Young and in trouble

[mebellus]

We are having problems lately. Finally, we had a discussion tonight and he put it succinctly when he said, "We are striving towards different goals. We are going in different directions."

How can we continue as a married couple in this situation? I am going to school to become a registered dietitian. He has started 4 companies and said outright that one of the only things he is interested in is money. I told him I feel like he doesn't put enough time into our relationship, and he said he thinks he puts up plenty of time. If he doesn't put up more time, (I'm paraphrasing him, here) it's because I'm always complaining or quizzing him etc, etc. Also, he says I don't help him with his businesses enough. I create all of his invoices/forms/etc in excel; I proofread and edit letters. I think he wants me to play secretary for him and send invoices, keep hours straight, etc. I'm not sure I want to help him any more than my Excel work. Do you think I should? Am I obligated?

The only things I complain about are A: Getting me a car B: Him acting like a respectful husband in this time of one-car-for-two-people and picking me up in a reasonable time frame (I have waited for up to FOUR hours) C: Not being a complete slob, e.g. not leaving food out on the living room end tables for the ants to come and find; putting dirty clothes in the laundry basket (because he wants a clean bedroom, as well as I, and I can't shadow him and pick up after him like his mother did), and not leaving a complete mess everywhere he goes *and then complaining about it's presence*, meaning I should pick up after him.

Are any of these complaints out of line? Do they sound like I'm nagging? Are there husbands out there who pick up after themselves and otherwise act in a responsible manner? Do you think it's at all out of line for me to want him to pick up after himself when my only current tasks are school (which is a full time thing in itself) and about 20 hours a week at work? I do the laundry; I do my best to pick up after him but my mom trained/raised me to believe that people can pick up after themselves (I keep thinking eventually he'll pick up that mess but it never happens and it turns into ME not having the will/ability to clean house); I try to cook when we have the money to buy real food and the sense of mind to go to the store and get some (and I buy, put up, cook, and clean up dinner).

*Note: We are in a state of one car for two people because he pawned my car to pay our rent and to support his business. Ok, fine. However, he moved us into a place with $1800/month rent. I would rather have moved out than lose my car.

Also, his brother is living with us. He likes living with his brother. Brother is in a band and does not work. Brother's girlfriend also lives with us. She is in the band too, and she does not work (although she seems to enjoy waiting on brother hand and foot and cleaning house all day long). The only way I am going to get out of this BIL situation is A: He strikes rich as a rockstar and moves out. B: I move out. How do I deal with this?

I realize this is all jumbled and disorganized, but I think our marriage is the same way and I really don't know what to do about it. I'm so confused.

[helenrw200]

mebellus

This is the 21st century ! No, you should not be following your H round and picking up after him, you are his wife, not his mother. I'm not saying housework should necessarily be a 50-50 thing, it very much depends on who has what available time. Your H is running 4 businesses, fair enough, he's a busy man, but you are in school full time, working and also helping out with his paperwork, why should you then spend what little free time you have cleaning up after him? This is unreasonable.

Having relatives live with you always puts a strain on any relationship, why are they living with you ? Are they contributing to the household expenses ? Being in a band is a hobby unless it brings in a decent income, is there a physical reason why neither your BIL or his g/f are not working ? If not I'd move them out pretty sharpish or draw up an expenses plan and tell them if they want to stay this what they are expected to contribute.

Living in such a high rent home when money is too tight for you to have your own car ( why did you allow him to pawn yours ? ) is not feasible and I think you need to take the bull by the horns and tell your H that . It sounds as if you have gotten into a position where he has been allowed to call all the shots and he now expects it to be that way, time to put your foot down and start making a few demands of your own !

Good luck !

Helen

[mebellus]

His brother moved in when his whole band decided to move to atlanta (GA, US) from 4 hours south of here. DH wanted his brother to live with us. There is no reason he can't work but working interferes with the band.

We no longer live in that $1800/month house, but I don't have the car anymore. When he pawned it, he didn't tell me that he did it and I had stupidly allowed him to put the thing in his name to save some tax money.

And yes, he has been able to call the shots for a good long while, mainly because he has made the bulk of the money for a long time, and now makes all the money with me in school. I really don't know how to change this, because he's such a bully. He wants things to go his way, do things his way and when I won't follow everything according to, he gets mad at me and tells me I'm not being supportive. I think the only way I'm going to get any say in anything is to finish school and find my job making real money (not retail sales girl money).

