going crazy

[jasminebose]

Hi all,

Still need answers and nothing forthcoming. After our argument (see previous post) we haven't talked, except to argue. I am feeling really hopeless and just so tired. I don't understand how things can go down hill so fast. We've only been married a year and a half. Here's a summary for those of you who need it:
Moved to England last year from Scotland where have been all my life (friends, family all there) to be with husband here (new job). Since I've been here I've become more needy and want more time with him but have also been nagging him more. He spends a lot of time trying to build his career and lately has taken to watching porn on the internet. He says he is sick of my nagging and to be honest so am I! But we have been fighting a lot too about stupid small things and neither of us wants to back down. Everytime we fight I feel half terrified about it ending and half relieved that at least then it would be over. My parents divorced when I was 7 and my knowledge about what a normal marriage is is limited... ie. how much time we spend together, how much we do for each other, how much compromise is necessary and how much fighting there normally is. I'm just totally lost, without support, we can't talk without getting angry with each other and I need a friend! Any volunteers??!!
JZ

[Kate]

Hi Jasmineboys

I see you posted yesterday after an argument and you sound pretty sore and hurting and also lonely. You must miss your family and friends and then when your home doesn't seem a place where you can feel safe and loved it must be really tough.

Are there things that you can do to meet your emotional needs other than through our husband? Do you work? Can you make friends there? Do you have any hobbies or interests that could make you some new friends locally?

Arguments don't have to be win/lose situations. You can argue constructively. Why not have a look at some of the articles here (http://www.2-in-2-1.co.uk/healthclub/relbasictopic/)? If you feel trapped in a spiral of arguing and hurting each other, then you can break that by choosing to act differently. Don't act on or nurse your angry feelings. Let the small things go - do they really matter in the wider picture? It's so easy in a marriage to read big things into little ones.

He never picks his clothes up off the bedroom floor, so he can't care about me. If he loved me he'd know that hurt me.

Starting out together in marriage (http://www.2-in-2-1.co.uk/healthclub/healthearly/) isn't easy. You're taking two individuals and moulding them together in a partnership on all sorts of levels. What works for one couple may not work for another. Some people are introverts and need space to recharge their batteries. Others are extroverts and unwind by being sociable. Some folk need lots of reassurance they are loved by being told so, others need quality time together or gifts or caring actions or a cuddle. Part of the fun of the first few years is finding out what works for you, but it can also be scary.


kate
:)

[jasminebose]

Hi Kate,
Thanks for the reply. I am going to be starting a new job in about a month and think that will help to keep my brain focused on things other than my marriage. I have a few friends here and interests that could make me new ones. But I've lost motivation. I know this won't last forever though!
More than anything I want my husband to spend time with me and for us not to hurt each other. I see that I'm pushing him away by trying to control his behaviour and nagging him so I am going to try and control myself instead! I read in one of the articles that there is no such thing as incompatibility, do you think that is true? I have been struggling with that, wondering if we are just too different to get along (he is Indian, I am Scottish, he is traditional in some of his views and I am more open minded, he is tidy and I am not, etc...)
Thanks again,
JZ

[Noddy]

Kate

Any advice for me...you may remember my thread Confused and Hurt. I'm separated after only 4 months of marriage. Currently living with my mother. Been separated 2 months now and the last contact I had with my husband was over a month ago in which I told him that whilst I've wanted to save the marriage I realise it's impossible for him and to get the ball rolling on the separation agreement and return the rest of my belongings. He said he would try and get things sorted out in a reasonable time. It's been a month and haven't received the rest of my belongings as yet..I don't need them immediately anyway but I thought since they've been down at the marital home for 2 months now, I might have received them...there isn't alot of stuff at all...as I took all my clothes. I don't want this at all..I want my marriage but for a man that says he doesn't feel in love with me anymore, he's sick of all the arguing and bickering and that we can't make each other happy how we want and that I can never make him happy..and feels he's made a mistake, we're incompatible and he's independant and wants to be on his own to do the house rennovations! (I've never stopped him)! .it all seems hopeless. I tried at the beginning of the separation to send a letter of how I felt etc and where I think the disallusionment is with, we have tough demanding jobs, have had no time together since back from honeymoon and huge house rennovation going on which he's building with his dad. He's shattered all the time, irritable, gets headaches and complains of tightness of the chest etc...when I do show any concern and say you must try and rest or you'll burn out soon...he'll just say stop nagging. This infuriates me and when we do have an argument and there has only been two heated one's and a bit of bickering...we lock horns. I'm not sure if he's diallusioned or what or stressed out, he's a police officer and been doing extra shifts, often not sleeping after his night shifts etc...Anyway at the beginning of the separation I've tried keeping the door open but I feel he's completely shut the door on our marriage and just wants out. So all I can do is leave him alone which is what I have been doing. Our priest that married us sent a letter to us both of his concern and hoped that we'd get together to work out was interfering in our marriage etc. My husband hasn't responded and neither have I..that letter was 2 weeks ago. I've backed off completely because I think that is what he wants. Surprisingly I did get a call from our sister-in-law, the first contact in 2 months I've had from any of his family, she wanted to know how I was coping with things, how I was getting on etc and to give her a call anytime I needed to chat. I haven't called back as yet as I don't know what to say and I know whatever I do say will get back to my husband. I just can't bear any more rejection but just so hopeless right now.

