]

Thanks for the advice, im glad that you said all that you did because thats exactly what I did after seeing the light.

Concentrated on myself and cut contact with her and Im in a much better place physically, emotionally, financially, in most senses.

I dont believe it was a case of anyone else. I think it was much more simple than that.

Her mother influenced her and interfered too much. She was raised in a family where her mum was quite clearly the boss. Not just over her husband but over everyone else too. From that my W has been brought up to be very passive and dependant and reliant on those around her.

When she wanted to move back closer to her parents, because her mum kept making her feel guilty for moving too far away with her husband, she wasnt able to handle the pressure and it made her sick. She asked me to move back with her and I told her in time we would review the options and consider all possibilities. But the pressure her mum put her under she wanted to move now and when I stood my ground she did the first thing that she knew, run back to mum and dad.

She then accused me of all the things she is guilty of and whilst in the company of her mother's poison she said she wanted a divorce. Since then she has probably regretted it but she doesnt have the courage to say so or the confidence/fight to go after what she wants.

Maybe not so simple as i made out but when you have someone who is not emotionally strong being surrounded by negativity that is the effect it will inevitably cause. The strange thing is that her mother has no reason to dislike me and I think she only acts like this because she wants to continue exercising her control over her family....and me! - Not going to happen!

[Raymond]

You are correct there LT8. Everthing about it speaks of a control spirit emanating from the mother. This is more powerful than you think but it needs fighting against. Your wife is submerged by it and doesn't have much strength to resist, as it is her own mother. The mother doesn't hate you she just controls the daughter and didn't want to cut the apron strings when it was the right time. Her possesiveness overides her wish to see her daughter established and in a good marriage.

This is a well known thing in christian circles and there are places to go to get prayer for release. One doesn't have to change the mother. It's a case of the daughter freeing herself but still loving her mother. It's not going to happen though without first the daughter receiving enlightenment and then having the resolve not to be subject to this wrong control.

Raymond

[LT83]

Out of the blue I received an email from W. She was asking for my address because she didnt want to send the divorce papers to my parents address, and pleaded with me not to ignore her.

I called her and we had quite a lengthy conversation. We talked about what had been happening in her life and the answer was not much, still hadnt found a job and still not in a better place to the one she left me in. Me on the other hand I had excelled in every area of my life. (apart from the dealing with the divorce emotions - but I wasnt going to say this). I offered her some words of encouragement like "dont give up hope" and "you can do it." She said that she was happy for me that I really moved forward with my career and was doing the things I wanted to do.

Then I turned the conversation on to the whole divorce situation and asked her what the deal was. She told me that her solicitors had drafted the papers and she wanted to send them to me and not to my family home because she didnt want to increase the tension and vitriol from them. She told me that she hadnt exaggerated anything with regard the the solicitor and hoped that I wouldnt think of her badly if i disagreed with the content of the papers. She was divorcing on the grounds of behaviour.

We also spoke about what had happened between us and she said that she didnt want me to hate her or to do anything out of spite to slow things down she just wanted this whole episode to be over. She told me how she had spoken to a recently divorced friend and they had told her how difficult it was and how much pain the whole process is, to which i agreed.

Then we started talking about where we had gone wrong and she admitted that she hadnt given me the love and affection i needed as a man but she felt like she was left without a choice. she said that she tried to cry out for help but i wouldnt listen and I was too arrogant to understand what she was going through. she still felt that my family contributed heavily to the situation by be controlling over me (this is something i completely disagree with but i wanted to hear her out). She felt that she was crying out for my support and she needed it because she admitted to not being an emotionally strong person and I didnt see that.

I told her that my intention was only to make her happy and I couldnt understand why she was so depressed when we were together. I admitted that I didnt really know what direction to take the situation in and how to deal with it, (i've always been a very confident person and always knew what to do in situations) But no one ever teaches you how to be married, no one hands you a guide and says "here you go thats a guide to a happy marriage". In truth I was a fish out of water and i was learning and making mistakes.

She told me that although we had our difficulties she still remembered a lot of the good times we had before things got tough and that she cherished them. I said the same, and I asked her if this was really what she wanted. Whether she would not consider the fact that we are a bit older and alot wiser and would not make the same mistakes again (i didnt beg or plead but i tried to speak as calmly as possible). But she felt that after being apart for 6 months there wasnt really an opportunity for us to try again because she thought it was only going to cause more upheaval and headache regarding families and she didnt want to have that animousity between families.

I she kept getting emotional during the conversation and it was very clear to me that she loved me but she said that love wasnt enough and we didnt respect each others needs and support each other. She felt that we loved each other so much that we didnt heed the warnings and we wanted to be together too much without paying attention to the signs that were there.

