I want to save my marriage

[vtec180]

Well where to begin, I suffer from low self-esteem, (SBD)sexual compulsive behaviour and this is because of being molested as a child, on various occasions cheated on my wife during our seven years of marriage.Well I finally got caught and my wife wants to take the kids and get a divorce. We are speaking through the pain and heartache I caused and for the time being living in the same house. I know I have a problem and have started therapy but don't wanna lose my wife. besides my infidelity we had a good marraige and we were happy.I know I destroyed all that but can't bear to lose them cause I do care for her and the kids. I know some ppl on the forum will stand in judgement of me and I want you to know I regret every minute of my unfaithfullness.But I'm here cause I need help? please tell me what I can do?? At this point in time the kids are unaware of what is about to happen and I want to prevent the divorce and start a reconciliation.

[zed_199]

vtec180... We all have our daemons and unfortunately some that we can't just throw away and be done with... you mentioned you are getting therapy. GREAT! but what kind of therapy?

If I were in your shoes I'd seek out a group call Sex-aholics annonimous (SA). I have a good friend who is involved in one of these groups, and it has done wonders for him. It may not cure the problem but it will screw up your reasoning for acting out.
They have websites, check them out!


You may have heard of it, but really give it a shot, it may not save your marriage, but it help you.

My friend is in the same boat, it didn't save his marriage. It has helped him cope with the abuse and other issues he has.

[vtec180]

zed thank you for the reply have just had an honesty session with my wife and ultimately she wants the divorce, we both still love each other this is certain. the children are still young 3+5 and are not aware of whats happening. I will do anything in my power to get my family back, will be staying in the house so can still be a father but not a husband. I feel so guilty for what i've done to my family and only now realize how much I love them and need them in my life.I intend to do whatever it takes to get my family back. and yes i have to re-evaluate my life but want to do it including my family. I would like to keep this updated to hopefully help some other person from making the biggest choice in their lives. Guys keep it zipped up. you don't know what you have till you lose it.

[HopelessNFLA]

I think that it's going to take a lot of hard work and it won't be easy. Cheating is worse than anything else. It's on it's own level of WRONG! But hey,we do make mistakes and if you are really willing to work through them than good for you. As far as your divorce goes. That's hard. There might not be anything you can do, she has to make that decision for herself on wether or not to stay. Did she catch you? Or did you tell her? That makes a difference too.

Betrayal is a hard thing to deal with. She's going to see you with that other woman everytime she looks at you. But, like i said, if you are serious about getting help and serious about loving her, you two should be able to work through it.

Good Luck,

[vtec180]

thanks once again for the reply, she caught me and at the time I was drunk and said some really hurtfull things.my W has started divorce proceedings today, I feel she is making an emotional decision and is not considering the full impact on her as well as our lives. I know she still loves me and I know this is an oppurtunity to build a bigger and better future for us and the kids. I have been unable to see a therapist as yet but have been to sex aholics website have to locate a office in s/africa though but the info does help. the only thing helping me deal with this is the fact that there are ppl out there who care and are willing to give of themselves to save others.I spent about an hour on the phone with life line today as well as speaking to extended family members about my problem this evening and I firmly believe that I am personally on a road to recovery. Since saturday night have not even looked at porn, which is a nightly routine for me. So yes the road is long and hard but will reach my destination sooner now that the journey has started. On the topic of my marriage I am going to remain positive and be the father and husband I know I can be. Have been asked to give my W space which I will do and will not put undue pressure on her.Just scared that space means we stop communicating. I curious though that this post has been viewed so many times yet only 2 ppl gave feedback. be it positive or negative please post ur opinions and feedback thank you all and GBU. p.s. went to dr and had a aids test in our 7 years of marriage only had sex with 3 other women. results were negative. please guys practice safe sex. I did and am glad.

[Helen]

If people are looking at your post and not commenting it is probably because they don't have anything to say to you that will help. Thankfully, commenting isn't compulsory in this forum and looking is optional!

You say you 'only had sex with 3 other woman' as though it is nothing. This is the thing that made me comment. How could you, someone who is supposed to be contrite, say something like that? 1 other woman would be 1 woman too many. To diminish it by saying 'only', especially if you say it to your wife and especially when you are talking in terms of multiple partners, must be fueling her rage like petrol on a flame. It is little wonder she wants a divorce.

I cannot help but feel that you are only panicking and taking action because you were caught. Your wife may feel that way too. All this talk of wanting to save your marriage and get therapy is coming a bit late in the day. If you had really wanted that, you would have got help for your problems long before they became an issue of this scale. I am sorry if all of this sounds harsh but you must have known you had issues long before your wife found you with this other woman. Yet you didn't love your wife and family enough to do anything about it until you were caught. The pity is, you have now hurt her and damaged your relationship - and badly.

If your wife had not caught you, you would still be sleeping around with no regard for her or your kids. You were not even using protection. How could you do that in a country with the HIV rates that South Africa has? How could you put her health, and yours, at risk in this way? Yes she may well be making emotional decisions but do not assume that the fact that she loves you will be enough to make her stay. Many of us know that sometimes, love isn't enough. There are other things that are equally important - like trust and fidelity and honesty and respect...and I would say she has an inkling (if you haven't told her) that this was not the first time you had played away from home.

Does she know the full story? About the SBD and the other women? And about the HIV tests?