[Kate]

Dear Noddy,

I think I last wrote to you on 18th May, but it seems that little has happened for you since then.

I wonder if your husband may be having second thoughts – perhaps he was surprised when you said yes, go ahead and start proceedings for separation. But if he’s so busy and stressed, perhaps even that is just too much pressure for him right now. The way you describe him, it sounds as if he’s barely holding his life together and doesn’t have any sprae energy to cope with his relationship with you.

I would have thought it might be worth you going and talking to your priest even if your husband won't - it could be a help and comfort to you. I'm also not sure why you don't want to talk to your sister in law. You don't have to say anything you don't want to get back to your husband, but she too may be able to give you some support.

Is there any reason why you haven’t gone yourself to fetch the rest of your things, or would you rather leave them there as a reminder to him and a challenge to him to take some responsibility for the situation?

I wonder what do you really want? Do you want to be with your man? Do you want to fight for him? Are you really committed to him and determined to love him come what may? Or are you struggling with the idea that this man has treated you badly and it’s not fair?

Reading your posts, I don’t hear much warmth towards him coming through. I know you’ve been hurt and that may be what is coming over strongly in what you write. I don’t want to cause you offence, but I wonder if you’ve really looked at your heart in this and know what you want. If you could sort that out, you might find it easier to find a way forward.

Wishing you the best in all this

Kate

[November]

Dear Noddy

I tend to agree with Kate - you shd look into your heart and ask yourself if you really love this so called man - maybe it is just the shock of being left after such a short time of marriage (my husband left me after 5 months of marriage) - maybe it is just that you feel hurt.

I agree with Kate - you shd contact your priest to get some emotional support - i disagree about contacting his family - you shd start disorienting yourself from them - it would be easier for you if you don't hear about him.

I do believe that any contact with him will just get your hopes high - aren't you tired of the ups and downs? just let him come to you - don't pursue him - he knows what you want!

Cheer up woman life has a lot to offer you!!!!!

Iris

[Noddy]

Thanks ladies for your advice. Yes I want to fight for my man but yes I too feel terribly hurt and let down inside. I've said for him to go ahead with the separatio agreement because he made his intentions clear to me 2 months ago that it was over. Why hold on or slow down a process if this is what he wants, although it's not what I want. I can't fight him on that. I've been down twice to collect my clothes etc, it was a very painful experience for me and I'm also busy travelling over the country on business, he offered to bring the rest of my things to me...but I'm still waiting for them, even though I prompted him to again a month ago. Yes I suppose part of me is wanting to keep my things down there as a 'reminder' perhaps and yes I do believe he could help me with this breakup, even if it's to do a friendly gesture like return my belongings to me.

It's too painful to speak to his family right now.

I have backed off and have not pursued at all...but it's so very hard when nothing is coming back...I need to get a grip and accept it's over, but I guess I won't be able to accept that until the separation agreement comes through.

[Noddy]

Iris

I do appreciate your point about looking in to my hurt and really finding out whether I love this man or I'm just so hurt to be left like this only after 4 short months. Of course I love this man, I wouldn't have married him. Are you both suggesting that I'm an idiot to want to try and get my marriage on track and be with this man again? Not sure I fully understand what you're saying to me here??

[Claire]

Hi Noddy,

I don't think you are an idiot but if you appear to be doing just fine on your own then won't that ease any pangs of guilt he may feel about leaving you and make him think that if you're doing so well maybe you don't want/need/love him after all, he'll think he really has made the right move whether he regrets it or not. I really do think he's mixed up, depressed and stressed from all that you've said is going on with him and I think maybe it'd help him if he could see exactly how you do feel. I know he made the desision to leave, but if he wasn't truely in his right mind then it wasn't an informed desision and if you stay completely out of his life how is he to know that you aren't having a whale of a time without him...especially if he is depressed, he would be thinking you're better off without him anyway. I don't know what is happening in his life or yours but I don't see how either of you can get over your problems if you don't see each other. It's awfully hard to see the one who'd treated you so badly, believe me, everytime I see Andy when he takes the girls out it kills me and I would much rather he was out of my life but right now I am playing it cool and trying not to show the hurt and it does seem to be working...I don't know how he's feeling but he gave me a kiss goodbye when he left yesterday and said he'd stay later on Thursday and I know that it is far less painful for me to behave in a more dignified (for want of a better word) way. To show the hurt means I cry, I say unkind and bitter things and it stays with me for hours. To show a strength and seem cheerful and chatty actually makes me feel cheerful and although I am sad when he leaves it dosn't seem so bad. Iris will say I should let him come to me and back right off, well that dosn't work with the kids which I know isn't an issue with you but I do think if he sees you and knows that you still are missing him and would rather be with him then it'll give him a chance to realise that he may have made a mistake and it's the only way for you to get your marriage back...how can you get it back by staying away from it? I know it wasn't you that left, but you are the one with the clear, strong mind I think, so starting to put it right may be down to you if that really is what you want.

