Your comments London

[London]

Hang on here. yes we all want happiness in our marriage, but I for one didn't promise on my wedding day for better or better, but for better or worse.

Red I'm not saying you must stay miserable because you promised to be faithful, but i don't believe that a married person should just leave or be unfaithful because their spouse is letting them down.

Yes Kate - instead of looking at Red's actual *issue* you supplicate her with the standard response of "too bad, you are stuck in a romanceless, sexless marriage becuase you did say 'for better or worse' !! " How is that going to help Red get past the actual issue?

Sometimes i really do wonder about the moderators on this board - for the most part the only advice they give out is based on Christian religious guilt rather than on human compassion or needs. And no, the two are not often in synch here.

[Kate]

Dear London

I totally disagree with your view that I am not engaging with Red's issue. I gave her a number of resources to help her, whereas you seem to be saying give up there is no hope!

Reminding people of their wedding vows is not such an unkind thing as you imply. I have some across countless people who are happily married who say that it was these self same vows that got them through a tough time in their marriage.

If Red doesn't want to make her marriage work then my words will have no effect but if she does underneath it all then they may just give her the hope to keep going.

You obviously don't like the views expressed by the moderators here and like to label us as those who dish out religious guilt with no compassion. Have you ever stopped to wonder why we run this site in the first place, why we give our time and sometimes weep (though you can’t see that) when we read the stories here.



London right now I feel really angry. you come here. you don't read what people really say, you jump to conclusions and then you trash us because we don't come from the same viewpoint as you. You may think that your bluntness, “telling it as it is” is compassion, but I don’t think so!


You are sad!


Kate

[London]

Kate - thanks for the isolated thread. I am sure this will be a great idea and great sense of judgement on your part. Need i remind you - where were you guys a few weeks ago when all hell broke loose here on the boards. Were you and the other mods cowering away behind your Bibles - or was the topic of threesomes too much for your puritanical view points? Instead you choose to isolate my comments to you directly?

London right now I feel really angry. you come here. you don't read what people really say, you jump to conclusions and then you trash us because we don't come from the same viewpoint as you.

You are right - I don't care for what you have to say becuase it's always the same thing no matter how different a poster's case is - it's always based on your religious guilt - there is never any other way for someone to resolve their matters. You stick with the "better or worse" scenario all the time. Well, sometimes the "worse" out weighs any reason to continue, yet you will still "force" the couple to remain. That is not humane - that is based on your guilt upraising. Try being impartial next time.


You may think that your bluntness, “telling it as it is” is compassion, but I don’t think so!

No one, including myself ever suggested that my "bluntness" is compassion. The two serve different purposes. Sometimes, telling it as it is is necessary - but obviously you don;t think that is necessary - yes, cover it up with compassion and let the person suffer even more.

You are sad!

And what's with the personal attack here? Where did I attack you in my post? Go on, find it for me. Exactly. It's not there. I wasn't lobbing a personal attack on YOU, rather on your posts.

Kate - grow up and experience the world outside your guilt based up-bringing - and please refrain from personal attacks next time. Have you perhaps considered giving up your mod seat? Clearly, you seem to have lost it. (Again, where were you a few weeks ago when the board could have used a moderator?).

[hoxton]

Kate
when I read the post you made to Red I took it personal that you was implying that I was out of order by giving my view, We are all entitled to our oppinions and as I said I agreed with London on the maybe you need to think about weather or not you want to be in this marraige but I dissagreed with the affair bit I dont think you should ever have an affair. Just makes a bad situation worce.

We are all entitled to our oppinion and I do think London is quite harsh or should I say blunt but it is still his oppinion,

We are all here to give our own oppinions and they will be different.
We should not attack eachother because we dont agree with others.

be happy

Amanda

[Kate]

Dear London

First of all I apologise for the comment "You are sad!" That was unnecessary.



You seem determined to misunderstand us and the way we choose to respond to postings here. I do not come from a guilt based upbringing - that is to totally misunderstand the Christian viewpoint which is about being freed from guilt. When you attack something that someone holds dear such as a belief that can come across as very personal.