Helen

[vtec180]

Hi Helen I apreciate your honesty and u raise valid points. Somethings that I have evaluated within the last few days, at first I thought is was panic mode and a reaction to the situation. I have come to realise the error of my ways and to deal with my demons day by day. yes if i had not been caught i would probably have remained the same but i have carried around this secret life and ordeal with me for over 25 years and have always subconsciously hidden this aspect of my life. I have made a decision to salvage what is left of my marriage and work on a future for my fam. I have also been totally honest with my wife although this gives her ammo for the divorce. I am going to win her and my kids back.

[Helen]

I have come to realise the error of my ways and to deal with my demons day by day.Something about this statement isn't quite chiming with me. They sound like the right words but they also sound strangely hollow. Do you have the faith (in yourself) to tackle your demons, I wonder? What happens if there are no therapists in South Africa? What happens then? Also, if you marry someone, have children with them and profess to love them, how come you could not see the error of your ways before that fateful day? Would it be more accurate to say you knew what you were doing was wrong but you were going to continue doing it so long as you weren't caught because doing that was easier than dealing with your pain? To say now that you realised the error of your ways does not gel with your actions, especially as you have a wife and kids that you say you love. If you loved them, how could you do it? Why weren't they enough to make you want to start getting over this before you touched woman number 1? yes if i had not been caught i would probably have remained the same but i have carried around this secret life and ordeal with me for over 25 years and have always subconsciously hidden this aspect of my life. I do tend to think trauma is used as an excuse sometimes. I was physically and sexually abused as a child. My dad was a drunk and beat me up every day. And a lodger in my house indecently assaulted me for 4 years, from age 9 - 13 (until I pulled a knife on him). Yet I didn't use that as an excuse to debase myself or my husband by sleeping around. Childhood trauma can make people inflict hurt upon themselves - I drank rather more than I would have liked for 3 years - but then I got therapy. I am not going to pretend that all the roses blossomed after this but it was certainly the beginning of a new me.

The point I am making here is 'You makes your choices' when it comes to dealing with these things. I don't know the extent of what happened to you so only you know how bad it was. But my view is this - blaming childhood and other experiences in your life for your actions as a grown up who has full control over his doings is an excuse. You can choose how you respond to these traumas. You can choose to sleep around or you can choose devote yourself to the family you adore. If you had told your wife about this she could have supported you through this. Why didn't you tell her? She is the one person in your life that you should have been able to confide in. It must cut her to the quick that you didn't and instead chose to sleep around to deal with your pain.

It sounds harsh but it does also sound like you are making excuses because you had decided you rather enjoyed having a wife at home as well as sleeping around when it suited you. The fact is, if she hadn't caught you, you would still be at it, seemingly without a care in the world... (yes, I know what you say about demons but surely there comes a point where the demons (and the guilt from your actions) cannot be slayed by sexual gratification...? And what about the guilt? Did you feel any?)

As a side comment, I wonder if you wanted to get caught?


Helen

[vtec180]

helen thank you for sharing this aspect of your life with me.I know the words are a cliche but the feelings and intentions r real. u say u drank too much well then c this as an addiction as well cause when I drink and lose my inhibitions I cannot control it. then the obsessive part starts coming to the fore and once that is out the compulsive part latches onto the first victim. as far as guilt and remorse is concerned I do feel guilty and have always felt guilty.this trauma to my family was caused by me, I take full responsibility. I do however feel that the kids need to be protected from this and I know my wife still loves me. This gives me hope!!!we didn't actually speak today and it hurts!! R all our interactions going to revolve around the kids only. Who are sensing the tension but we are still trying to be the normal family.I have made a commitment to myself to get better and to be a good father and husband and in no way am I defending my actions cause i know I was Wrong. Yes it is about choices and I made the wrong one's, now the choice lays with my W and she needs to decide on the way forward.The reason for my posts is to gain an understanding and to get help.

[Helen]

helen thank you for sharing this aspect of your life with me.I know the words are a cliche but the feelings and intentions r real. u say u drank too much well then c this as an addiction as well cause when I drink and lose my inhibitions I cannot control it. then the obsessive part starts coming to the fore and once that is out the compulsive part latches onto the first victim. as far as guilt and remorse is concerned I do feel guilty and have always felt guilty.this trauma to my family was caused by me, I take full responsibility. I do however feel that the kids need to be protected from this and I know my wife still loves me. This gives me hope!!!we didn't actually speak today and it hurts!! R all our interactions going to revolve around the kids only. Who are sensing the tension but we are still trying to be the normal family.I have made a commitment to myself to get better and to be a good father and husband and in no way am I defending my actions cause i know I was Wrong. Yes it is about choices and I made the wrong one's, now the choice lays with my W and she needs to decide on the way forward.The reason for my posts is to gain an understanding and to get help.So maybe one of the answers is to stop drinking? Drinking allows your demons to escape in a damaging way. If you stay sober, you do have a measure of control over when they (and the OCD tendancies) emerge. I know when I stopped drinking more than I wanted to, I felt so much better about myself. And I had sufficient control over my emotions and actions to get through some difficult therapy. When my marriage broke down, I took it up again (after laying off it for 12 years) but thankfully, I have stopped it again completely - of my own free will and on my own - because that is a road I have been down before and I am not interested in going there again...