[Kate]

Dear Noddy,

Just wanted to come straight back and say, No, I'm not suggesting you're foolish to want to get your man back. Far from it. I would support you all the way if you wanted that. It's just that there seemed a lack of warmth towards him in some of your postings and I was just challenging you to think about whether that was because you were hurt or because you didn't really want to go on.

Why not go and talk to someone like your priest. He knows you both and will be able to help you see a different perspective on things.

As you say it's really hard when the other person completely ignores you and the situation. When it happens to me in other situations, it really gets under my skin. I feel angry, but also very insecure. It seems as if I'm invisible and of little worth. I want to shout and say, hey, I matter too. I've got feelings.

His behaviour is rather irresponsible too, so there may come a point where you need to see your husband again to talk some more. If he won't make the first move, then you may have to.

Hang on in there

Kate

PS I obviously typed this while Claire was posting. She makes some good points.

[Noddy]

Thanks to you both Kate and Claire

Yes I'm terribly hurt inside, but I still love my husband. It's just that I'm so frightened that if I asked to talk in an effort to find out and resolve what is interfering in our marriage, I'll get another rebuttal. Also I really do think the letter from the priest, was lovely, it wasn't blaming at all and I figured that if my husband did want a way back in, he might take the initiative and contact me about it. I can only assume that he doesn't want to as he hasn't responded to the letter or made any inroads for us to talk or discuss. I've merely not contacted him as I thought he may be better off having some time out to reflect on things and perhaps consider the letter, plus I'm scared of getting rejected again. I know I sound like an awful coward but...I just can't help it right now. The letter from the priest did start off with 'my' anxieties about our marriage, so my husband should understand from that, that I still want my marriage to work?? Shouldn't he?

I realise not much warmth has come through on my threads, it's not that I don't feel it, but I feel like my heart has been ripped out and so shockingly, without much of a discussion other than 2 notes from my husband. I'm just hurting so badly that I don't want anymore hurt right now...until I'm ready to move on and let go..which is going to be quite some time. I'm back at work and see friends occasionally, but most of the time I just want to be on my own and come to terms with all that has happened...I don't want to give up my marriage I really don't, but I feel my husband has.

[Claire]

Noddy,

Could his sister be making the inroads on his behalf....sorry if I'm remembering it wrong but you didn't actually talk to her did you? It was a message she left. I don't want to get your hopes up at all but maybe he's thinking the same as you..."Well she didn't reply to the priests letter and my sister tried to talk to her but she didn't want to know". You haven't had any contact in so long he may well think you've had enough and that you've moved on, he may see your willingness to go with the seperation agreement as proof of that. I know the fear of rejection is huge and I only put myself through it time and time again because I feel I owe it to the girls to at least try and get their parents back together, but I think even without them I would feel I'd want to try....I think I would owe it to myself to explore every option before I gave up. I may well be totally wrong about your husband, maybe his is having the time of his life and dosn't regret his desision to leave you at all but if there is a single chance that that isn't the case then I think I would use having things still at his house as a good excuse to call round and check the situation out. Don't try and "talk" this first time...he'll probably go on the defensive anyway and that won't help....you know him better than anyone, try and gauge what is going on in his life and make a few desisions based on that...not what happened 2 months ago which may well not even be relevant now. Be strong Noddy, there's no doubt it'll be painful but you can't make an omlette without breaking a few eggs :)

[Noddy]

Thank you Claire for your sound advice once again. My sister in law called the day my husband went to our friends wedding...she left a message asking how I was, how I was coping with things and how I'm getting on and to give her call anytime if I need to talk. I haven't called her back yet, but did leave a text message saying that it was nice to hear from her and that I would call her soon when I feel a bit better, I said I had a nasty throat infection but will call her when I'm better. I was surprised to receive a call and not wanting to glean too much from it, I'm a bit confused...I'll call her when I'm ready, perhaps in a few days.

How are you doing?