He doesn't have 4 businesses now, but he has incorporated 4. He has 2 at most right now, and he's always thinking up new ways to try to make money.

Also, the susie homemaker living with us is putting me in a bad light. She has time to sit around and clean up after everyone AND she makes pies and cookies. *eyesroll* Apparently, pastry is the way in my house.

[helenrw200]

mebellus

Your H may have been making more money than you but it does not give him the right to bully you and in my opinion marriage is a 50 50 deal, doesn't matter who earns what , money ... and chores.. are shared as best as possible.

I think the first thing to do is " persuade " bil and his wonderful g/f out of your home, to achieve this start asking for a regular amount toward board.

Next time your H gets mad at you, try getting mad back, I don't mean scream and shout necessarily but tell him in no uncertain terms you are NOT his mother, you are his wife and such demand some respect , unless he's ever been violent toward you in which case I would just leave now. Most bullies back down if stood up to and I'd start by demanding he get you a car to replace the one he pawned OR gives you a half share of his so you don't have to rely on him for lifts.

Don't worry about little miss homemaker, she's just playing at it, easy to do when you don't have the responsibility of actually paying for the house you live in..... you might want to mention to her that her skills might be far better used.....in paid employment !

If all else fails add a few senna pods to her cookie mix........ and let her clean up the resultant mess in the bathroom !!!!

Helen

[mebellus]

Unfortunately, I quite vocally say just about every day, "We need another car." He knows we need one yet always finds somewhere else more important to spend the money. And now, we have some sudden and quite unfortunate bills to pay that will take up all the extra money we might have had. And, I take issue with everything you are and I have said some of the things you suggest I say, he just doesn't ...care. Even if we talk and come to some agreement or he admits that I am right about something, he forgets a week or two later and we have to rehash the same things.

I mentioned to him last night about creating a plan (and he wants to, allegedly) in relation to where we are going, so we might find some goals in common and not be forced to divorce because we can't fathom each other's priorities. The latter is so odd to say because our personalities/likes/dislikes have so much in common; we are like 2 sides of the same coin.

Another major sticking point: He thinks that his tasks/priorities are more important than mine because he is the "breadwinner." He pays all the bills, etc. and I wouldn't be able to do anything if he weren't there unstably providing the financial backing. Now, I could damn well do fine if we weren't together, but I would have to live with my mother, as I have no real vocational/career skills other than secretarial or retail. How can I respond to this? I don't know what to say when he insinuates this, acts in this manner by disrespecting my time schedules/constraints, or outright says it.

He says that I need to change. I need to start cleaning more, start cooking more, start playing waitress more, blah blah. I need to stop complaining and start helping/supporting him more. :confused: I guess he thinks that by keeping us in a house and by sometimes having the money to buy real groceries instead of eating out all the time, he is doing everything he should be. He says he's doing all he can. ...I think he's isn't, or maybe his intentions are misplaced or his efforts are really not affecting anything due to poor planning and ill application. He may be doing all he can, but brother&girlfriend are creating a huge drain on the funds. He's not likely to kick him out at all, and I have no say in the matter.

I don't want to leave. We have fun together when things aren't so stressed. We make each other laugh. I like that he's ambitious, and he's thanked me for introducing some culture and new things into his life. Plus, my family is 1500 miles away so it would be a huge undertaking for me to move back home (and really, after 8 years cohabiting/in marriage I cannot move back in with mom).

:(

[Helen]

Your husband needs to grow up. Yes, he might be bringing home the bacon but this does not make him a man. It just means he is fortunate to be able to support the two of you. He should not be begrudging in that support. He should not think that just because he is providing the support, this a) gives him more rights anywhere; b) entitles him to be waited on hand and foot and c) gives him the right to decide how ALL the money is spent. It doesn't.

Your husband is not respecting you. When he treats you like this, he is saying unless you contribute equally, your opinion isn't worth a light. Your wants aren't worth anything. And you know something? Even when the study is over and you start earning well, I suspect he will STILL treat you like this. He will just keep going back to when he was 'supporting you'. This is his trump card, after all.

Your husband is a sexist, immature pig and I say he needs to grow up because his attitude smacks of how he THINKS men should be with their women. His whole demenour is 'shut up woman, you have no voice here. When you are earning you can speak'. He even took your car and got rid of it without your permission. Anywhere else, that would be theft. Since you are married, that is (I assume) communal property. He disposed of it because he thought it was his right to do this. Never mind that the car didn't belong to him... He needs to open his eyes and understand that attitudes and behaviours have moved on. You have a job. You study - that is your job. And studying is bloody hard work! You are doing this job for the benefit of BOTH of you in the long term. Not just yourself. If he was any kind of husband to you, he would be PROUD that you have this ambition to better yourself for the good of both of you. Yet all he seems to want to do is crush your self esteem and beat you down mentally.