Of course, you are right - the kids do need to be protected from this. But this may not mean that your wife decides to back off on the divorce action. Sometimes it is better to remove the kids from the source of the damaging behaviour entirely, even if that person agrees to change in order to move forward with a relationship. The problem is all the hurt feelings and I don't know if your wife will ever get over that. The kids are young now but they will not be young forever. And as they get older, certain tensions in your relationship with their mother may become more apparent, especially if she never gets over the hurt and stays with you for the sake of the children. I am sure your wife knows this, which may be why she is adamant about going.

So how do you fix it? I am not sure you can. Maybe persistance, and steadfastly demonstrating that you intend to change with action will persuade her over time that you are serious. But I think you are going to have to work for it - and there are no guarantees that all that effort will make any difference at all. For the moment, you are saying and doing all the right things and still, she is determined to go. If she does end up going, try to get her to do it as a managed separation rather than the all out assault of divorce. That way, she will have time away from you to think about what she really wants to do. There is information about managed separations in the 'Articles' area. And if you haven't asked her already, I would ask her what it would take to make her reconsider divorcing you? What would you have to do to rebuild things between you?

What reasons is she giving for leaving and wanting to divorce? I ask because I wonder if some of your words sound hollow to her too. Maybe she needs more reassurance in certain areas?

I have to go to bed now - I have a late morning meeting. But maybe we can pick this up again tomorrow?


Helen

[tan]

I've held off saying anything because to tell you the truth I'm shocked.

It is very difficult for me to understand. You are aware that you have SBD and have known for sometime yet you have waited seven years into your marriage and 3 affairs, and getting caught to actually do anything about it.

To be blunt, I believe you've done your dash with your wife.

Tan

[vtec180]

tan ur probably rite but I refuse to give in and give up on my marriage I will remain positive and I will save my marraige.....My wife feels she cannot deal with the pain and still remain married and I understand and know what I did to her. as far as hollow is concerned u can't see the tears in my eyes and feel the pain in my heart. u can't feel the pain... When I look at the only person who has ever stood by me and who has sacrificed so much for me and given me 2 beatifull children and to know what I have done to her and to us?yes I feel guilty and yes I want to make it rite but because I luv her and would do anything to have her in my life..I see her laying there and sometimes crying and I have this urge to hold her and just tell it will be ok but I can't cause I did it, I destroyed the best thing in my life.and tan if it was that easy to deal with issues like (OCB) would ppl have problems???yes I do note that not all the feedback i'm getting is positive but thank you just having someone listening helps alot.

[Helen]

I will remain positive and I will save my marraige.....Said with confidence but what happens if you can't? She may love you and you may be sorry but that does not mean you can glue all the pieces back together again - sorry.
...as far as hollow is concerned u can't see the tears in my eyes and feel the pain in my heart. u can't feel the pain... When I look at the only person who has ever stood by me and who has sacrificed so much for me and given me 2 beatifull children and to know what I have done to her and to us?yes I feel guilty and yes I want to make it rite but because I luv her and would do anything to have her in my life..You can summon up this depth of feeling now but it is still a mystery to me that you could not do it while you were sleeping around. Yes, you said you felt guilty but you didn't feel guilty enough to stop! I don't understand that....and tan if it was that easy to deal with issues like (OCB) would ppl have problems???yes I do note that not all the feedback i'm getting is positive but thank you just having someone listening helps alot.I don't think anyone is suggesting it is easy. But there are things you can do to minimise the impact and so far, you have not said whether you are going to do any of them. You talked about the role of alcohol in all of this. I have suggested that maybe you need to stop drinking alcohol. You have not responded to this suggestion to say yes, you think you should (after all, you only do these things when you drink). So my guess is the demons will continue to be unleased and alcohol, the relaxing of inhibitions and OCD will continue to be used as excuses...?

In addition, you need to think about the situations that enable you to give into your impulses and remove yourself from them so that the demons are less likely to occur. These are things you can do for yourself, without help from a therapist. You haven't said you are doing anything though, apart from admitting you have the problem, being remorseful, begging for forgiveness and looking for a therapist. I asked earlier, supposing you can't find a therapist, what then? The question still stands...

[poppy]

Demons? Demons? The only demon you need to control mate is the one in your trousers. It amazes me how people deliberately do things for gratification in the full knowledge of the possible consequences and the terrible pain and hardship they will inflict on the people they 'love' and yet still go ahead and do it and then plead some imagined 'addiction' as an excuse. As had already been pointed out you could easily have infected your wife with HIV. How can you expect her to forgive you and carry on. Why should she? You have totally betrayed her and would almost have certainly continued to do so if you hadn't been 'caught'.

[vtec180]

Helen and poppy u r rite to be hard on me and I deserve it.I have however removed all alcohol from our house have stopped goin out to prevent myself from being exposed to Questionable situations and have started getting help for my condition. My first therapist appointment is tomorrow at three.the purpose of this thread is not to justify my actions as u assume but to help me save my marriage. We have been talking when the kids r not around which is a good thing however my W is very adamant about the divorce, Yet she says she can't offer me anything in the lines of hope or a chance but she can only offer me a sexual relationship???????confused!!!!!!!! me totally. I said I would rather she went with me to marriage counselling, she flatly refused saying she is not ready?we had as it was referred to ~no strings attached sex~ yet when making love she opened up even more to me??? is it to give me false hope is it to fullfill her need,for feeling loved and attractive?afterwards we planned to go watch a movie,drove to the mall in silence, had a meal instead, she ate me no appetite.came straight back home as she's not feeling well and now she's sleeping on my daughters bed?????