[Noddy]

Claire...also I'm living with my mother at the moment and she feels that really given what he's done, it should be for him to initiate any contact if there is a reconciliation on the horizon. I know it's my marriage, but I can't help thinking perhaps she's right...just dunno

[Claire]

I'm afraid I don't agree with your mum. I really think that you can sit on your bum for years waiting for something to happen and it won't, but if you get up off you bum and do something yourself then there's a fair chance that something will happen. How do you know that he isn't sitting there stubbornly waiting for you to come and ask for his forgiveness. How do you know anything if you keep yourself in this limbo waiting for him to do something? You can wait a while longer, give him time to think about the priests letter and about what he's done but the longer you stay away the more he can convince himself that either you've moved on without him and that by going back he'll risk you rejecting him or that it dosn't matter what he did because you're letting him carry on with life without having to deal with it or with your hurt and anger.....it depends on whether he made an informed desision or not. I don't know what he's thinking or feeling but then neither do you and you never will if you don't go and find out sooner or later. I really do understand your fear Noddy really and at the end of the day what you do isn't down to me, your mum or even your husband, it is solely down to you and what you think is best for you.....good luck with whatever you deside.

I'm fine by the way....looking forward to going to Spain with my kids and some friends in a couple of weeks, haven't really had room in my head to look forward to anything recently but in the last couple of days the kids excitement has become infectious :)

[Noddy]

I'll have a think about it for another 2 weeks or so...that would be 6 weeks about telling him to get the ball rolling on the separation agreement. When I told him this, I did say also, that whilst I've wanted to save our marriage, I realise for him it's impossible so if he'd go ahead and get the ball rolling with the separation agreement. He responded, he'd try and get things sorted in a reasonable amount of time. Well, I do believe 6 weeks is a reasonable amount of time to get my stuff back and the separation agreement initiated???

[Claire]

and yet he still hasn't done it....I'd say that's that single chance I was talking about. There's no hurry though, in your own time Noddy, but if you don't find out you'll probably always wonder.

[Noddy]

Cheers Claire...have a good week...you've given me food for thought.

[Claire]

that'd be that omlette then :)

[bongbong]

when we've been traumatised by an unexpected event, we all tend to do irrational things... so please don't be too harsh on yourself...

[Noddy]

Hello Bong Bong - what do you reckon with my situation...I feel safer sitting on the fence i.e. not doing anything, but them I'm still in limbo land!

[bongbong]

well, i'll be honest and please don't try to burn me if you find it offensive!

i would agree with claire that you should go and talk to him. i understand that you have fear and pride and it's not very nice to be rejected and hurt all the time, i am scared too. the outcome may be unpleasant if you do take the first move and talk to him but at least you will have a better idea and it can help you plan the next move for yourself or -selves. i don't know what your husband is thinking and neither do you so if you are sick of being in the limbo land then get up and talk to him and do it for yourself but no one else - i think you are stuck but time doesn't wait for anyone.

tough though!!!

we are not forcing you to do anything, take some time and think about what you would rather want -- be stuck or move on. :)

thanks for your reply about my situation. it's really nice to know that 'i'm not the only one facing this mental meltdown!' pheeeeeeeeeeew! hehe... no offence though.

take care all.

[Noddy]

Thanks Bong Bong...I think I'll wait another 2 weeks and see if I hear from him, surely 6 weeks is enough time to get a separation agreement underway and to get my belongings to me....?? I'll sit on the fence a while later. The thing is, because he's made no moves to contact me at all other than respond to my text message over a month or so ago....I'm assuming he's either go on with his life and erased me or he's still considering things and is not ready. Surely if a man wants to contact you, no matter how difficult, it can still be done by a little gesture of either sending a text message or email asking how you are...but perhaps he's decided not to contact me because he fears I might get my hopes up and he really has closed the door...that is my dilemma.

[bongbong]

hmm, i've a feeling (correct me if i am wrong, noddy) that you believe that men should be the first person to apologise etc when something goes wrong in a relationship simply because they are men and should act like a 'gentleman'? i hope i am making sense.

personally, i think pride is not important in maintaining a functional relationship as it may bring joy when you have 'won' or 'proved right' but the joy is short lived and resentment and humiliation may have a longer negative impact on the whole. is it worth letting the relationship die simply because of pride?

men are not necessarily 'braver' than women; they may appear tough (as required by theie role in the society) but often they are scared and shaking inside.

yeah maybe he feels this and maybe he feels that... you won't know for sure if he doesn't tell you.

well maybe he just doesn't know either but you can't even be sure about that unless it comes out of his own mouth.

[Noddy]

Hi BongBong

I'm not sure it is a 'pride' thing with me...but 'fear' really which I'm struggling to face head on right now. I really do believe he's moved on and the rest of my belongings and the separation agreement I imagine he will get around to when he can be bothered. I'm only reading into the delay with things because I want to save my marriage and clutching on to straws of hope.

Whilst I was encouraged by a call from his sister-in-law, I think it was just a call out of concern that was all.