I basically outlined my position to her. That i had a good job and i was moving forward in my life and the happiness in my life had culminated in my marriage to her. I told her that although it was only 6 months I felt like i had grown 60 years wiser with all the events. I told her that I wanted her to know that I still didnt want this divorce and I felt that with our resilence and more mature perspective we could start afresh and start from the beginning again. I told her to think about the this in depth and consider it afresh start. I also told her that if it was a case of her wanting to continue through with the divorce that I would respect that but it would be the last time she heard from me. I could try and be friends and have her in my life because it was going to be painful and too difficult on the both of us.

She said that she had been thinking about things for the 6months and that she felt she was making the right choice, but she would think about it one more time (i sensed that she wasnt really going to change her mind not because of me but because she had made the decision long ago when she was still very hurt and angry)

I ended the conversation by saying I hope this isnt the last time I hear from you and if it is then take care of yourself and remember to reach for the stars. Etc. She responded the same way with the customary, look after yourself and stay healthy etc.

So i guess in short it was a pleasant conversation but not a pleasant outcome and that Im still awaiting for divorce papers.

I wish it wasnt so

[Raymond]

Thats sad LT8. To have that much love for each other and not be able to stay together is sad.

It is interesting that she said you were controlled by your parents. There is so much you have both learned out of this that you should be able to put it into practice.

I hope she just changes her mind and gives it another go.

Raymond

[LT83]

I really dont want this divorce.

I really dont know what to do.

All that calmness and confidence that I had built up over the last 6 months has evaporated.

Is clear that she loves me but she doesnt think we have a future.

I really need some guidance on this.

[Raymond]

I think it's her that needs the guidance. Is she willing for that? She is taking a pessimistic view which is killing off any hope. There is certainly hope here now. You have learned so much and are willing to go on learning. You friend might be able to help?

In the end you cannot force it. Can you send her romantic letters, cards or anything? You have to refire the hope somehow.

I'd take a gamble and woo her all over again. It may gradually work. You have nothing to lose.

Raymond

[LT83]

my friend has come back to me saying that her words had little effect on her and although its apparent that she has feelings for me she is still of the opinion that it wouldnt work and she wants to get the divorce over and done with.

I've decided the only thing for me to do is to write her a letter, not begging or professing my undying love for her, but just to ackknowledge the following:
- Simply to apologise for the things that were my fault and acknowledge how they made her feel.
- Also to thank her for the love she gave to me when we were together and to thank her for some of the most memorable moments of my life.
- T accept that this was a tough decision but whatever she decided, im sure we'd end up happy be it together or not.

And that will be the end of things...


PS, if anyone with experience in these things would care to pm me I would be grateful to send them a copy of the letter before i had write it and send it out tomorrow, just to give me their thoughts. thanks
to tell

[Raymond]

Your letter sounds alright to me. You have to try and give her doubts about what she is doing that there will be hope with you.

Raymond

[LT83]

I sent the handwritten letter. I guess it was an apology for my mistakes and a thank you for the good times.

However, Im glad im no longer feeling so helpless for her to return. I am experiencing some funny emotions.

Im not sure whether getting back with her is the best thing. I do love her but there would be no trust and as much as i loved her she failed to communicate her concerns to me first time. I wouldnt be too confident that she wil stick around after the first argument. She also feels (almost) completely blameless in this and has focused on telling me how i failed in my roles to her with a very minimal mention of why she failed me.

It is quite apparent to me, a female friend said, after seeing her emails and texts recently. That after 6 months of being away from me, where she had a chance to reflect and assess things and really miss me and value our relationship, she hasnt matured a single bit. She hasnt grown as a person not one iota and its apparent that she is of the belief that all the troubles she has been experiencing since she left me, ie job, health, money, depression, her life being completely on stand still will disappear when she is divorced from me.

This may be just my opinion (and possibly arrogant) but Im not stupid. Her life didnt slow down to a complete halt because of the problems of the divorce. Her progress was halted because she didnt have me in her life anymore and i was the one driving the turbines so to speak.

Her lack of self belief and motivation had made her reliant on me to ridiculous proportions and when she left me she left the driving force in her life. I got her the job, i bought her the nice clothes with the money i earned, i paid her bills, i motivated her and encouraged her to be the woman she was capable of being.

Without me she ended up in a rowing boat without a paddle for 6 months. Whereas me, I excelled and moved forward in every capacity of my life. Not bound by the weight of someone on my shoulders.

So where is the benefit in im the kind of person who knows he will find happiness one way or another.

So at this point even with the letter sending. I kind of view it as a signing off rather than an attempt to bring her back to me and the long and short is that im still waiting for divorce papers.

[Raymond]

Your mood swing has changed somewhat LT8.