[Helen]

Helen and poppy u r rite to be hard on me and I deserve it.I have however removed all alcohol from our house have stopped goin out to prevent myself from being exposed to Questionable situations and have started getting help for my condition. My first therapist appointment is tomorrow at three.the purpose of this thread is not to justify my actions as u assume but to help me save my marriage. We have been talking when the kids r not around which is a good thing however my W is very adamant about the divorce, Yet she says she can't offer me anything in the lines of hope or a chance but she can only offer me a sexual relationship???????confused!!!!!!!! me totally. I said I would rather she went with me to marriage counselling, she flatly refused saying she is not ready?we had as it was referred to ~no strings attached sex~ yet when making love she opened up even more to me??? is it to give me false hope is it to fullfill her need,for feeling loved and attractive?afterwards we planned to go watch a movie,drove to the mall in silence, had a meal instead, she ate me no appetite.came straight back home as she's not feeling well and now she's sleeping on my daughters bed?????Do you think I am giving you a hard time? Do you think you are being asked to justify your actions? I admit to not understanding how you can declare love now when it was clearly absent in the past. It had to be absent because you could never have acted in the way you did if it was as prominent as it is now.

So...good move on removing the alcohol from your home but are you going to avoid going out for the rest of your life? Will you be covering coping strategies in your counselling sessions?

Re your wife - maybe she wants to make you feel as used and confused as she has felt since she found out about your behaviour? You did things with no regard for her, her feelings, your kids for years. At least 7 years. Part of this might be about revenge - making you feel bad too. Part of it is no doubt about safety. She has needs and you are as good as anyone else to satisfy them and you have had HIV tests. And part of it is about love. She loves you and she hates you for what you have done to her and the family. At the moment, the hatred is winning - although she still desires you physically. That may change depending on how you handle her over the next few weeks or months. I would therefore say to you, be careful how much pressure you subject her to.

If she doesn't want marriage counselling, you cannot do or say anything to force her to go. You can talk about it, but chances are, at this early stage, you will drive her even further away if you keep hammering on about it. I can understand why she isn't ready. The pain is too fresh, too raw and she doesn't want to share it with anyone. At the moment, she is very clear about what she does and doesn't want. If she goes to counselling, she might see things a different way and maybe she wants to get to that conclusion (if it happens) under her own steam. Maybe at the moment, she doesn't want to get to that point at all. Try to give her the time and space to determine if and when she wants to join you in your counselling sessions.

I don't know if I can say any more than that.


Helen

[vtec180]

Thank you so much helen I had a chat with my FIL today and he referred her to his lawyer but also feels the decision is hasty, she went to the dr and to a friend this evening. Still not home yet, the kids r ok sleeping now.I feel kinda stupid as if i'm making this all about me and not considering what i have done to her and her feelings. I am going to be the father and husband i should be, I just hope and pray it's not too late! A question though why is it we mostly find time to pray in times of turmoil? Turned off religion when my brother died 5 years ago and yet i find myself praying daily now? am i going mad?there is so much i need to clarify for myself to get better and am glad I got a appointment for tomorrow.I feel as if i'm being selfish and not helping her deal with the pain I caused, I so much want to be there for her but she won't let me and I deserve the rejection. I will give her space and I will remain in the background sort of like a silent support structure. I believe when she is ready she will come to me.

[vtec180]

well folks on my way to first therapist appointment.wife lashed out at me today and I could just sit there accepting the pain I had caused her. she feels the marraige is over and rightfully so BUT I WILL NOT GIVE UP HOPE!!!!but i also need to fix myself first before I can fix my marriage I just hope it's not too late.

[Liz]

I hope that your first trip to the therapist has gone well - it is bound to be painful and difficult along the way. Whatever happens with your wife, do continue with it if you can for your own healing. You may find some resources here (http://www.2-in-2-1.co.uk/marriageclinic/cyberaffair/) to help too. The Focus on the Family web site is a good one. As you say the best step towards rebuilding your marriage is to sort your issues out.

You also mention that you have started to pray and wonder why so often we don't pray until life gets difficult. I'm sure that'sjust part of our nature - we think we've got life under control until a tough time hits us and we realise that we haven't. Fortunately God knows that and he is always willing to listen - why not check this (http://www.2-in-2-1.co.uk/tips/hope.html) out.

Liz :)

[vtec180]

