Emotional affair(s)

[Too trusting]

Last summer I discovered my husband (of 31 years) had been having (what I now know is called) an "emotional affair" with a former colleague. This began with flirtatious e-mails back in 2001/2, and, because they work for the same company (albeit in different cities), continued with drinks and meals (a deux) at least 3-4 times a year at meetings as well as with telephone conversations, text messages and more e-mails until I accidently found out! We are now trying to rebuild our marriage.
For nearly six years I feel I was "living a lie"! I often felt "something" wasn't "right" but every time I brought up my doubts, my husband (who had never given me any cause not to trust him even though he travels a lot for work and has entertained female colleagues over the years; he was always above board) said I had nothing to worry about, there was no one else, etc. (He lied completely about this relationship.)
Now I'm torn between trying to regain trust in him (he has broken totally with his "friend") and a rage at the deception and my gullibility. (We are in couples counseling which is helping.)
I would really appreciate any insights, shared experiences on how to "get beyond" this! (I do have good wise friends and am actively exploring my creative talents. But my self-esteem has never been so low! Plus sometimes I think this "affair" was because I can be/ have been so emotionally independent. I was always there for my husband -- or so I thought -- but if he wasn't interested in doing something with me, I'd go by myself or with a girlfriend.)

[Raymond]

Why are you blaming yourself TT? He is the one who has been unfaithful not you. The best people can be tempted even if they have good wives. I trust that this did not proceed to sex which would make it adultery and more serious in my view. As it is it is still a betrayal but if you say you are both going to counseling perhaps it can be repaired. Trust takes the longest time to build but can be broken the quickest. It will take a long time before you will be able to trust him again. Thats mainly up to him. If he is sorry he will be striving to earn your trust once more. If he is trying to do this your part will be to extend forgiveness, which is hard I know.

Can it be mended? Yes, but not without a lot of work from him and forgiveness from you.

Raymond

[912jws]

Too Trusting,

From my experience you can't let this fester away as I did for several years and it is what I believe has destroyed my relationship over the last couple of years because of my insecurities and lack of trust for my wife, but it goes both ways as she hasn't really shown me or given me the respect I needed to overcome these issues recently, trying to tell her what it feels like was like hitting my head against a brick wall.
The biggest mistake we made was not to talk about this when it happened years ago(counselling) as we only did this late last year and tbh from my wifes perspective she had decided she wanted a different life and I think had got fed up with the fact that yes I did have a lack of trust which had only really resurfaced over the past 15mths because she stayed out all night with not so much of a text as to her whereabouts.
The counselling will allow you to put all your cards on the table if you are both honest with each other, my wife never admitted she had an affair(he was just a friend) only up until last year hence why I had these issues just niggling in the background all the time, it only came out it was an emotional affair during the counselling which to me was a big sigh of relief but sadly the damage had been done.
As Raymond says your H needs to make amends and to keep you at that level for a long time for you to start trusting him again, I do believe these things can be repaired but it takes 2!

Good Luck

Jon

[Too trusting]

Raymond and Jon,
Thank you so much for your wise words! It's good for me to hear male points of view. My solid support system is almost exclusively female (and sometimes I think we ARE wired differently!).
My husband is practically bending over backwards to be loving and we do talk a lot (always have, although, as I said, in those doubting years, he wasn't very forthcoming and, of course, wasn't honest).
While I know my self-esteem must come from within (and not depend on anyone else), I am often profoundly shocked at just how fragile I have ALLOWED myself to become where my husband is concerned. (We can have a great day out and then, after, I'll find myself wondering if he planned that event NOT because he wanted to, but because it would build up "points" toward getting me/us up and over his "indiscretion". I know I shouldn't think that way -- it's so negative, but I find it very very difficult not to.) I have become suspicious of everything.