Somehow you need to make your husband understand how you FEEL when he behaves like this. I would say things to him like 'when you do/say such and such, I feel this'. That way, you are getting your feelings out in a non-confrontational way. He needs to know how you feel. More importantly, he needs to understand that his attitude and treatment of you is having a detrimental effect on your self-esteem. If he truly loved you, he would never treat you the way he does. Yes, you might be two sides of the same coin but he is not treating you like you are. You don't even seem to be on the same page to me.

Last thing I would say is this. Just because you seem well matched, it doesn't mean you are. If you cannot reconcile your differences (because these are MAJOR differences), you may need to think about cutting him loose. No doubt if you do he will go on about how good he has been to you and how much he has done and how ungrateful you are. Maybe he is right about some of this (I doubt it). But what you need to tell him is you are tired of being trodden on by him. He never listened to you, he never respected your views and he treated you like an inconvenient drain on his resources who was there to pick up after him like some slave. Why would you want to stay and put up with that?

Hopefully you can sort this though.


Helen

[mebellus]

He does tell me he's proud of me; he told me today. He actually gives me a great deal of compliments. .......

However, when I want to talk about all these things, and tell him my feelings (and I use the words "I'm feeling stepped on and disrespected and unloved") he either doesn't want to talk about it -"We'll talk about it later" and never do- or we do talk about it and it turns into a criticizing fest. Or we talk about it and he concedes he's being an ass about issue A or B, but then he starts up again.

I think we need to see a marriage counselor. I think/hope/pray someone intermediating our conversations will make him see that his behavior is childish. Honestly, he told me he acts passive-agressive on purpose sometimes. He doesn't like anyone else to be in any position of authority around him. He wants to be top dog all the time. Unfortunately, I am a bossy independent person as well and we come to plenty of these crossroads where we butt heads over "who's in charge." He admits that a marriage is supposed to be a parnership, a team, but in action, in participation, he renegs on this.

[Helen]

He does tell me he's proud of me; he told me today. He actually gives me a great deal of compliments. .......

However, when I want to talk about all these things, and tell him my feelings (and I use the words "I'm feeling stepped on and disrespected and unloved") he either doesn't want to talk about it -"We'll talk about it later" and never do- or we do talk about it and it turns into a criticizing fest. Or we talk about it and he concedes he's being an ass about issue A or B, but then he starts up again.

I think we need to see a marriage counselor. I think/hope/pray someone intermediating our conversations will make him see that his behavior is childish. Honestly, he told me he acts passive-agressive on purpose sometimes. He doesn't like anyone else to be in any position of authority around him. He wants to be top dog all the time. Unfortunately, I am a bossy independent person as well and we come to plenty of these crossroads where we butt heads over "who's in charge." He admits that a marriage is supposed to be a parnership, a team, but in action, in participation, he renegs on this.I would tell your husband his compliments don't mean much in the face of his refusal to a) listen b) take action and c) stop repeating his offensive behaviour. If he were really sorry he would stop treating you the way he is and start treating you like an equal.

In terms of the way you broach things, saying you 'feel stepped on, disrespected and unloved' can feel accusatory to someone who is dominant by nature and constantly on the defensive. Try phrasing it differently -

'When you say [such and such], it make me feel like this'.

Do not elaborate beyond this unless asked to and, if asked to, demand there are some rules of engagement - i.e. you must be allowed to say what you want to say without anger and accusations. The minute your husband starts his tantrums/accusations, tell him that the conversation is over. That way, you are taking control.

In the meantime, I agree - counselling would probably benefit you. Your husband sounds like hard work and you need expert help to learn how to 'manage' him. My only other advice? Take him with you at first so that the counsellor can get to know him then go on your own to the same counsellor, so that you can learn some strategies to cope with him! :)


Helen

[mebellus]

Helen, thank you.

I really don't want to leave because he didn't used to be like this.

This started about a year, or a year and a half ago when the business started to pick up *for real* and people started calling him "Mr. Mebellus" and he got to order around everyone. I think it went to his head; he has trouble separating me from his employees, apparently.

Anyway, I'm going to hunt a good counselor; I think my health insurance would pay for it.