well folks the first session was an assessment but there was value in the outcome and a clearer understanding of myself. A real eye opener if ever there was one. Have still been talking and doing a lot of listening to my W and at some stage in our marriage we both sort of backed away from each other.This is however not the reason for my choices and subconsciously I think I pushed her away.We have still been having a sexual relationship and have talked more in this past week than we have in the last 2 years.One thing for sure is that we both still love each other.That is the good part, the bad part is that the therapist is referring me to a sexoligist and I'm afraid of what might be uncovered??? but most importantly my wife is still going ahead with the divorce to gain her independence and I so much fear what that will do to us as a family? I will always be there for ash and dean aswell as their mom, but will do anything rite now to prevent putting them through this. She has asked me not to stand in her way and not to fight her on this cause it is something she needs to do. How can I stand by and let her just walk out of my life. Yes I made bad choices and destroyed my family But I admit my faults and am sorting out my issues to be a better father and a better husband.I'm trying so hard to be strong for her and to be the supportive husband when inside i wanna scream don't do this to us!!The heartbeaking part is that she didn't and I did! I need to live with the pain I caused her for the rest of my life.I realize now why I married her and why I love her!!!!! But is it too little too late.I asked her to go out to nite with her friends to cheer her up and get her mind off things for a while, I think she is feeling confused, hurt,angry,guilty,embarrased,humiliated and a host of other things and I would do anything to bear that pain for her.I took another bold step today and cleared out my cupboards and u know what I found a lot of dark colours, the same as my mood over the past years.How could I be a positive influence on my children when I am a negative influence on myself????? Where will all this lead I don't know, I have examined the possibility of me wanting her to stay simply to remain in my comfort zone. This is not the reason. My comfort zone has been taken away and I have spent sleepless nights gathering my thoughts and examining my feelings. Y could I not have realized sooner that if I had been open about my prolbem we would have worked through it together..........................PPL BE HONEST WITH UR BETTER HALF AND STAY TRUE TO URSELF!!!!

[vtec180]

Well folks yesterday was a bad day as it was exactly a week since being caught, my W was feeling down and told the kids, I was busy outside the house and came in to both my kids crying and my wife in a foul mood.I didn't handle the situation well, We had discussed preparing the kids for this and not blurting it out.So we had some harsh words and after a while I apologised. I think it was more that both of us were emotionally exhausted.we sort of just stayed out of each others way for the rest of the night.Today however was a good day, we got up early got the kids done and went for a drive and took the kids swimming, they really enjoyed that and so did I. My W was a bit distant at first but gradually joined in.At some point during the day I actually hated her, thinking she's only doing this to show me what I destroyed. But that was only my own insecurities coming out again.we made love tonite or as it's called ~no strings attached sex~ and at first she wouldn't kiss me and then later she kissed me so passionately it hurt. this tells me there is hope for us, that she is trying to break our bond but that her heart overpowers her mind.I have asked her what it would take for her to reconsider the divorce and the reply was that it is something she needs to do.So i will continue to give her space and remain in the background.It's been a week now, no alcohol, no porn, and no affairs.BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY it's been a week of being a real dad and a real husband. yes the issues are still there but I am dealling with it hour by hour and each hour seems to be a new eye opener.I HAVE LEARNT MORE IN THE PAST WEEK THAN I HAVE IN MY LIFE AND MY ONLY HOPE IS THAT IT'S NOT A LESSON LEARNT TO LATE!!! I HAVE ALSO STARTED PRAYING MORE OFTEN AND STARTED SPEAKING TO MY KIDS ABOUT JESUS OR RATHER TELLING THEM STORIES, THIS IS A ASPECT OF OUR LIVES I HAVE NEGLECTED FOR TO LONG.I KNOW WHAT I AM DOING MAY NOT SAVE MY MARRIAGE BUT I CANNOT SIMPLY GIVE UP AND WITH GOD'S HELP I WILL ENDURE ANY SUFFERING THAT COMES MY WAY. GOOD NYTE AND GOD BLESS..........

[vtec180]

I've been thinking a lot today and especially this evening and wondering y am i putting my thoughts and feelings down on this forum for all to see.Firstly cause I need help?. secondly as a pre-warning to others to value what they have in their families and not take them for granted.I chatted to a street vendor today, an elderly gentleman. He had lost his wife after 55 years of marriage and he said to me "don't wait till it's to late, when my wife died I cried for weeks cause I never told her how I felt about her". this from a man unaware of my situation and who doesn't know me at all.how am I feeling this evening? disheartened yet still focussed and determined.Disheartened cause I tried to talk to my wife this evening and she said that she noted the change in me but it's to little to late, she has to do what she has to do! and then she completely shut down to me.I called her on numerous occasions today and not 1 time did she call me back or email me back.the taker in her is strongly at work and I'm not sure how to bring her back from the withdrawal. If only she would fight with me or something, but the feeling is that ur just there!

Maybe it's still to soon maybe she needs more space as I am aware that I am now a constant reminder of the pain I caused her.She said this evening it was unfair of me to ask her to make that sacrifice of giving us a chance and working through it together.but what do i do just let my W get the divorce and put the kids through the agony it's gonna cause.yes I know I caused it I am not shifting the blame, I will live with that knowledge forever and if anything with god's help will prevent me from ever following that route again. As far as my relationship with god is concerned we have been talking and i've been listening alot, god is everywhere and no matter where i go he's in my presence. Got into a train today and listened to his word, went to work and received emails about him, went home and there he was again reassuring me that I am not alone and that he sent his son to die for my sins.

Maybe it's the fear of losing my family that has brought me closer to god cause he was always there but I kept the door closed so he couldn't come in.The scary part about my current situation is that I am now more in love with my wife than even before as well as being more attracted to her. is it the relief from the burden of the last 25 years or is it the guilt? I do know this much that I have earnestly prayed about the situation among other things and in time god will show me the way!good nyte and god bless

[Liz]

Dear Vtec180

It's ok to come here and open up your heart - I'm sure above all you need somewhere to go where you can be listened to.

I'm sure it's hard not to press your wife to stay, but I suspect there is a way of ensuring that she knows you want her to stay without pressing her and mentioning it too frequently. You are sorry for what you have done and you are determined to change. Keep on down that path with God's help, but remember that you can't expect your wife to stay just because you have changed, she must make that decision for her self.