[Raymond]

We are vulnerable to our nearest and dearest as they have the power to hurt us. It wouldn't matter so much if we were hurt a little by strangers or colleagues but within our intimate relationships, someone you have given your heart, life and body to, there has to be trust otherwise it doesn't work. There are good signs in your marriage but damage has still been done because of the unfaithfulness. As I said he is going to have to work hard to regain your trust but at the same time you have to make it possible by forgiveness. I don't know if he will ever be able to do this without a little effort from yourself as there will be a place for you to take another risk in the end. The trust can only be built up so much. There will always be a little risk in the end that we all have to make in relationships. I am not talking about a massive risk. What I am saying is we cannot be as stone making the other fully sorry for all they have done. We cannot close right up as we have to live and love. Having said that a lot still depends on him. You were the one wronged and he is the one to make it up and let you feel safe that it is never going to happen again.

Raymond

[Too trusting]

I hear you, Raymond!
I initially "forgave" my husband back in October (2007) because I realized that we weren't going to move forward as long as I stayed stuck. It was a watershed moment for both of us.
Unfortunately, he continued to have contact (and lie to me about it) with his "friend" -- although he had promised to break off everything and had supposedly had a face-to-face conversation with her in October to tell her precisely that. (He continued to think that because it wasn't sexual, it was somehow O.K. although I had been very clear that, for me and us, it was NOT.)
When I discovered this in December, I was furious and incredibly sad.
In January we began couples counseling. With much urging from the therapists, in February I told him I would trust him (otherwise, I had eliminated any opportunity for him to rebuild his trustworthiness). I think he now understands just how profoundly our marriage was affected by his deceit.
We are rebuilding trust. But it's very early days (for me). Because I was so "blanket" trusting before -- and look what happened! -- I am really afraid now.
I want to be attentive to our relationship without being obsessive about it. I want to be able to see my husband off on a business trip (he travels a lot for his work) and NOT wonder if he's going to call or otherwise contact his "friend".
I continue to open my heart to him...but a part of it remains "off limits" (which was not the case before).
And somewhere I think I need to forgive myself first before I can truly forgive him.
Sorry to go on about this.
I appreciate your comments. Thank you.

[Alice Alice]

I have an idea put the burden on him
tell him you want to forgive him and move on ...don't ever apologize for how you feel but also don't cling on to him afraid what he will be doing when he is away.

when you are with him and get the sick feeling simply tell him your feelings of how you felt the day you found out about his unacceptable friendship is back. Ask him to help you the same way as you would ask him to help you carry a heavy box.
If you have any ideas on what he can do to help you tell him if you have no idea ask him to go make you a pot of tea and turn on some nice music (no TV as it robs attention from you)
Pray as he is helping you that he realizes your genuine pain.

When he is away find something you truly love to do get a hobby such as music piano or guitar anything

[Raymond]

I didn't realise TT that your trust had been broken twice. As I said before trust takes the longest to build up again. There is an intimate part of you which you are keeping back which is completely understandable. You can work towards the goal of trust but you need the right signs consistently from him for you to be able to do this. I think you are being very open to trusting him. One does not want to push you too far in this as healing has to take place in you as well. Broken trust is very damaging. One cannot expect it to be put right tomorrow. You will have to take your time and be mended so don't rush because you cannot rush. It's good that he now understands how hurtful it was to you, but you are only normal like most other women. Another thing you have to do is forgive him which is also difficult but it must be done to protect you from any bitterness lodging in you. If you have a willingness there you can do it. It doesn't mean you will be able to trust him straight away, it is a different area but a part of it. We all need forgiveness every day because of things we think, say and do. Also as you touched on forgiving yourself is also important which is different from excusing yourself.

Raymond

[Too trusting]

Hello All!
I'm having a "one step forward, two steps back" day. After conversation with a close and trusted girlfriend, I am wondering if I will ever be able to really trust my husband again. I honestly DON'T KNOW from one moment to the next whether or not he is telling me the "truth". My friend's point was that he is who he is AND who he is, is someone who LIED to me, something that was originally defined as a "deal breaker" in our marriage. Her question: what are you doing in relationship therapy with someone whom you can't believe? Indeed! What makes it worse, is that my husband only admitted stuff when confronted with evidence; he never "volunteered" anything. I am so struggling with wanting to salvage and resurrect our nearly 33-year relationship which had many good and happy points and completely knocked for six (or whatever the expression is) by how he could LIE to me in the first place.
I feel as if I am grasping at straws and it IS making me crazy!