Going on to the other points that you raise. There may be times when we are not on hand to moderate everything that happens. We are not hiding - we can't cover the board 24/7 and we don't post on every thread.



The reason I split you comment from the rest of the thread was because it was a distraction and there was a danger that this discussion we are having at present would have developed on that thread. That would be hijacking Red's thread with a disagreement between us two.



I know why I am here and why I am a moderator, but I don’t know why you come to the boards and what your motivation is to respond to people’s postings. Perhaps you have a deep concern for others and their well being or perhaps you think you have some good experience and wisdom to offer, or perhaps there is another reason...



Kate

[shadow]

Like we have said on here before, everyone has their own opionion their own beliefs, when we post we are telling them our own stories, our own beliefs, weather it be reliogion or not, it is up to the poster to look at all walks of life stories and opionions and see which one will work for them. Some posts they will look at and say good point never thought of that, some they will say I have felt that way too and understand what they are saying, some they will say hmmmm to much in brandy in their coffee this morning, and yes there will be some omg you got to be kidding!!!!

But they will decide what they will listen too and what they need to think about it. Some replies I agree with some I dont, and I am sure others feel the same about mine, but I just put out my story and give out something that I hope they will think about, things I have thougt about myself that helped me, and just hope that one of our replies will help them find the answer that is RIGHT FOR THEM!

[Kate]

Dear Amanda

Thank you for your posting and the points you make. It is ok to express your opinion here. Please continue to do so.

I was trying to put the other point of view that while happiness is important in life there are other things that in the end contribute to our longer term well being and that can include working through the difficult times. London was saying that Red staying in her marriage was destroying it and I was trying to point out that I disagreed with that and offer her some resources to help her work things out.

Kate

[Helen]

Going on to the other points that you raise. There may be times when we are not on hand to moderate everything that happens. We are not hiding - we can't cover the board 24/7 and we don't post on every thread.Kate,

I have cut in on my precious 'dial in' time to say, in London's defence, that I emailed the mods and the admin to let you know there was trouble on the board and I am sure I wasn't the only one. Yet it was a full 24 hours before any of you showed yourselves. Even then, the only post that attempted to get to grips (when the OP started again the following day) said 'And can we calm down here, too!'. There was no attempt to reprimand the person who instigated the insults. Or should I say the people. The person who originally directed all the hostility was swearing, shouting and made numerous personal attacks on a number of people in this community. Yet they got away with it, without even a slap on the wrist from you or the admin. That fills us all with confidence...

I do think London is a bit blunt at times but he is also right far more often than not. I also see his point about giving his post a separate thread. Yes, there is a point about distraction but one could ask why you don't do this in all cases? Or don't disagreements amongst members of the community warrant such action? Doing this just because he took issue with a mod or admin seems like an attempt to isolate London...

As for personal insults...


Helen

[Dave]

Dear All

Seems that it's a day for grumps!

Lets get a few things straight:

This is intended to be a board for adults, and we expect conversations and advice to be given in an adult way. If you don't like what someone is saying, simply say so politely, and then walk away. The flaming that took place here a few days ago is unacceptable - but it only continued because several of you variously joined in!
The objectives of 2-in-2-1 are to "shape, maintain enrich and repair marriages". The advice offered by Kate and the team is always towards that end. We do so because we have both the academic research to back the proposition that marriage works, and because we have personal experience to back this up with practical advice.
The site is deliberately non-religious, though we include areas for debate on faith issues. That said, I find remarks about "Christian guilt" as odd in the extreme, as any student of religions will tell you that uniquely Christianity is the one religion which removes guilt!
Kate has the full support of the team here, and dedicates herself tirelessly to providing thoughtful and caring input - advice that often goes much further than the "there there, do what makes you feel happy" that tends to come from many of the posters here. True deep and lasting happiness only comes from facing up to difficulties and working through them.
If you really don't like the approach of the moderators or the Admin then that's fine, you always have the alternative to find somewhere that more suits your personal tone and style. We have no wish to lose any of you, but do not intend either for the board to degenerate into one where discussion of the moderator's views replaces the provision of true caring advice to people who actually need it.

Now, let's get back to the real issues of helping those struggling in their marriages to re-build their lives.

Dave

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