Make sure that you aren't just changing to keep her there but that you are changing because you have had a change of heart and know that you must choose the right path from now on whatever the consequences.

Have you asked your wife for forgiveness for the way you have hurt her? I don't mean simply saying your sorry, but humbling yourself to ask for her forgiveness. She may not be able to do that straight away, but it is still right to ask her and then wait patiently.

Hang on to the knowledge that you are not alone, because the Lord won't abandon you and take one moemnt of life at a time.

Liz :)

[vtec180]

well good ppl another knock today, My wife mails me at work to tell me she has contacted an estate agent to value the house and to get rid of our dog. I responded with asking for forgiveness and aknowledging my responsibility for what happened to us, I also asked her to reconsider the divorce and highlighted my commitment to her and the kids.I would ultimately love to renew my wedding vows as a reaffirmation of my commitment to us.she has still not responded and I don't think she will? what was I thinking as this only adds more pressure on her, but what must I do. Last nite I was dreaming and could picture the 2 of us being old together, Am I clinging to false hope? yet this morning she did give me a small Hug and rite now any sign is a good sign. I sometimes wonder whether the marriage was over long before I did any wrong and then realize the marriage is over cause I did wrong.I love my kids and I love my wife but at this point in time only GOD has the answers. I cannot just leave things this way, I need all of them in my life but I cannot remove the pain I caused......So will continue on in an uncertain state not sure what to do yet committed to achieving my goals.

[vtec180]

she is now threatening to kick me out of the house if i don't stop hassling her. she is never gonna forgive me.I have lost all hope now!!! but I love her so much it hurts!!! I made bad Choices and it has cost me my family. the question is not can i go one after this but do i want to!I did manage to draw her into a fight which takes her out of the withdrawal state but now what? cause now she is more determined than ever to divorce me?Do I now fight her on everything about the divorce to stay married or do I just let go? I love her and my kids so much and don't know what to do.I am so confused, y won't she at least come with me to counselling?Does she hate me that much?

[Desperate]

Vtec, I truly feel for you. I know exactly how you must be hurting...although my circumstances are different, the hurt is the same.

I'm also looking for answers to my problem, so may not be the best person to give advice at all. Anyway, have you considered giving her some space? I don't necessarily mean a trial separation, but perhaps you getting away for a few weeks...maybe that time away might make her realise that you are an important part of her life, and of your families, despite what has happened? Perhaps then, when you return, you could calmly and collectively "suggest" in such a way that the idea becomes hers now...that marriage counseling may be a good idea?

I've read up loads on the internet and all the specialists who write books on this stuff tell you NOT TO DO the things that, as humans, we try to do to save our marriages. Things like telling your partner you love them, that you have or will change etc... apparently, this sort of thing never works. http://www.stopyourdivorce.com/125.htm provides an idea of what I'm trying to get at.

[vtec180]

Thank you for the support desperate I really needed that and the link is rite, I saw that last nite to bad the book is so expensive as rite now don't have cash for jack. Read my message under ur thread it says alot about how we react.I have decided to back off completely and to stay out of her way, it won't be easy but will do it. I am also job hunting in other areas so as to give myself a new start. I am still slaying my demons day by day and am finding it hard but with god's help will endure.I Love her and my kids but do not see any future for us rite now. I first need to sort out myself. and cannot do that in a comfort zone. So she can have everything I will soon pack my bags and start my quest to grow, maybe this is a good thing and maybe once again I was trying to hide in a comfort zone. AAAAGGGHHHH my mind is in so many places at the moment but my heart is in one place only but how do you fight a losing battle!!!!!!

[AlwaysGreen]

Vtec.
Hello. I just read your email, "The Carrot, The Egg & The Coffee Bean" It was an amazing little read. In the oddest way, I think it has the ability to bring a lot of help.
You ended your reply to Desperate with a wonderful little piece about Tears and Smiles. Whatever anyones is going through be it great or hard, this piece can only make sense. Thank you for sharing it.
And good luck with everything.

[vtec180]

Thank you alwaysgreen.You guys don't realize how much it helps having sum 1 listening to you.Well W is out tonite cause she's not working tomorrow, kids are sleeping and i'm sitting here alone with my mind!!! Have an interview tomorrow so need to stay focussed.had my kids crying this evening when my w left my 3yr old said 'mommy's going and daddy is also gonna go away'. how do I hold my family together? Maybe i'm trying to hard? didn't say 2 words to her tonite cause she needs space and the ~no strings attached sex~ is also over. I really believe she hates me now, and I deserve it.But how do i make it rite? I do love her but is it all too late? the therapy is helping for the SBD cause haven't been out or to a porn site since this started.but it's hard.....Will c what happens when she gets home???After last nite have resolved to remain in the background. maybe i need to move out for a while, absence makes the heart grow fonder they say.well if i get the job i'm gone ne way cause it's 1500km away, would that give her enuff space???????????????