If that's the way things are I guess the ball is now in her court. In a sense you are right. If theres no move whatsoever from her that's it. It is really up to her.

The letter will give her the opening if she ever needed one.

Raymond

[LT83]

I seem to be experiencing these swings of opinion, it is quite strange and I have to be careful that I dont go off the handle with the Text message terrorism when i miss her.

Its true that I dont think she has matured at all. If thats her nature then she's gonna find it ridiculously difficult to come back to me, even if she wanted to because she just doesnt have the courage. Shame, becuase she has a good heart, just very weak.

The letter will give her the opening and she has had plenty of those. But if history is anything to go by then I wont hear from her and i'll get the papers.

[Raymond]

Thats why I thought it would be worth cultivating things through letters but after reading your post of 16th July I couldn't see that happening.
You have to decide what you want. If you still want her write the right types of letters. Theres no guarantee but there were signs there that she still had feelings for you. If you don't want her stay as you are and carry on with your life. Even then she might surprise you by contacting you.

Raymond

[LT83]

You are totally right Raymond.

The thing is i dont think I want to be with a woman who needs to be convinced to be with me. As much as i love her, I shouldnt have to convince anyone to love me. If that was the case then I dont think i would have a happy life. Whats the point in getting married if im facing a battle everyday to get someone to love me.

If its not a question of love then its surely a question of courage, and if she doesnt have the courage to realise the error of her ways and forgive me for mine then its her loss. If she cant pluck up the bravery to give our relationship a fighting chance then she will never taste my love, care and affection again.

I know Im not perfect and there are guys out there that are richer, smarter and maybe even better looking (not many) than me, but only I can give the love that I give and i'm definately a unique person. She wont ever have that again and she will have no one to blame but herself.

Its a shame like I said because, she has a good heart but she isnt strong enough for what a relationship requires.

[Raymond]

I think you may be wrong there. This is the stage where she will be thinking. With her mothers control it was always difficult. Letters coming to her from someone who loves her may give her the courage to make that decision and go for it again. After all you have learned so much now and she has to relise that. If she wants me come and get me may not be all that is needed. It has to be her decision of course but it is possible that you can influence that decision. There were problems in the marriage. She felt swamped by your family. There is something to win back.

Raymond

[LT83]

Raymond, I want to win her back but I dont want to do it at the cost of my future happiness and lowering my own value as well. Now I dont mean that in a self worth sense but I know that if I go to her with more apologies and begging and etc, she will have control me me like a dog on a lead. I wont be a man and I wouldnt be me. I would be lowering myself further into the dirt and accepting her terms for marriage life without compromise.

That will probably include moving very close to her family in the midlands, leaving my new job,(which im enjoying and earning good money), hardly seeing my family and friends and finally allowing her to put me in a position where her mother controls me via her. If her mum wants something she will put pressure on her brittle daughter and then let her come crying to me to fix the problem. Money, holidays, kids, home, jobs, life will all be controlled by her mum!

She tried that before and it didnt work and thats part of the reason why she upped and left. Her mum kept pressuring her to move closer to home within a week of us moving into our new home and she couldnt say no to her mum. Every weekend her mother would visit us, leaving us no time for each other and no time to even rest, she couldnt say no. I said no. I told her dad that we needed time and you think she paid him any attention? Not a jot.

I understand what you are saying, you feel that I have to fight for her in some way. I agree, but what the hell am I fighting for when she is just gonna sit there and let me squirm outside her door for 7 hours like she did. What am I fighting for when she continually says there is no chance of us getting back together because I failed her as a husband. What am I fighting for when that person hasnt shown ME (not my friends, me!) a single ounce of anything that resembles her wanting me to fight for her and actually showing some spine and fighting for her husband too!

This is entirely her choice, but she has struggled to be strong for the sake of our relationship, she hasnt shown any signs of patience, she has shown any sign maturity with her resolve that she is right 100% (even if fuelled by her mother). Yes I love her but will I be happy with her having seen this side to her? A side that leads me to believe that she will not be around when the sh*t hits the fan again (as it sometimes does). Is she gonna walk again, leave me for 6 months, threaten me with divorce and put me through a hell that I almost didnt wake up from?? and what if there are kids involved? Her mother is the unscrupulous type to get her daughter to use the kids against me!

Am I willing to go through that again without any indication from her that she is willing to try in a 50-50 relationship where we think about ourselves and us not family and friends?

That remains to be seen.


Sorry raymond, not having a go at you. you raised some very valid points that have allowed me to flesh out my concerns. If she really wanted me she would have showed me something. She cant play this like a game or think this is a fairytale "damsel in distress" story. This is life!