[clockwork orange]

Hi TT

Don't know if this will help - depends whether your H is willing to try it. I had an affair (mostly emotional but did slip over once) and was fortunate my H forgave me. Regaining trust is another story, and what we eventually agreed is this :

He can ring me any time, ask where I am and who with, and I undertake not to get upset.
If I mention any specific person to often for his liking, he can quiz me about it, ask to meet, whatever. If he is not comfortable with it then any meeting in is his presence (not happened to date). He is free to ask about my friendships and whether they are "safe" at any time.

I also have accountability to my pastoral care worker and my house group leader, and they will get my H in if necessary.

Only been 3 months so far, but I tread carefully because I know I am accountable. I am probably also a lot more honest with my H emotionally than I used to be.

Hope that is of use, and good luck. It is worth pulling out the stops - you just never know it could work!!!

Karen

[Raymond]

Now there is someone who can retore ones trust. Thank you Clockwork Orange. The fruits of repentance are there or in plain english she is sorry and is making amends by being completely vulnerable to her husband.

I fear you are not getting any of this TT and therefore the trust is not being restored. That is not your fault from my reading but his. You can only trust a trustworthy person. Even if they make mistakes they want to put it right. Your husband doesn't appear to volunteer anything and is not going out of his way to regain your trust. It takes two to make it work. Something should have changed in his attitude but there doesn't seem to be much evidence of it from what you have said. One can only assume he doesn't seriously want to work on the marriage and is only doing enough to get by, which isn't very respectful to you I am afraid.

What do you think Clockwork?

Raymond

[clockwork orange]

Yes Raymond - both parties have to be willing to do what it takes. In the case of my H, he has taken on board what I felt I was missing out on and is doing what he can to meet that need. Also, possibly for the first time, there are no secrets between us. Complete honesty (constructive though) is essential.

Although I have to say, none of this would have been possible without both of us submitting to God's plan for us. Only once both of us had determined to proceed God's way rather than ours did we make any real progress.

Karen

[Raymond]

Thank you Clockwork. If it isn't too personal, what was it you were missing out on? Us men are ever willing to learn, or some of us are.

I know that God's plan is important. I certainly would not have survived without that as I didn't have a clue.

Raymond

[clockwork orange]

What was I missing out on? Still working through a lot of it tbh. Unconditional affection is one - if I want a cuddle it does not necessarily mean I want sex. Make time for me, listen to me. Another is someone to take charge - I'm tired of having to check everything is done financially and socially. Mental stimulation - spirited discussion on almost any subject if you like. Close female companionship undoubtedly. Unconditional acceptance of who I am (H has proved he does I'd say!!!)
Problem was, I fell for someone with what I believe to be a psychopathic personality (don't want to outright label her I'm not qualified) and found myself mesmerised, addicted and unable to make any decisions or even remember stuff. I ended up almost mirroring her - not pretty. It was the inconsistencies and lies that got me to wake up in the end.

I still have to learn to back off a bit and encourage my H to take charge of things more - he tends to be an introvert and quite passive and I fear I can be a bit roughshod at times. I believe that in His time God will honour our desire to change these things.

I will be writing down the story (keep putting it off cos it scares me) prayerfully, so I can see what things I have to deal with in myself (many) what I need to watch out for in future (so it doesn't happen again) and its there if it may benefit someone else.

Sorry, gone on a bit there and on someone elses thread too
Karen

[Raymond]

Thank you clockwork. I want to come back on this if I may. Having breakfast before work just now and I don't want to rush it.