[tan]

Absence may make the heart grow fonder but it also allows her to get use to not having you around, get use to the idea of living without you. Tread carefully

[vtec180]

well interview went ok let's just hope and see, came home to find an estate agent who wants to sell the house for us, I have not agreed to anything? so do I fight this and cause a bigger gap between us or do I give in cause it's what she wants. it's been 2 weeks and i'm waiting to be served with papers, house must go on the market to cover our debts.Am i supposed to just walk away or fight for us! Is it a fight I can do alone?I can already c the changes in the kids and am scared as to what is gonna happen to them.She still has that expectation that I will still do for my kids as I have been doing everything? Even after the divorce no matter where they or I stay, is this realistic?I take my kids to day care and pick them up, i bath them and feed them and I am closer to them. where will this leave them when I am removed from the picture...Now the work is sending her to the uk for a week and I will look after my kids, like when she went travelling overseas for a month.I am so confused rite now and she has said to sum 1 she needs to do this now before she gives in but is this realistic? does she realize the impact of what the divorce will do to us and the kids and that is besides the cost of it all?I so much want to work on this marriage but am constantly running into a brick wall and yet at times there is just a slight hint of a crack....Will she ever be able to love me again I do not know. I now question if she ever loved me cause it seems so easy for her to end it all?? I always thought we were happy even with the issues I had...and I guess I was wrong???.I am not going to sell the house until I have 2 and will not agree to the divorce I will fight it to the end.But will fight even harder to win back my wife and save my family. I cannot just give up hope for us as I am the only one who has hope at the moment I have to remain strong and steadfast in my beliefs and pray about my situation. Guys please say a prayer for us during this time I so badly want to save this marriage and protect my wife cause I really do love her.

[Helen]

well interview went ok let's just hope and see, came home to find an estate agent who wants to sell the house for us, I have not agreed to anything? so do I fight this and cause a bigger gap between us or do I give in cause it's what she wants. it's been 2 weeks and i'm waiting to be served with papers, house must go on the market to cover our debts.Am i supposed to just walk away or fight for us! Is it a fight I can do alone?I can already c the changes in the kids and am scared as to what is gonna happen to them.She still has that expectation that I will still do for my kids as I have been doing everything? Even after the divorce no matter where they or I stay, is this realistic?I take my kids to day care and pick them up, i bath them and feed them and I am closer to them. where will this leave them when I am removed from the picture...Now the work is sending her to the uk for a week and I will look after my kids, like when she went travelling overseas for a month.I am so confused rite now and she has said to sum 1 she needs to do this now before she gives in but is this realistic? does she realize the impact of what the divorce will do to us and the kids and that is besides the cost of it all?I so much want to work on this marriage but am constantly running into a brick wall and yet at times there is just a slight hint of a crack....Will she ever be able to love me again I do not know. I now question if she ever loved me cause it seems so easy for her to end it all?? I always thought we were happy even with the issues I had...and I guess I was wrong???.I am not going to sell the house until I have 2 and will not agree to the divorce I will fight it to the end.But will fight even harder to win back my wife and save my family. I cannot just give up hope for us as I am the only one who has hope at the moment I have to remain strong and steadfast in my beliefs and pray about my situation. Guys please say a prayer for us during this time I so badly want to save this marriage and protect my wife cause I really do love her.I am speechless. I find it amazing that you are questioning your wife's love for you because she is apparently finding it 'so easy to end it all'. How about questioning your own love for her and the kids? After all, you apparently found it easy enough to put them out of your mind to go with other women and you are only remorseful because you got caught! I doubt whether you understand the enormity of what you have done to her because if you did, you would not be sitting there asking this question. Whatever love she had for you, you have destroyed. YOU have. You slept around without using condoms and risked exposing her to goodness knows how many infections. When you were caught in the act that last time, you said some incredibly mean things to her. It is easy to blame all that on drink and 'demons' but I tend to think alcohol relaxes inhibitions, allowing the real truth to surface. I doubt you said anything you didn't mean. Drink just made it easier to say it all. And citing your demons is an excuse. Most of us have demons, some of us more scary than others but they exist. But not all of us will do the things you did. Instead of sitting there, wallowing and questioning your wife's love for you (which I am sure is non-existent now) you need to ask yourself WHY you put so much at risk (or didn't see what you were risking) when you were caught up. Perhaps you should talk about this with your therapist?

It is up to you what you do about the house but yes, if you fight her, there is a risk that you will increase any bad feeling she is feeling towards you even more. Only you can decide whether to fight for 'you' but one fact that most of us here have learned - your marriage cannot be saved if only one of you is fighting for it. And it sounds to me as though your wife isn't willing to fight - at least, for the moment. You can also try to stop the divorce but if she is divorcing you on the grounds of adultery or unreasonable behaviour (both of which she could do, based on your confessions) you would not have a leg to stand on legally. She could just divorce you.

Regarding the kids - I suspect your wife wants you to continue to play a strong role in their lives. Whether that means bathing them in the morning and taking them to day care is part of the detail for the two of you to work out. Certainly, I would guess it means if she needs to work abroad, she would expect you, their dad, to take care of them.

Sorry if this seems harsh. I just don't understand why you are so confused when you have, in effect, dropped a nuclear bomb on your family, who are now struggling in the aftermath. I suspect I too would behave like your wife. Maybe worse, because I chucked my own husband out 2 days after finding out about his affair and subsequently divorced him. He went along with it because I asked the court to make him and his other woman pay my costs and the Judge found in my favour. He didn't want to divorce either but sometimes, there really is no other way forward. I am not saying your wife is right to divorce you - only time will tell if that is the case. But she is doing what feels right to her and for her sanity.

The ultimate cost of all of this is up to you. Just be aware that if you fight the divorce or anything else, chances are she will hate you more. You may decide it is worth that risk to save your marriage but also be aware - you may alienate her further and still end up divorced.