In life we have to give and take and be mature and think about what kind of life we want. I am a focused individual who can find happiness in most situations. If im gonna give someone the power to make me miserable or re align my focuses, its got to be someone who respects my nature and helps us thrive. Not someone who is going to do everything to placate her mother. What when her mother is gone? what then? It will be too late by then cos my happiness/life will be ruined.

Even though I love her, right now I just dont trust her with my life or my happiness.

[LT83]

Starting to feel depressed again.

I haven't recieved any paperwork from her regarding the divorce petition or any response to my letter.

I get the feeling that she's gone abroad with her family so I guess thats better for me right now, cos i feel like calling her and i dont really know what i would say.

I seem to be two different people fighting to control a shell of a man. I miss her and at the same time I dont trust her. I wish I could try again with her but at the same time I know that she isnt strong enough to give me the love I need.

Good news was that there was a birth in the family recently. Im over joyed for the mother and father. But, and I feel like a complete idiot for saying this, i wish so badly that it was me and my wife happily married and having our first child.

I'm so confused and for me confusion = depressed mood.

[LT83]

Been some time since i last posted here, but i felt like posting my feelings.

since I last posted things havent been bad. i have met a lot of great people and a lot of women that are interested in me. work has been good.:cool:

however, i feel changed as a person, in a good way and in some bad ways.

im obviously a stronger person, my skin is a little thicker and im sure i could deal with most problems a whole lot better. on the other hand i do feel slightly blackened inside, almost numb or cynical at what i hear from people, especially prospective partners.:confused:

every now and then i sometimes have dreams about my ex, where in i feel tormented by her and her family. at other times i feel quite low, it doesnt happen often but it happens nonetheless.:(

im still going through the divorce process and i have not seen her since the day she left me. its been over a year. the divorce petition was an eye opener. I didnt realise that someone i loved could write so many false and dishonest accusations about me. it was a big shock and angered me.

just wanted to get it off my chest cos it helps but at half 2 in the morning theres not many about to talk to.

i guess my question is whether i will ever feel as happy and in love (even if it was naive and misplaced) as i once did.

[spiderman]

similar situation and feeling to me mate ...its been just over 18 weeks since we separated and I havnt seen her or verbally spoken to her since...only communication is via txts !

Divorce is going through and should be final by the end of March.

Im seriously doubting whether I will ever be able to love a woman again or indeed trust one either ????? That is a sad thought :(

Lee

[JWD]

I'm a year down the line too. I have those tormented dreams too.

I know what you mean re prospective partners. My friends think I'm far too fussy but I just seem to find something wrong with everyone I meet. be it their height, bad teeth, if they discuss their ex I assume they aren't over her if they don't, I think they're hiding something LOL. I think I'm some sort of Dr Phil.

I'm sure we will be happy again one day. I don't care if I'm too fussy, I deserve someone nice and I wil never just settle.

You have to take the risk again, and I think there are still lovely people out there. I've decided my husband was a nice man but a rubbish husband.

[JWD]

Oh and I think every love is different. I was naive too, we all are, so what. I'd rather be a tad naive than all bitter, insecure and mistrusting. not saying anyone here is like that but its very sad to see people not taking a chance with love just on the off chance they may get hurt.

[koliver0821]

You all have to understand one thing and it took my wife asking for space and telling me shes not sure shes "in love" with me to do it.

Convincing someone that you are the right person is the wrong way to go about it. Its borderline begging and it is coming from a position of weakness.

"I'm sure we will be happy again one day." I think if you really look at this, you will see something that needs to happen. You need to be happy with yourself. If you are not happy with yourself, how would your partner see happiness with you?

In order for any of us to love someone again, we will all need to soften our hearts. Take down or atleast make smaller walls around our hearts. Make sure you take care of yourself. If you still have contact with your Spouse, there is always hope. just make sure you do more of the right things for you. I know it sounds difficult, but to emotionally detach. Our spouses were expecting different things from us. For some, they expected us to just say fine, its over. For others (for me) It was telling her that I dont want our marriage to be over but I want her to be happy. (In truth, I wanted to be happy and I dont think I could be happy if I was in a marriage were my wife didnt "love" me.)

Its time to change our behaviors because what we did before wasn't working for our spouse.

[LT83]

I came to that realisation fairly soon that I wasn't gonna convince someone to love me., especially not if that person wasn't showing any effort to save my marriage at the time.

Just feels like I have heard all the promises before, it sends my alarm bells ringing. It's difficult to tell who is genuine and who is just out to gain. Everyone has faults and its hard to answer whether person x, y or z's faults/differences to me are too great to consider a future that person. Because I do not want to go through that situation again. And the dreams? Do they stop?

I'm not exonerating myself of any blame but I was the only one trying to save it and pour my heart into it at that but I hope God is watching this episode in my life and doles out the justice accordingly.