Raymond

[Raymond]

Hi Clockwork. Unconditional affection is what love is all about. That's the cry of everyone's heart. To be loved for themselves faults and all. I know we have that from God but God wants it in marriage as well, as you know.Your husband was a bit like I was. I used to put my arms around my wife when it was time for sex and once she said “you only do that when you want sex”. It really affected me and I began to learn how to give affection physically at any time. I think her love language was touch and she was surely missing that. Things are a lot better on that front and I even preach it. My orphan upbringing didn't help.The bible does teach unconditional acceptance and love for our wives but not in those words. It has helped me enormously to realise seriously about loving my wife. You start off in faith then the fruit comes and it becomes a part of you.


I trust your husband will grow in leadership as you encourage him. I do the money here but sometimes the woman is more gifted at it and if a couple agree for the wife to do it it shouldn't be a problem. If it is a hassle for you maybe he should be doing it.


I think it's great for the women to get together. I am proud of my wife for holding her own amongst the women. I can see she needs it and in a way I benefit from it because it gives her purpose and fellowship.


You seem to have had a problem with this woman that has affected your marriage, so obviously it is a thing you have to watch. Many of us have a particular temptation that we have to watch. I know what mine is. Satan knows it and will try and capitalise on it certain situations. Usually when you are idle or resting. You probably entered into a kind of deception listening to this woman who probably got through where you were weakest. The scripture says believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God. The great thing is you got free and that your husband forgave you. You dealt with it very well making yourself vulnerable to him so that he could trust you again.
Sexual things are so important to keep only in the marriage and not outside it, although I know you only touched on it once. Even in a mental way one can stray if they are not careful.


Your story sounds like it will be very interesting and that one could learn a lot from your fall and rise to grace again. Thank you so much for sharing with me Clockwork. I found it really interesting.


Raymond

[clockwork orange]

You're welcome Raymond. I have learned a lot about myself, about my God, and about other people. Yes, I do struggle with SSA but am learning to be a child of God rather than any other "label". I'm getting involved with women's group stuff at church and learning to relax and not see every woman as a threat. Also nervous about new friendships for fear of it happening again - so am relying heavily on God for direction to the right people in His time. In a way the fact that I was so naive is encouraging - I haven't grown cynical!! Must take care I don't now!!

Doing the stuff that needs doing isn't really the issue - its lack of interest in what is happening/lack of support that tends to wind me up. But, by the grace of God, we will get there.

Main lessons? If I had been where I should have been with the Lord I would likely have run a mile when I realised I was attracted to her. So in a way she was the instrument of God's discipline in my life. Another has been (as you say) to test every spirit, and to flag up inconsistencies and lies when they happen. Learning to become real, walk the talk, be someone of integrity - then there is no ammunition for the devil to get hold of.

If one person comes closer to the Lord through my story, then it is worth telling. Save for the Cross and the grace of God I'd not be telling the tale.

Cheers
Karen

[Raymond]

I don't know what SAA is. The main thing is you are now aware of certain avenues and your confidence will grow as you keep right in these areas. I think you will have a lack of peace if you are in any danger again, but you are right to enjoy the legitimate relationships you have with the women in the church as that is all part of it. It is just with a certain type probably which are few and far between in most churches. I am sure you are going to be one of lifes success stories as you know in whom you put your trust. I think a lot is going to unfold for you in the months and years to come. In your marriage as well.

Raymond

[clockwork orange]

SSA = same sex attraction.

[Raymond]

Right. It was between the lines but I wasn't sure. I have my struggles as well but different.

That is not who you really are clockwork. We are both new creations but the lies of the past can try and convince us otherwise. Even things from our deepest childhood can be seeds planted by the enemy, but that is not our real identity. If we slip back into these things it's because we are believing the lie again. Before christ we couldn't do much about it but now we can work through to who we really are in God. Our flesh can be tempted and the feelings are real but it is still a lie. Deep down the seed of God is in us but it takes time to fully work through to our soul area (mind, will and emotions) so that not only will we have christ in us but we will become more like what he has designed and called us to be. I know this takes time but we are on that road and we don't have to fall.

Thank you for sharing with me Clockwork. I feel for your struggles. I know that it can be a powerful pull for some. I really pray that god blesses you in your marriage, yes including the bedroom, as that is important as well.

Raymond