My prayers are with your wife and your children. I pray that your wife is making the right decisions for her and for the kids sakes.


Helen

[vtec180]

helen this is so true!!!and i know the impact of what i have done cause I live it everyday?? BUT WHAT MUST I DO TO MAKE IT RITE!!!I still love her and don't wanna lose my kids.. she left for work at 8am to start at 10am its now 10pm and she's still not home yet. i know where she is and it's fine but what about the kids who have been asking for her all day?I don't know, is saving the marriage more important to me than it is to her?There are so many ramifications to a divorce and implications to the kids!!!And I am going on with my therapy and I am praying every minute. I am finding it hard to control myself but am managing. I have not spoken to anybody but those concerned and she is going for coffee to discuss us with every1 but me. How will we resolve our issues when it's not a open topic. It took me 25 years to come clean and I am relieved and see the positive in life now. I just wish I could share it with her????????

[Helen]

helen this is so true!!!and i know the impact of what i have done cause I live it everyday?? BUT WHAT MUST I DO TO MAKE IT RITE!!!I still love her and don't wanna lose my kids.. she left for work at 8am to start at 10am its now 10pm and she's still not home yet. i know where she is and it's fine but what about the kids who have been asking for her all day?I don't know, is saving the marriage more important to me than it is to her?There are so many ramifications to a divorce and implications to the kids!!!And I am going on with my therapy and I am praying every minute. I am finding it hard to control myself but am managing. I have not spoken to anybody but those concerned and she is going for coffee to discuss us with every1 but me. How will we resolve our issues when it's not a open topic. It took me 25 years to come clean and I am relieved and see the positive in life now. I just wish I could share it with her????????What of the kids? They are with their father! They are okay - aren't they? Only I pick up a hint of disapproval, almost as though you are saying your wife prefers to be with other people rather than her kids. Your wife is out and her kids are asking for her... So you, their father, need to take care of them until she returns. I have no doubt she will be back. Very few women will abandon their children entirely.

Once again, you are asking, begging for answers that no one can give. What must you do to make it right? It may be nothing you can do will make this right. I have said it many, many times before. It may well be that this is too much for your wife to deal with and she will never come to terms with it. Many would say 'why should she?'. It is not about the marriage being more important to you than it is (or was) to her. One could argue that it ALWAYS was more important to her which is why she stayed faithful. Now it sounds a bit hypocritical to hear you talking about how important 'your' marriage is, given that you had 3 affairs while married to your adoring, faithful wife.

I repeat - I honestly don't know if saving the marriage is more important to you than her. What I would say though is fidelity, honesty and all those things that go with a soulmate were far more important to her than they were to you. And you wrecked it. Saving a marriage when there is no trust, no honesty, no fidelity is pointless. You said you are 'struggling to control yourself'. What woman in her right mind would want to go back to that? To put her faith in a man who is struggling to control himself, even as his marriage is going down the pan? I wouldn't.

NOW you want to share problems and issues with her? Several posts ago I asked why you didn't tell your wife you had these problems at the outset? Falling on your knees now is too little, too late. You are the cause of her anguish. Even looking at you will cut her like a knife. She doesn't want to see or speak to you at the moment and you have to give her that space to talk to her friends. At the moment she is getting support elsewhere and you have to let her do that. If you divorce you will not lose your kids. You just will not have access to them in the same way as you do now. But that is one of the prices you pay for infidelity. As for you...you are going to have to rely on your therapist. Your wife owes you nothing. You, on the other hand, owe her so much I cannot even begin to quantify it. BUT you have to give her space and time to get to grips with this. After all, it has only been two weeks...

This Hell you are in, this limbo, will go on for a lot longer before things begin to look up, if ever. Sorry.


Helen

[vtec180]

helen thank you, once again the truth and it does hurt. you have helped me see the light! I am going to assist the divorce as I have caused enuff pain to her and to the kids. I am going to be there for my kids and if she decides she still wants me well so be it.I need to take responsibilty for my choices even though it means losing everything I hold dear.Too little too late!!y did i not realize my errors earlier?I have started on a journey of self exploration which i need to complete inorder to fix myself.Once that is done maybe i can win her back, but in the current situation fighting to save the marriage is hopeless, the trust and love has already been destroyed by me and nothing i say or do can fix that!she's still not home yet and it's almost 1am so will chat to her after church in the morning.this will be my last post on this site so to all who have assisted and offered moral support thank you and god bless and to those who will read this thread I wish you all the joy in the world and happy marriages. There is nothing that cannot be spoken about or where mutual agreement can't be reached you only have to understand the other person's point of view..

[Helen]

I think you should continue to post, if only to get things off your chest while your wife is keeping herself distant. I don't know if you will ever be able to put this right which is why I say things with a dose of reality. I base my comments on how I would feel if I were in your wife's shoes but I am not your wife. Only time will tell how things will turn out.

In the meantime, I would continue with the therapy and the prayers. Support your wife with the kids. If you are genuinely unhappy about selling the house, say so. But broach it as a 'step back for a while before committing' thing. After all, you do not want her to make a mistake. And it was suggested earlier, if necessary, think about offering your wife a managed separation, where you move out and leave her in the marital home (instead of selling up). Maybe distance for a short while will give her space to think things through and act less hastily.

Good luck, whatever you decide.


Helen